DS been asked to leave school due to low CAT score.

[omgitcantbetrue]

Just had a meeting with DS Prep school and I'm feeling so worried and anxious for DS.

He scored 92 average on the CAT test.
The teacher gently informed me this means he'll not manage to achieve above a C grade in any subject at GCSE. He's only in year 5, and I'm amazed they can make such predictions.
I was then informed that it's in his best interest to transition to a more gentle secondary school.
I don't know what I want really. Advice from parents in a similar position?
Are her life prospects totally limited? With C's only I'm assumings he'll never go to University. Which is fine. I'm worried for his prospects.
Do children who score 92 ever improve? How below average is this?
Thanks for reading

What a fantastic post WombatChocolate

They want him to stay till the end of primary so they can have your money.
They want him gone for secondary because he’s currently not promising them the top results they want to they want his space for a natural A grade student.
Sadly a lot of private schools just aren’t interested or willing or even capable of helping students who are below average or have an additional learning need. That’s why they score higher results - they can weed out students and cherry pick the ones they feel will help them most.

I’m sorry OP, your son is not a write off at all. Likely he does perhaps need a more nurturing environment to bring out his best. Sounds like the teaching style at that school isn’t suited to him and they aren’t interested in adapting.
All children have a talent, it just needs to be found. And inclusion in my view means everyone has the opportunity to achieve their best whatever that may be, and the path to get there will vary. There will be a school (and it may well be private, not all independent schools are like this) that will teach him well and support him.

Maybe they genuinely do like him and want to keep him?

My son was virtually written off by some of the teachers in primary mainly because he couldn’t write. He wasn’t dx with anything but struggled to write as couldn’t spell etc. His year 4 teacher didn’t offer any guidance just said he wasn’t an a* student!

By the time he started secondary he was predicted to get 2s and 3s for all subjects. However he worked really hard right the way through, supported by his amazing teachers and us by sitting up late at night with him to work through various bits of homework and it paid off because he passed every single one!

He is now at college doing the subject he is completely passionate about and flying along with no problems.

I would look at moving your ds to a school that is a better fit for him where they can support him and he feels comfortable to be there....

And just to say that all schools have systems that track from a young age to GCSE performance.
From KS1 SATs and from KS2 SATs you can show a flight path to expected GCSE outcomes. Schools know this data but they just don’t share it with parents when they are very young. And it doesn’t matter in mixed ability primary and Comprehensives, because everyone must be provided for.

But selective schools are different. There is a minimum standard for entry....it’s the whole point about having children of a similar ability level together. Those schools want to teach at a pace and level suitable for the able to allow them to achieve at a very high level. It won’t be suitable for everyone and not for those outside the ability range.

Children could be kept in the dark by the Prep about their unlikely chances of selective entry and allowed to go off and sit entrance exams for lots of schools they will never get into in a hundred years....or the school can be honest and help the parents find the right school for that child. Honesty with kindness is the best way, and it sounds like the teacher tried to do that and on some level the Op recognised that it was being done like that. But as I said, it’s never received well,

Knee jerk reactions result in people deciding the information isn’t true, the school doesn’t care, moving their child within 2 weeks etc etc.

If parents can’t face the thought that this could happen, they shouldn’t send their children to Preps if selective senior schools and they should go for the misspend ability state school or independent which will allow everyone in and cater for all.

If 85 is a low average, they are literally weeding him out.

They may genuinely think he will blossom elsewhere. Have you asked them where else they would recommend?

That's rubbish. My DS got around 90 in his CAT scores at primary level (year 4ish) - got 6 GCSEs above C (1 A*,2 As in there too!) and triple Btec distinction star (AAA) in year 13 and now runs a successful business and he is only in his early 20s. Good luck to you and your DS!

I know someone who was asked to leave his prep school when he was in year 4 for similar reasons - including dyslexia. His parents found him a gentle, nurturing, caring school for the rest of prep which then directed them towards a senior school with a similar ethos.

He now has a masters in International Relations and is lining up for a PhD next year.

Move him as quickly as possible OP even if it means losing a terms fees on notice period - there will be a school out there that is right for him and won't write him off.

@CremeEggThief

You might be better off posting this in Education, OP.

I'm a former primary teacher and I haven't got a clue what CAT even means.

I'm Scottish and neither have I.

UCAT = medical school entry exam. Guessing it's not that.

Yes they are weeding him out early as it might affect their destinations table. A good prep would steer you towards a choice of appropriate secondary schools to realise his potential not write him off. Cats do not accurately predict gcse and the teacher using the old grading system shows they are not as on the ball as they may wish to believe. Were all scores similar or spiky?

Lots of public (private) schools cherry pick - that's how they get the best results. Well that and extra tuition, longer days, smaller classes and in the past resits of exams until marks are up to scratch.

@HandfulofDust

The CAT scores have a normal distribution with a mean of around 15 so if he scored 92 he would be at the 30th percentile. So to put that in perspective if he was in an average classroom of 30 kids he would either be smarter than 9 kids in the room.

Now that assumes that the CAT is given a proper assessment of his ability and potential. There are lots of reasons why this might not be the case - he may well have underperformed because he hasn't had enough support or enough time to learn to cope with his dyslexia. He may just be a late developer. A single day's performance will be affected by what he had for breakfast, how he slept the night before, whether he needed the loo etc.

For normal distributions “average” us within 2 standard deviations of 10 , so usually 85 to 115.

Not 30th Centile which would make 70% of children above him.

I think the school are looking can’t be bothered. In your case, especially as he is dyslexic, I would move him. He deserves better

I am often surprised that people are surprised when they somehow find they are agreeing that maybe the school isn't the right environment for their child but yes I will keep him here for a couple more years to keep your coffers full and leave before they stuff up your impressive exam results. Results which were what attracted them to that school in the first place. Schools are seldom that fantastic that they can improve a child's grades that much they do it by culling those who will drag it down. You see the same in none fee paying grammars

@omgitcantbetrue

If 85 is a low average, they are literally weeding him out.

This is what many private schools do though. It's why they get good grades.

I honestly despair that parents don't realise this.

People don't talk about it because parents don't want to admit their kids didn't make the grade. I really wish parents would ask the questions when they enrol their children.

@midlifespices

Sorry no idea what the CAT score means but I would certainly be looking for a different school if they plan to write your DC off at that age!

Yep I don't know what it is. But it's disgraceful they're writing him off at his age! Poor thing.

I'm not pro private school so I may be biased but it seems clear they don't want him bringing their result down. Which is really shitty and one of the issues with private education.

I’d move him now for two reasons.

1. so he can move to a secondary with friends.
   If you pick a primary with lots of kids going to his secondary, starting primary and making friends is easier than starting secondary with no one.
2. so they don’t bash his self esteem and mental health anymore than they have (and I say that with one that was utterly battered in infants).

Have they talked to you before about him struggling?
Did they purely mention the CATs score or say this formed part of a bigger picture?

There is a possibility that this conversation happened purely in the basis of 1 CATs test, but it is unlikely. It is also likely that the way the OP perceived and heard the conversation wasn’t entirely accurate because of course it was a very emotional occasion for her.

Therefore, the key things to consider are finding out more information.

• Step back and think about all the other information you have been given over the years and the messages you have received about how your son is doing and his future path in terms of senior school.
• Ask school for another meeting and ask lots of questions (they will expect this) and find out all about his performance over time, the evidence they have, the break down of the CATs score etc etc.
• Then decide if the Prep school is the right place for him for the next 2 years and which Senior school might be right for him.

You might conclude the Prep have been uncaring and not provided for him and met his needs, or you might conclude that they have told you accurate information and they and/or the attached senior school are just not right for your son. You might keep him there or you might move him soon. Regardless it looks like you need to consider alternative Senior schools. Whether you ask the Prep to help you with that probably depends on what you conclude about the Prep now.

If he's year 5 then he has 3 more years at prep. If he likes it there and you think they'll help him academically then why not keep him there while you are looking for a suitable senior school?

I have to say we got him tested whilst in state primary and then moved him to non selective independent where he flourished. As teachers (in state system) we knew if our DS went to a comp he would be in the middle sets and coast/get forgotten about (no disrespect to teachers... we are those teachers! But too many kids, not enough time therefore kids at bottom and top do get disproportionate amount of attention compared to 'average joe')..

Dyslexic children often are bright and have to use all their extra skills to struggle to keep up. Year 5 is the hardest year.
When they are writing, they have to try to create a story, think about sentence structure, making their writing legible (some can find this harder as their fingers are immature) thinking about spelling it properly. That is quite a feat.. They get better and better as they move up through the school. This is why they can come home drained, discouraged and bad tempered so try to make homecoming as nice and reassuring as possible.
and don't forget that children don't develop according to a graph but in fits and starts and confidence plays a big part in this.
He might benefit from a one on one tutor, listening to audio books is fantastic for helping dyslexics with their reading, esp if they have the text book in front of him.
Focus on what he's good at, what he can do well and what he enjoys. At this age any afterschool thing that they can excel in helps build their confidence. School is not everything. Make the weekends fun and full of encouragement.
They are fortunate in that technology is their friend. Photos of the white board, spell checking apps etc. If you can, get him a querty typing program, when he's ready as this will really help with essays etc.
If he's had a dyslexic assessment, try to contact someone like Dyslexia Action to see how you can get the school to work with you, instead of just giving up on him as they seem to be.
You might even want to get some tutoring in cat exams, as schools often say you don't need to know how to do them, but I think you do and some explaination can often help your son deal with them.
He should be getting extra time in exams too. Makes all the difference. Best of luck, if you think he's bright, he probably is, so keep on encouraging your lad.

Haven’t read the full thread sorry. If he isn’t going to pass common entrance then I think you are best off looking for a less selective school that will nurture abilities and talents that aren’t just academic. I’m amazed the prep school is suggesting he leaves, the whole point in prep school is they bring out talents and guide you through the next school decision process. There are plenty of great schools that will be able to give his the bespoke education experience he needs. Please don’t worry. Lots of people do very well in life that didn’t succeed in the traditional sense at school.

I don’t think this is a case of OP jumping the gun because she’s had some news she doesn’t believe or doesn’t want to hear.
Explaining that a child’s results are not too high is one thing, but then saying he won’t ever score higher than a C is another thing entirely.
The approach should have been to discuss how they can improve and develop his skills further and what tactics need to be taken.
I don’t necessarily have an issue with selective schools in theory, but this does sound like weeding out. Much easier to teach a class of very able students who have all been handpicked and get the top grades then it is to have to teach all abilities and differentiate and actually offer additional support.

Cognitive ability tests are often used in Year 7 (or at least, were) to give an indication of cognitive ability and the areas of strength and development. The raw score doesn’t give the whole picture, because you need to be aware of the spread of attainment.

Independent schools usually have smaller classes, maybe more facilities and generally a different demographic from most state schools. They expect their pupils to achieve excellent grades because that’s what encourages parents to apply for places, amongst other things. Some will work effectively with pupils with SEND, but most rely on a higher level of ability.

OP’s son may well be an able boy, with a specific difficulty, but the school seem to think his performance isn’t going to reflect well on them. It’s very sad that they aren’t addressing his needs and finding out what will help him to learn. I’d look for a school that will do that.

Just going to add this to the discussion:
www.gl-assessment.co.uk/sites/gl/files/images/Files/GCSE_Technical_Information.pdf
As well as the information that one of my DCs had an amazing jump in abilities from age 11-13.
If I am reading the table above correctly the OPs DS with dyslexia and no extra tuition still ranks at about a third likely to get decent results. If the DS likes the school, I'd want to know if the advice the OP is getting is based on one, one-off CAT score, or a pattern of learning the school is concerned about and doesn't want to handle?
Sorry OP. As you rightly say, dyslexia and high levels of intelligence are not mutually exclusive.