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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

DS been asked to leave school due to low CAT score.

406 replies

omgitcantbetrue · 08/10/2020 17:26

Just had a meeting with DS Prep school and I'm feeling so worried and anxious for DS.

He scored 92 average on the CAT test.
The teacher gently informed me this means he'll not manage to achieve above a C grade in any subject at GCSE. He's only in year 5, and I'm amazed they can make such predictions.
I was then informed that it's in his best interest to transition to a more gentle secondary school.
I don't know what I want really. Advice from parents in a similar position?
Are her life prospects totally limited? With C's only I'm assumings he'll never go to University. Which is fine. I'm worried for his prospects.
Do children who score 92 ever improve? How below average is this?
Thanks for reading

OP posts:
TaraR2020 · 09/10/2020 15:27

Honestly, your son sounds brilliant - his enthusiasm and dedication will serve him so much better through life than any exam; and to be his age and already know what sort of environment will allow him to flourish is wonderful - you must be enormously proud of him :)

Good luck with the search, sounds like you both have every reason to be excited!

Newgirls · 09/10/2020 15:48

Sorry to have started a slight side track op!

My kids school offers Btec in sport and business only I believe so those wanting to do a levels without high GCSEs go to other schools or local college.

It was more a comment that even schools that prob wouldn’t define themselves as Tory do select. That’s for another thread I’m sure,

Op good luck you sound very switched on 👍

Janevaljane · 09/10/2020 16:04

Surely there aren't many selective state schools, apart from grammars?

randomer · 09/10/2020 16:19

Any takers for the average ability dyslexic?

sirfredfredgeorge · 09/10/2020 16:52

The bottom line is that I chose a school that does not suit my child's needs. Naively perhaps. It's a system, and my child won't thrive there, so that's that

It very much highlights what a failure the school has been in other ways, one of the tropes talked about private school is how it instils self-confidence and the ability to advocate for themselves, yet your child clearly hasn't gained that or he would've brought up his unhappiness before to you.

That failing of the schools is not about his ability.

Oneandzero · 09/10/2020 17:20

@Janevaljane

Surely there aren't many selective state schools, apart from grammars?
Or even (gasp) below average.

A child can be dyslexic and not gifted at maths or indeed gifted at anything or indeed very much below average academic ability.

CaraDuneRedux · 09/10/2020 17:21

Okay I'll bite on the issue of the average ability dyslexic. Of course people with dyslexia will be drawn from all abilities, intellegence, artistic, sporting, musical you name it ability - just like any other person.

It may however be that it gets picked up as a problem earlier in children who are very intelligent, because the mismatch between what they can do verbally and their reading/writing ability becomes obvious earlier.

It's swings and roundabouts. The problem for an intelligent child is that to some extent their intelligence enables them to come up with work-around strategies for their dyslexia, while the dyslexia masks their intelligence, so to the casual observer they look like they're just average performers, and don't manage to achieve their full potential.

Children with dyslexia without that advantage struggle more and have a bigger hurdle to overcome.

Both are more likely to be failed by the education system than children without dyslexia, but will be failed in slightly different ways.

LynetteScavo · 09/10/2020 17:21

@randomer

Any takers for the average ability dyslexic?
Do you mean you want to hear about average dyslexics who have done OK?

I have a relative who was in botttome sets for most things at school, then got average GCSES, took A levels over three years, achieved a degree and a masters and now has a very reasonable job . It just took eher a king time to get there.

Oneandzero · 09/10/2020 17:34

@LynetteScavo

I suspect that no, that wasn’t what he pusher wanted to hear. As that’s the vast majority of posts on this thread about dyslexia.

What about those who don’t do exceptionally well at school, who don’t go on to get a masters but instead leave school, get a job in a shop and don’t think twice about it

FatimaMunchy · 09/10/2020 18:25

Yes Dyslexics can be average. At the moment my 11 year old grandson is one such. Is that what you wanted Ransomer? I am hoping he will grow up to be a plumber because our family is woefully short of people with useful trades.

SteeperThanHell · 09/10/2020 18:26

We have 3 boys - all with dyslexia. All three have different struggles.

DS1 doing well and hoping to study medicine - went through prep and now well supported in private secondary.

DS2 - could do well If he focussed, also went through prep and is at a small supportive private school. He is far more practical than he is academic.

DS3 in prep with entrance exams looming - lacks confidence which is a massive issue. Trying to find the right school for him at the moment for year 7.

CaraDuneRedux · 09/10/2020 18:31

Thinking about it, my cousin probably ticks the "average" box. He's a lorry driver. Chances are, he might well have ended up as a lorry driver even had he not had dyslexia.

But having dyslexia made his school days (60s and 70s) absolute hell, because he was mercilessly bullied by his teachers for being the "class thicko". It's left psychological scars even to this day (though mercifully, he's had a mostly happy life, with a wife and kids and happy home).

randomer · 09/10/2020 18:33

@CaraDuneRedux, thats appalling.

DilemmaDerby · 09/10/2020 18:38

Is it fee paying?

Suspect the “don’t move him until year 7” gets them the fees but not the “guessing” drop in results.

Move him now, I moved eldest in year 5 and she’s fine.

JeanneFrench · 09/10/2020 18:40

100 is the average. 92 is low but really not won't pass any GCSEs or go to uni (if they want to) low. Kids who score 108 aren't considered geniuses. Below 83, 80 would be a cause for concern.

When did your child sit the CAT4 test? Did the school tell you whether they were able to finish the tests? What is the breakdown of the scores?

You could look on GL assessment's website for more info.

Casschops · 09/10/2020 19:02

They CANNOT predict his GCSE grades at year five. What a load of shit.

OutwiththeOutCrowd · 09/10/2020 19:26

She just sees it (her dyslexia) as her brain is wired differently.

A difference in wiring - so important to bear in mind in many situations ….

I remember a teacher in primary school showing all of us girls how to knit.

Our first project was knitting small teddy bears. Week after week, I click-clacked away laboriously. In the time it took me to produce a few meagre inches, the girl next to me had finished her bear and completed the front of a jumper.

‘You’ll have to try harder than that if you want to be a knitter!’ said my teacher in a snippy voice as she peered at my modest offering.

Why was I so slow and inept?

It was only as an adult that I realised the teacher had taught us right-handed knitting. I had no idea there was a method available that was more natural for left-handed people like me. It was a classic case of a mismatch between student and technique.

The unfortunate knitting episode gave me a small taste of what it might feel like to be dyslexic, to be taught in ways that are optimised for people whose brains are different - not better, not worse, just different.

Standardised tests, including CAT tests, have been designed with the non-dyslexic majority in mind. It’s interesting to imagine an amended test that would put extra weight on areas of cognition in which dyslexics tend to do as well as, or possibly even better than non-dyslexics.

Even if some teachers in hothouse schools believe that their one-size-fits-all tests and methods are fair, and that those who can’t conform and flourish should ship out, it’s so important that dyslexic students themselves realise their cerebral strengths, whether they are naturally inclined towards practical activities or more scholarly ones.

Good luck to you and your DS omgitcantbetrue! Flowers

reefedsail · 09/10/2020 19:34

@Casschops

They CANNOT predict his GCSE grades at year five. What a load of shit.
It's absolutely standard to predict them from Y6 SATs- that is the entire basis of Progress 8.
CaraDuneRedux · 09/10/2020 20:15

It's absolutely standard to predict them from Y6 SATs- that is the entire basis of Progress 8.

Yes, and it's an absolute disgrace, and a fundamental undermining of the principles of comprehensive schooling, and the reintroduction of an 11+ style "write off half the population at age 11" approach to schooling.

Because all too often among over-worked, under-resourced schools, it becomes a tick box exercise. "little Johnny is headed for a mix of 4s and 5s - oh look, that's how he's performing, nothing to see here."

No bloody incentive to improve performance, to help kids aim for better.

It's another fucking bureaucratic exercise in flattening aspiration.

LynetteScavo · 09/10/2020 21:01

[quote Oneandzero]@LynetteScavo

I suspect that no, that wasn’t what he pusher wanted to hear. As that’s the vast majority of posts on this thread about dyslexia.

What about those who don’t do exceptionally well at school, who don’t go on to get a masters but instead leave school, get a job in a shop and don’t think twice about it[/quote]
Well I'm sure there are very many dyslexics who have bog standard jobs. Just Bruce's you're dyslexic doesn't mean your going to be good at maths or be artistic. Dyslexics may also be dealing with other issues on top of the dyslexia and many will never be diagnosed.

My own DD was only diagnosed because her teacher noticed her vicabywasnt online with her inability to read. If she'd come from a different family where she hadn't been exposed to the same vocabulary she could never have been diagnosed. I'm sure there are millions of people with dyslexia who have never had a diagnosis, and just think they're not academic and so be it. There are also different levels of dyslexia- some people might be mildly dyslexic but manage to generally do OK. I know others can barely read or write despite having a an education which would provide most people with a handful of GCSEs.

ilovepixie · 09/10/2020 21:38

My friends daughter was told when she was eight that she was below average and would never amount to anything. Last year she graduated from university with a first in event management. Yes she had a tough time at primary school but when she got to secondary it just all clicked and she was always on top of her class from then on.

Shizzlestix · 09/10/2020 21:47

Blimey! 92 isn’t horrendously low. Is it a through school? I would leave him there then move him for year 7 to a school with a good pastoral and SEN department IN CASE he needs extra support. This may not be the cae by year 7.

As I recall, 110 is above average, 120 is very bright. 80 is a low score (this is from doing county entry tests with my school as the administering centre) 70 was the score that would kick in full academic support for a child who clearly needed it.

Duanphen · 09/10/2020 22:20

They're basically trying to send you elsewhere. It's absolute bollocks dyslexia will hold him back at GCSE. They're just one of those shitty schools that won't help all the students equally.

Report them.

omgitcantbetrue · 12/10/2020 11:23

Going to look at a few options over the next few weeks. Thanks all for your help. Really grateful.

OP posts:
1970smum · 07/12/2020 09:59

That is a shocking approach by the school. I wouldn't worry too much about the CAT and GCSEs but it would be useful to find out precisely what area/s your DS particularly struggled with. If he has dyslexia it would definitely have affected the results. CAT would assess verbal and quantitative ability. My DS didn't score well at all on the verbal primarily because his vocabulary wasn't up to scratch. This despite him reading a lot. There is also spatial reasoning (non-verbal) and those children who have been preparing for the 11+ will be at an advantage as they will have been working a lot on these type of non-verbal/pictorial problems. These scores are not a perfect predictor of GCSEs etc at all, and lots of kids go on to do very well indeed. I know adults who always did awfully badly on any type of cognitive test (which is what CAT is) but they did very well at university and are successful in their respective professions now. There is a high degree of self fulfilling prophecy with these type of cognitive tests - they're not used in all countries!