Keir Starmer

[randomer]

to say......More decency, credibility and humanity in his little finger than in the whole of the Government put together.

' found him and his brief speech to have some authenticity.'

It is funny how we all see different things. He'd just got his hands on the SAGE recommendations so despite his shadow sec only just banging on about the disaster of a national lockdown Starmer excitedly called a press conference and proudly recommended it, making himself and Ashworth look stupid. Nothing authentic about that.

No if Labour had supported May's Brexit deal we would have least have had a deal. Wrote to my Labour MP 3 times begging him to support it but the Labour party were too stubborn, thinking they could get a better deal when they won the election - what a joke. Surely if the ERG despised that deal it can't have been so bad.
Anyway reap what you sow and all that, shame they had to fuck us all over to do it.

I REALLY wanted to like him but I just cant, it seems like whatever BoJo does he will argue the opposite (which to a degree he should, his job to play devils advocate) but at the moment he just wants to make a name for himself.

He is slimey, it's a shame, I had high Hope's!

It is funny how we all see different things

Isn't it just...

@Bubblesbubblesmybubbles

I REALLY wanted to like him but I just cant, it seems like whatever BoJo does he will argue the opposite (which to a degree he should, his job to play devils advocate) but at the moment he just wants to make a name for himself.

He is slimey, it's a shame, I had high Hope's!

So give some examples then.

Where he has argued for the opposite.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

' found him and his brief speech to have some authenticity.'

It is funny how we all see different things. He'd just got his hands on the SAGE recommendations so despite his shadow sec only just banging on about the disaster of a national lockdown Starmer excitedly called a press conference and proudly recommended it, making himself and Ashworth look stupid. Nothing authentic about that.

This is exactly what I meant about people quoting odd lines out of context, If you watch the Ashworth clip he says we don't want a lockdown that lasts 'weeks and weeks and weeks'. One of the aims of the 'circuit breaker' is to prevent just that. Because you can bet that if the R continues to rise, as well as hospital admissions and deaths, there will be a lockdown. And the later it comes the longer it is likely to last. I just really wish people would pay attention.

This is exactly what I meant about people quoting odd lines out of context

This

@Bubblesbubblesmybubbles

I REALLY wanted to like him but I just cant, it seems like whatever BoJo does he will argue the opposite (which to a degree he should, his job to play devils advocate) but at the moment he just wants to make a name for himself.

He is slimey, it's a shame, I had high Hope's!

But that's just not true. Where are the examples? Did he oppose the March lockdown? No. Did he oppose reopening the economy in the summer? No - he did talk about the need for measures like t & t to be in place, but he didn't 'call for the opposite'. Did he oppose schools reopening? No (to many Labour supporters dismay..), but, again, he pointed out the barriers and called for them to be removed.

I mean have you ever read his direct words or watched an interview or some footage from parliament? Because what you're saying is just not true.

Sorry when one of his MPs is getting death threats and is in fear of her life and he doesn’t want to know he loses any semblance of credibility.

'So give some examples then. Where he has argued for the opposite.'

Supported the rule of 6 then didn't

Ashworth wailed about the disaster of a national lockdown then Starmer held a press conference (I'm still cringing for the grandiose arse) demanding one.

'One of the aims of the 'circuit breaker' is to prevent just that'

Surely a local targeted approach is better than a blanket one. Liverpool with 600 cases per 100000 as opposed to rural places with hardly any. We'll end up with a lockdown anyway because people just cannot or will not follow the instructions

He criticises everything gov does yet Labour ran Wales does exactly the same! I'm all for scrutiny and challenges but this isn't that. Labour Council leaders in the North don't want local restrictions but want national lockdown even though it will mean the same thing for them.

I also wanted to like him. I'm not a loyal tory, sadly with Corbyn there hasn't been anyone else worth voting for but nope, Starmer is just using the crisis to score points. He is using the public fear as a little convenient lever in an attempt to get support. Awful man.

@LindainLockdown

No if Labour had supported May's Brexit deal we would have least have had a deal. Wrote to my Labour MP 3 times begging him to support it but the Labour party were too stubborn, thinking they could get a better deal when they won the election - what a joke. Surely if the ERG despised that deal it can't have been so bad. Anyway reap what you sow and all that, shame they had to fuck us all over to do it.

It's an absolute travesty and utterly ridiculous to lay the blame for Brexit at Labour's door. This was a rightwing project from the very beginning and was blocked in parliament by members of the ERG - as far as I recall, had Labour backed the deal the it would still not have passed because of them. And then Johnson's deal did pass but it turned out that he didn't really want it anyway. Do not be fooled into thinking that this (no deal/ridiculously minimal deal) wasn't the plan all along because it absolutely was.

Labour didn't deal with Brexit well (Corbyn failed to make the case for remain because he didn't want to...) but it's a Tory policy being enacted by a Tory government and to claim otherwise is to let those ideologues off the hook, and why would you want to do that?

@looseddaughter

I wonder how many 'opposite' things can be found?

As you said, he has supported many of the proposals but has pointed out that things need to be put in place - such as an effective track and trace, support for people who self isolate, effective scheme post furlough.

GetOff Can you not see the difference between what Ashworth has warned against and what Starmer has called for? Details matter.

Everything you say is an approximation of the truth: Labour broadly supports the rule of 6 and is not 'against' it - they're just not convinced it's the answer, but that's not the same as opposing it; Wales is a devolved administration and Starmer isn't responsible for what goes on there; he doesn't criticise everything the government does (he points out flaws, but he doesn't oppose everything. He has to point out flaws - there are a lot of them and it would be irresponsible not to); Labour mayors are mainly against shutting cities down without financial support. Starmer has been clear about the need for financial support to be in place before any lockdown.

Saying he's using it to score points is just nonsense. He's had a lot of flack from his own side for broadly supporting the policies. He could have done a lot more point-scoring, and you could argue that not doing that has been point-scoring in itself because he's playing a long game, but you didn't argue that, you said he'd opposed things to score points and that's just not true!

@VaggieMight

Completely agree, but the bar is pretty low. I'd have more faith in the first week contestants on The Apprentice being more competent than the current cabinet.

@VaggieMight I’m unashamedly stealing this patter and going to use this! 😂😂😂

It's an absolute travesty and utterly ridiculous to lay the blame for Brexit at Labour's door. This was a rightwing project from the very beginning and was blocked in parliament by members of the ERG - as far as I recall, had Labour backed the deal the it would still not have passed because of them

Absolutely.
Utterly ridiculous to blame Labour for the shit show that is Brexit! This was a right wing initiative through and through - driven by Farage and Johnson when he saw his chance to become PM because of it. In fact the only policy Johnson stood on was ‘let’s get Brexit done’. He had, and still has not, shown any other direction for the country beyond that!

Anyone with a standard level of intelligence and a brief understanding of his/upbringing would know he could wipe the floor with career politicians like Boris and his mates

So why doesn’t he?

YANBU to think the government has no credibility, decency or humanity.

YABVFU to think Starmer (or Sturgeon, or whoever the fuck runs the Lib Dems today) is any better.

Tbh I don’t think I have even seen him say anything about anything.

Certainly would struggle to pick him out of a line up.
The person who described him as a “grey man” I think in terms of memorability for me he most certainly is forgettable.

I might have seen him or heard him but just can’t remember.

I disagree. He said he would support the gov, they made a decision, he turns round and says he would have locked down for 2 weeks. Integrity no, point scoring yes. I'm not a tory voter btw

looseddaughter Wed 14-Oct-20 14:22:10
GetOff Can you not see the difference between what Ashworth has warned against and what Starmer has called for? Details matter.

Everything you say is an approximation of the truth: Labour broadly supports the rule of 6 and is not 'against' it - they're just not convinced it's the answer, but that's not the same as opposing it; Wales is a devolved administration and Starmer isn't responsible for what goes on there; he doesn't criticise everything the government does (he points out flaws, but he doesn't oppose everything. He has to point out flaws - there are a lot of them and it would be irresponsible not to); Labour mayors are mainly against shutting cities down without financial support. Starmer has been clear about the need for financial support to be in place before any lockdown.

Saying he's using it to score points is just nonsense. He's had a lot of flack from his own side for broadly supporting the policies. He could have done a lot more point-scoring, and you could argue that not doing that has been point-scoring in itself because he's playing a long game, but you didn't argue that, you said he'd opposed things to score points and that's just not true!

Exactly This

So once he has offered support he has to stick to that no matter what? The Sage minutes were released on Monday night. Should he have ignored them out of blind loyalty to a government he's not a part of?

Sorry, that was @IwishIwasyoda

He may be intelligent but somehow not quite smart enough to know what a woman is (hint: adult human female) or to give a shit about women's sex based rights. So no, not a fan (I say this as a lifetime left-wing votor).

@IwishIwasyoda

I disagree. He said he would support the gov, they made a decision, he turns round and says he would have locked down for 2 weeks. Integrity no, point scoring yes. I'm not a tory voter btw

What because when subsequently supplied with the current 'science' he says that Labour would have followed it not disregarded it like the Government?

I'd be more worried if he thought what Johnson and co are doing should go without dissent!