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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

The cremation where the sons were forced away from their mother

108 replies

fancyginglass · 11/10/2020 12:37

You have probably seen the clip where the father has died and the mother is sitting on her own sobbing. Her two sons pull their chairs nearer her to comfort her and are told off. I'm sorry but this is barbaric. If that was my mother I couldn't leave her sobbing on her own - especially as there is no way the boys hadn't been in her house or comforted her - in fact they had been living with her for 2 1/2 weeks. I know they are trying to keep cases down but if you can't comfort someone who is bereaved what is the point?

OP posts:
imfatletsparty · 11/10/2020 13:43

My grandmother died in April at at her funeral we were only allowed 8 people and had to sit in twos, one on each side of the pew. It felt very unnatural.

AndreaTwo · 11/10/2020 13:43

The situation could and should have been avoided.
I attended a funeral a few weeks ago and the funeral director had consulted the family in advance and liaised with crematorium arranged the seating so that immediate family members could sit together.
The rest of us sat in chairs arranged either singly or in pairs.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 13:45

@WaxOnFeckOff

This funeral home offered the same thing. They asked the family to tell.them the groupings. The family didn't respond so it was all single seats. When the men moved them during the service, the staff member jumped in because they'll have had it drummed into them that rules must be followed or there will be job losses. All the family had to do was let them know the household groupings.

Premiumbond · 11/10/2020 13:47

@thenightsky
Yes in the UK, Wigan. It’s been reported in the National news.

oakleaffy · 11/10/2020 13:48

It is appalling.
The sons and their Mum were clearly mixing beforehand.

So jobsworth of that worker.

We attended FIL's funeral, there was social distancing.

Covid rules seem so arbitrary.

Original poster
fancyginglass · 11/10/2020 13:50

Warsawa31 I had this exact conversation about this the other day. No one is thinking for themselves any more. I especially feel sorry for the younger generation who are missing out on a whole chunk of life when they should be enjoying themselves they are confined to their houses. Surely people are going to rebel against this? It's no longer a life, it's just an existence and I say this as someone who is working full time and has a full household - I can only imagine how devestating it would be if I lived on my own.

OP posts:
36pregnant · 11/10/2020 13:50

Stop being slaves to the system.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 13:52

@oakleaffy

And again; he family were asked how the seats should he set out to accommodate household groupings. They did not respond.

The government have been very very clear with funeral homes. If they dont follow the rules, then they will be fined and closed soo job losses and a ruined business.

The family did not respond, they were given single seats as the assumption was there were no group households. The brothers moved the chairs so they worker, who really wont want to lose his job because of someone else's actions, reacted.

Was he over zealous? Maybe. But it was easily avoided by the family responded to the request beforehand.

Purpledaisychain · 11/10/2020 13:53

They were all in the same bubble. Therefore they should have been allowed to sit together in the first place.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 13:56

@Purpledaisychain

Read any of my previous comments.

The funeral home asked the family what the seat groupings should be to allow bubbles to sit together. The family did not respond. The funeral home MUST follow guidelines or they'll be shut. Job losses of innocent people doing nothing wrong.
As far as those workers knew, none of those people were in a bubble because the family did not answer the request. If they dont enforce the rules, they lose their jobs.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 13:58

I'm so fed up of seeing businesses and workers being attacked online and thrown under the bus for just doing their jobs and following the rules they need to stick to in order to keep their jobs.

The family didn't organise it properly. That is their own fault. It is sad, it was a horrible thing to watch when they video started going round but, at the end of the day, they were asked and they didnt answer so it's their fault it wasnt arranged

Hiddenmnetter · 11/10/2020 13:59

I don't know about the rest of you but I now feel as if we are living in a dictatorship and rules are being passed at the whim of our so called leaders. Most people I know have completely stuck to the rules but I am beginning to question them and the fact that our basic rights and freedom are being taken away from us.

Well given as we now have a situation where ministers can make a decision that then has the binding force of law which police are expected to enforce, we are living in the literal definition of a police state. So yeah this is def. a reasonable feeling.

Crunchymum · 11/10/2020 14:04

@WaxOnFeckOff

Sadly I don't think this applies to us in England.

just looked this up - seems you can have up to 30 for the service but are bound by the normal limits for the after do - that's really terrible. Sad

Could you all book tables in the same place?

Personally, i'd ignore and do something, even if it's just meeting at an outdoor quiet spot and raising a toast and taking turns to speak to each other.

You can have up to 30 at the service, which lasts half an hour. Due to need to clean between services you are asked to vacate the crematorium / surrounding area as soon as you can after service ends.

Maximum 2 cars and 6 people per car.

So no way to socialise with the 30 people in attendance.

Yes we could book somewhere but between working, kids, arranging a funeral and making sure my dad is OK, I don't really fancy working out the logistics of getting us all in somewhere in denominations of 6.

Not having a go... just saying that what we'd usually do is go back to one of our houses and give the rules none of us feel particularly comfortable with that. Sad

littleredsky · 11/10/2020 14:05

[quote Premiumbond]@thenightsky
Yes in the UK, Wigan. It’s been reported in the National news.[/quote]
We had the same in my area, the other man involved in the same incident. 50+ cars driving up both sides of the road, blocking traffic, no social distancing whatsoever. I guess if there's enough of you the rules don't apply.

Potionqueen · 11/10/2020 14:05

At my dsis cremation in June I had to sit separate from my dh. My dd and her dh stood at the back because there where already 10 people in the room. It is barbaric.

RB68 · 11/10/2020 14:05

households should be able to sit togethr - both sons I believe had been with their mother whilst their father was ill.

Bit of a Jobsworth but they need to understand that households can and should be together

Warsawa31 · 11/10/2020 14:11

@fancyginglass

Yes I can't blame any individuals as such the government whipped huge amounts of fear into society. But there comes a poi t where our current societal constructs ie the state, becomes unable to effectively solve problems. A virus is a great example - our tools or woefully inadequate and that's no ones fault really. So to avoid appearing to loose control (something a state can never be seen to do) the apply a blunt approach which panders to the lowest common denominator.
People say "if only we follow the rules etc" but we can't - society and humanity does not function like that, I think ultimately we are all so scared to die that we are scared to live.

Case in point It's been illegal to have sex with someone you dont live with for over 6 months now.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 14:13

@RB68

Read my previous comments. The funeral.home do understand that. They asked the family to provide them with a seating plan for sitting bubbles together. The family didnt respond so the funeral home had to assume there were no household bubbles so they set up that way. The family made no comments or complaints when they arrived and then they moved chairs. The worker probably panicked that they would be fined and shut down for allowing households to mix.

If the family had replied to the request then they would have been seated together.

CakeGirl2020 · 11/10/2020 14:17

I wouldn’t of moved from my upset mother, what were they going to do in reality? Man handle me, they would of been welcome to try. Have me arrested for what? Again they would of been welcome to do such.

I can understand not allowing a crowd but comforting a grieving woman not allowed, fuck right off.

The way they were spoken to on the video, wasn’t a compassionate person explaining nicely. It was a very rude, angry sounding person telling them to move. They can insist you follow the rules and speak to you nicely, well they should in a crematorium giving the nature of the business.

WhereverIGoddamnLike · 11/10/2020 14:21

@CakeGirl2020

I wouldn't have gone to my father's funeral without organising it properly, which would include responding to the organiser when they asked the family what household bubbles they had so the seats could he placed in groups.

The family didnt respond. They got single seats because the assumption was there were no household bubbles. Funeral home would be fi ed and closed if they didnt enforce it. How many people should lose their jobs because the family didnt answer?

ivykaty44 · 11/10/2020 14:29

The crematorium staff put groups of chairs together for households and this was the case at this crematorium.

Why didn't the funeral directors sort this out for the family before the service?

trappedsincesundaymorn · 11/10/2020 14:30

Mum died on March 31st. We weren't allowed to see her at the funeral home, she was buried in what she died in as we weren't allowed to dress her, there were no funeral cars and just me, dad and my elder sister at her cremation. She was wheeled in on a trolly, not carried and we weren't allowed to touch her coffin when we left. We did sit each side of my dad and hold his hands though. The whole thing was traumatic enough for an 83 year old man, to not be able to give him a bit of comfort was a step to far.

aToadOnTheWhole · 11/10/2020 14:40

I wouldn’t of moved from my upset mother, what were they going to do in reality? Man handle me, they would of been welcome to try. Have me arrested for what? Again they would of been welcome to do such.

The protocol we have been advised with if someone is being difficult/combative about not adhering to the guidelines is to simply stop the service and end it there.

I haven't watched the clip, but it has been explained by WhereverIGoddamnLike several times that the family were at fault. The funeral directors should have taken the responsibility to ensure that the family had given the cream the information requested. Families are not always forthcoming with information.

ivykaty44 · 11/10/2020 14:43

We were lucky, we could have 16v to the funeral and the undertakers told us to let them know how to group the chairs in households. Most people were in 2s but a couple of singles and then 4 for us at the front. There is no way I would have ignored this part and left my daughters sat alone as we would want to comfort each other. It was made clear we had to abide by the groupings

The coffin was carried as it was 1st July and the rules had just changed that morning. No cars so we drove ourselves (friends helped)

Doors were left open and people outside could here the service

WaxOnFeckOff · 11/10/2020 14:45

I completely understand @Crunchymum. It's just shit.

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