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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

DS been asked to leave school due to low CAT score.

406 replies

omgitcantbetrue · 08/10/2020 17:26

Just had a meeting with DS Prep school and I'm feeling so worried and anxious for DS.

He scored 92 average on the CAT test.
The teacher gently informed me this means he'll not manage to achieve above a C grade in any subject at GCSE. He's only in year 5, and I'm amazed they can make such predictions.
I was then informed that it's in his best interest to transition to a more gentle secondary school.
I don't know what I want really. Advice from parents in a similar position?
Are her life prospects totally limited? With C's only I'm assumings he'll never go to University. Which is fine. I'm worried for his prospects.
Do children who score 92 ever improve? How below average is this?
Thanks for reading

OP posts:
Coughsyrupsucks · 08/10/2020 18:47

Don’t worry! Find him a kinder school with a better SEN department. My DD (she‘s Autistic and Dyslexic) didn’t do CATs, but flunked the SATs, and has a working memory in the lowest 6th percentile. Verbally however she’s in the 99th percentile. Thanks to her SEN department, shes had one to ones, accommodation in exams, scribes, and dictation equipment. Her Prep didn’t kick her out, they‘ve helped her. She passed 9 GCSE’s with great grades, and is now studying for three A Levels. Find another school that will help him, good luck!

Secondsop · 08/10/2020 18:47

I don’t have any real insight but I just wanted to say that I’m so sorry that he’s been treated like this by the school and that you must be feeling awful no matter how gently the teacher said it BUT:

  • he is a child
  • their job is to teach the children
  • it’s not him, it’s them.

Loads of very sensible-sounding advice in the posts already. I hope you find a solution so that he can continue to grow and to enjoy learning.

Ingles2 · 08/10/2020 18:48

I don't know about CAT scores, but my dyspraxic son was not doing great academically in primary, didn't sit the 11+ and went to a pretty poor state comp in an overwhelmingly grammar area.. putting it bluntly.. and we laugh about this with him now, but he still couldn't do basic number bonds in yr 6
In yr 8, he had a great maths teacher who totally inspired him and realised with support what he could achieve..
At GCSE, he got 10 A/B, got 2A* and 2A's at A level and now studys Maths and Physics at Durham...
Do not worry about the school, imo, they are being short sighted ..
please do not write him off... he could come into his own, next month, next year, at GCSE..
please do move him to a school that is more interested in helping him reach his potential.. whatever that is.

Proudling · 08/10/2020 18:50

If run a mile from any school who decided a child’s potential in year 5! That’s shocking!

DD’s secondary academy’s results for getting lower performing children through their GCSE’s are outstanding. Children not meant to pass prove that wrong all the time. The school cares and knows it can get the kids with lower CAT and SAT scores to achieve well.

Any school that ‘gently’ tells you your child won’t amount to much at that age should be ashamed. They should help, not cast out. Disgusting.

GlamGiraffe · 08/10/2020 18:51

I also think the school just want to keep your son for as long as possible as a source of fees. Show him a wonderful alternative place and he'll love it there too
You mention your DS is having extra lessons but is he having specific lessons for dyslexia rather than just extra English/reading writing lessons? They are nothing like the same thing. Dyslexic children get taught differently, totally different ways of learning, techniques etc. At a private school i would expect lessons to be allocated specifically for this.

It makes an enormous difference. It can take tests of many strategies and techniques to try to find and learn ones which work. Perhaps the school doesnt even have a capable staff member in which case you are still paying fees for an inferior service. I'd ask what they are doing in extra lessons towards dyslexia support, however given they have no interest in bringing out the best in some pupils as they loose them at 11 they may not be making an effort. Its definitely worth considering.l as your child could really be missing a valuable learning opportunity.
What part of the country are you in OP as there a good service available for dyslexic children near me which my son attended. It helped him.

Joeblack066 · 08/10/2020 18:53

OP your child will do fine. There are Apprenticeships up to Masters Level if that’s what they want. 2 of my adult children did nothing after GCSE and both have good jobs. Another one became a paramedic and did his degree through work (and is on the telly lol!) and my daughter did the BTEC route then went to Uni. Let your child do the subjects they want that make them happy. Everything will fall into place. 👍🏻🙂

Itsnotalwaysasyouthink · 08/10/2020 18:53

Please move your DS.
When my DS was 5 his teacher sat me down and told me he would never amount to anything.
We moved him to another school. It’s taken a number of years but now in yr8 (and With a dyslexia diagnosis) he’s happy and doing well.
His confidence had really been dented and I really wish we’d moved him sooner. We play to his strengths (sport has really helped) and have a tutor outside of school. He also has some extra help in school but is not in a specialist school.
He tested very low in yr 4 but I now believe that he is more than capable of getting into University should he want to.

Devlesko · 08/10/2020 18:54

Wow! Shocking. Imagine if state schools dismissed children like that?

They do, and did to my dd, read my post. End of Ks1 after SATS.
We home educated and then she went to a private specialist school, where she has reached her potential. I have other dc with a positive experience from state schools.
There are good and bad in all sectors, it doesn't help to suggest otherwise.

oakleaffy · 08/10/2020 18:55

@omgitcantbetrue
Not sure what a CAT score entails, but at college there was a lad who BOMBED his GCSE's.

He re-took them, did non modular A levels and got 4 grade A passes.

NEVER write a kid off...how arrogant and small minded is that school!

My own DS disliked Maths, scraped a C but now does complex calculations in his work because he needs to..When they are interested, it changes everything

If your DS is otherwise bright and sharp, have no worries.

Soontobe60 · 08/10/2020 18:58

If you can afford it, have an educational psychologist complete a cognitive assessment. 92 is a low average Standardised score But so much depends on the circumstances of whatever test they used. The results of the EP assessment will give you a better idea of whether your dhs is academic enough (not taking into account his dyslexia) to respond to the rigorous demands of a pressurised academic school. The link here explains the GCSE grading system - BTW if they said he’d only get a C grade they’re a bit behind as grades are now numerical!
www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-48993830

vintageyoda · 08/10/2020 18:58

Missandra

Great to hear your son's story. I can't understand this attitude that state schools aren't going to be as good as independent schools if your child has dyslexia. The are excellent and piss poor comps when it comes to supporting extra needs just as there is the same range in private schools.

Sherlockscurlylocks · 08/10/2020 18:59

This sounds so similar to what we experienced in Y5. It was at the future school discussion with the Headmaster that they dropped the "we think there is something wrong" bombshell. Six years into him being at the same prep school. Until that point nothing to indicate that he was anything but average and trundling along and doing okay. Upshot is, we got him assessed, dyspraxia was diagnosed. His prep were nothing but useless, full of empty promises and a total failure in support apart from one lovely TA. It was pretty clear that because he wasn't an easy "win" in terms of securing a place at a London senior school they couldn't be bothered and were more than happy for us to move him to preserve their stats. Their loss as he is now absolutely flourishing at his new school with great prospects for senior schools. I'm more than happy talk about our experience and where DS is now if you want to DM me.

Lonecatwithkitten · 08/10/2020 19:01

You need to know his individual VR, NVR and quantative scores dyslexics often have a spiked profile strong in one area and weak in another.
My DD had this below average NVR, above average VR went to private school, that taught by learning style - she was an auditory learner left with 6 x 8s, 2 x 9s. Hers was all girls, but I think clayesmore in Dorset is supposed to be similar for boys. She is now doing an OCR ( similar to BTEC) modular no exams and can record her work in a variety of ways including photos and VLogs and is equivalent to 3 A - levels and is accepted for degree courses.

Christmasfairy2020 · 08/10/2020 19:02

Right. Keep him at private they are talking rubbish as want to keep grades up and not put extra work in to get him up to speed!!!.

I got 4 gcses a d an e in maths and never got above a c. I worked hard at college doing health and social and passed top of class. Went to uni and did my nursing degree! They are not thinking about your son here. Keep at it and send to a good private secondary if u can afford it x

KihoBebiluPute · 08/10/2020 19:05

That school sounds terrible and very much the wrong environment for him so do look for one with a more positive attitude. However do not write off your son's intellectual potential just because this school can't be arsed to support him. Maybe he won't be destined for Oxbridge/Russell Group but even so there are loads of other challenging and interesting University courses where entry requirements are for Cs and Ds - but with the right support and assistance for the dyslexia there might be potential for him to reach higher - what's important is that he is supported to find his strengths and understand and learn as far as possible to compensate for his weaknesses without being ashamed of them, and then he can work out for himself what he wants to do at 18 - which may or may not be University based. A good school will be happy to help him do this.

oakleaffy · 08/10/2020 19:06

@omgitcantbetrue

Sorry. Should have said. He’s dyslexic. I did know that already, but thought he was bright.
@omgitcantbetrue

My DS had/has Dyslexia.
A man now.
We met his old Primary Head teacher by chance, and he said ''I always knew {name} would come good''

You know your DS.

If he is witty, articulate, good at things he is interested in, please don't worry.

Clutterbugsmum · 08/10/2020 19:06

I would make an appointment with the head teacher to discuss what the teacher has said, and what THEY are going to do in supporting your son with his learning.

I would also start looking at the high school and speaking to them about your son, so you can make an informed decision about the best school for your son. Don't leave it until next year as you don't have very long to make the choice.

My DD has dyslexia and had just gone onto 6th Form and is doing History, Biology and Psychology.

In year 6 she got 4's in her SAT's. Her end of High school results.

Eng Lit GCSE a 5 taken in year 10

Year 11 GCSE's

1 x 6
4 x 7's
3 x 8's

Or and English Lit A Level grade C taken and done mainly in her own time.

So please support your DS to get the help so he can do whatever he decides to do and don't forget a lot of famous people have had dyslexia.

omg35 · 08/10/2020 19:06

I did CATs in my state comprehensive back in the day and failed them all! I ended up with 7As, 2Bs and a C at GCSE, AAB at alevel and a 2.1 degree from a Russell university so don't write off your son based on one teacher please

WombatChocolate · 08/10/2020 19:07

I think people haven’t considered the kind of school and system this family have their child in.

It sounds like a Prep which is attached to a selective senior school. Children join such Preps on the understanding that progression to the selective senior school depends on meeting certain standards. One of the ways this is measured is through CATs but that won’t be the only way.

For the staff, it will become clear that some children just won’t be at the standard required by the selective senior school. They will gather and look at a range of evidence including CATs and if it really isn’t the case that this child is going to pass the entrance exam or be high a bulity enough to get a recommendation from the Prep (sometimes used by attached Preps instead of sitting the exam with external candidates) then the parents do have to be armed about this. And it never goes down well.....but this is the system the family have chosen to be in.

It doesn’t help a child who has CATs of 92 to go to a senior school where the average might be 125. It would be a soul destroying experience.

On one hand, you say the teacher told you gently. That’s good and right. Sometimes some pretty honest and hard hitting information is needed for parents to understand, especially if the school has tried to raise the issue before and parents haven’t been listening. CATs can not tell you categorically what GCSE outcomes will be, but they are a very good indicator.

So an issue is that some selective senior schools have non-selective Preps. The children come in at 4 and the families are hoping to proceed to the senior school. Most probably will and although it’s known there’s no guarantee, people can feel that the fact their child is in the Prep means they must be up to the standard of the senior school or it is the job if the Prep to get them there. But in reality, children of lower ability just won’t be suited to a highly selective senior school. Some seniors will take a broader range, but some are hugely selective and have many many external children sitting the entrance exam and need to give the places to the high performers, not to those from the Prep who really will be significantly below the standard. They probably cut the Attached Prep children a bit of slack....but only to a point.

So it is a hard thing to hear and it can sound like the school isn’t interested in your child and only in the clever ones. But the reality is, that when you choose a school like that which is selective, you know this is the reality. Some children will be told they should be looking elsewhere.

When this happens, (and yr 4 or 5 is the right time because there’s enough information and also time for parents to think about alternative senior schools) many families move their children almost immediately to another Prep. Sometimes it’s because they are offended and feel badly treated and sometimes it’s because they feel that continuing to the end of yr 6 or 8 (whenever the Prep ends) will be too hard if the child knows they aren’t going where most will go, plus they are likely to already be finding the work too difficult. Some will stay on until the end and then move to whichever senior school is found to be suitable. Regardless, the Prep has a duty to help the family find a suitable new Prep or Senior for later...and most will be very willing to do this, although parents often feel that support isn’t available.

It’s never easy to hear your child isn’t at the standard you’d hoped and it is hard with a 9 year old to feel they are written off. I do t think it is writing off, but recognising their path isn’t that of most of their school peers and that a different path needs to be found.

Some of the less selective senior schools or those that specialise in lower abilities or SEN do a fantastic job and get their students to a good number of GCSEs and some to Uni too - they can often add far more value to such a child than a selective school ever could.

So I think all the outrage is a bit misplaced really. This isn’t an all-ability state primary telling a child to leave or that their trajectory isn’t good. It’s a school the parents chose in the knowledge it feeds a selective senior and they always faced the risk that their child might not make the grade. It’s hard but a reality of that choice.

Op, I’d sleep in it and ask for a further meeting with school to clarify a bit further. They should be able to give you a break down of your child’s Scores across the different skills and to be able to talk you through all the options in a helpful way. Wait until you’ve had a chance to think and absorb the info and try to take the emotion out if it and be a bit objective and focus on looking at what might be best for your son, rather than any knee jerk reaction. Best of luck....when you can pay fees, you can always find a good school to suit your child.

Wilbedon · 08/10/2020 19:07

My DS1 is now in year 7. He scored similarly to your son in the assessments at primary school. I would be over the moon if my boy could get whatever the equivalent of a C in his maths and English GCSEs. That would mean that he would have some options for post 16 education and training.

Realii · 08/10/2020 19:10

Our eldest son never did a CAT, but had a rocky journey. He was immature mainly, but lower middle groups. Then behaviour problems (reactive to bullying but he reacted and had some fixed term exclusions). In year 9 we took him out for a while even before he was pushed.
He got it together in yr 10 and 11 at a new school, with tutoring, and got the grades for a red rock university to do biology. Got a first and did a masters too and got a job in the field.
Glad he was never predicted a failure as an immature yr 5 who rarely managed a sentence!
Another case was my sister, 1:1 support in ks1, small group in ks2. Got a first in history ultimately at a middling university. In year 5 she was in the SEN register still and they’d considered statementing her in KS1.

BelleSausage · 08/10/2020 19:14

As a teacher, this is awful, awful, awful.

Do move him to a more supportive school. His current one is obviously run by arseholes.

Colouringaddict · 08/10/2020 19:15

As the mother of a son with dyslexia, I just want to give you some hope. At the age of 8 my son could not recognise or write his own name, school gave us lots of lazy excuses, until I threatened to stage a sit in and become his voluntary TA, suddenly he had one to one help and they followed a specific programme that we had looked into. He left school with 10 GCSE grades B and above.

He is now running his own very successful business.

Move him now, he deserves so much better that that!

Shireslass · 08/10/2020 19:15

Teacher here. That is insane. One test taken on one day will not determine his whole life chances. However this does tell you a lot about the school. Personally I would not want my child in this type of setting.

julietteb18 · 08/10/2020 19:15

This sounds toxic! I can’t offer advice as a parent, but to offer some comfort, I got a 3C which put me in bottom set for year 7 in every subject at a state school. I left with 12 A*s at GCSE. Some children take time to peak.
DH is a teacher and always says - the kids who do best have attentive parents who are around and push them just enough. It’s the familial support that will get him to where he needs to be. Don’t worry you sound like a great caring mum!