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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

If you are really posh...

345 replies

quickque · 04/10/2020 10:55

How do you view people that aren't?

A genuine question. I can't help but feel as if some of my husbands friends / colleagues think that he's married 'down'....

Maybe a generalisation but I mostly get this impression from his female friends.

OP posts:
JaffaCake70 · 04/10/2020 12:01

@wewillmeetagain

I tend to find that the really "posh" types eg aristocrats and old money are absolutely fine and not so judgemental. It's the middle class or new money types that can be judgy and think they are better than others.
Agree 100% The 'Nouveau Riche' are the worst!
3WildOnes · 04/10/2020 12:01

My husbands family are fairly posh. As in land owners and public schools. They definitely do look down on those who are not. But you wouldn’t know unless you were in their inner circle.
My family are firmly middle class and don’t look down on others.

HollywoodHandshake · 04/10/2020 12:02

REALLY posh people will never make you feel inferior and have indeed nothing to prove.

Behind close doors, many WILL judge and might laugh. Many do not like the idea of their relative marrying down.

Kate Middleton and Pippa were very famously mercilessly mocked by many of William's close friends - you can't really get posher than them.

It's extreme, really posh people have enough manners not to let you guess what they think.

HappyDays10101 · 04/10/2020 12:03

Any thread on Mumsnet about class always goes on these lines - that ‘proper posh’ people are salt of the earth, take me as you find me, don’t look down on people etc etc. I am sure that’s true in many cases, but it feels a little simplistic to me.

Notonthestairs · 04/10/2020 12:03

You'll find nice and unpleasant people in all walks of life.

The most freeing thing to remember is that nobody is really paying you much attention. Concentrate on what makes you happy.

LakieLady · 04/10/2020 12:05

*public school - Eton, Rugby etc

And don't have to work for a living*

Both those things are as much (probably more, in the case of the latter) to do with wealth, not poshness.

The properly posh people I have met over the years (including 2 viscounts, a duke's daughter, a marquess and a baronet) have been refreshingly free of snootiness when it comes to matters of social class. And they certainly worked for a living, an estate the size of some round here takes a lot of managing. They certainly don't look down on people with less money. Some of them are asset-rich but cash poor, so know what it's like to have to make ends meet.

People who are flash with their cash are often a different matter though. Because they believe money is everything and use every opportunity to display how much they've got, they assume that anyone who isn't driving a Range Rover/wearing designer labels/having flash holidays is in some way inferior.

It's their way of bolstering their internal insecurities imo.

PineappleUpsideDownCake · 04/10/2020 12:06

I think its more true that "proper posh" people may give the impression of polite to eveyone etc.

As above who they become close friends and marry is different.

3WildOnes · 04/10/2020 12:08

@Eyewhisker

There is a weird English thing that the truly posh people are the world’s nicest people and never look down on others, whereas it’s the ones who made their own money you have to look out for.

I have never found this to be true. At university, I was surrounded by the posh set, and they never mixed outside their set. A few good-looking mc girls were allowed in, but it was known that they were not quite born to it. Very much a ‘doors-to-manual’ culture.

This fawning over the posh is really unedifying.

This is my experience too.
Mummyoflittledragon · 04/10/2020 12:09

Hollywood
You really can get much much posher than Kate and Pippa. Their mum was from a working Class family. Her dad had ties to aristocracy but that’s from the early 19th century. Perhaps if I traced my family, I could find that too, lots of us could.... No idea.... They’re self made millionaires. Not proper posh.

Colycola · 04/10/2020 12:11

Today 11:26 ChrisPrattsFace

I spend about two thirds of my year with what I assume you would class as ‘posh’
Those with money they’ve earned tend to be kinder and more approachable (no example would be that they always make time for me and my son) whereas those who inherited money are arseholes. (frequently ask me and my son to leave the area because I ruin their day etc)

Where the hell was this?

daisychain01 · 04/10/2020 12:12

@quickque

How do you view people that aren't?

A genuine question. I can't help but feel as if some of my husbands friends / colleagues think that he's married 'down'....

Maybe a generalisation but I mostly get this impression from his female friends.

You're relying on people telling you they're "posh" and then risk getting the normal AIBU lambasting for saying that.

A bit exposing, wouldn't you say?

JonHammIsMyJamm · 04/10/2020 12:13

@HappyDays10101

Any thread on Mumsnet about class always goes on these lines - that ‘proper posh’ people are salt of the earth, take me as you find me, don’t look down on people etc etc. I am sure that’s true in many cases, but it feels a little simplistic to me.
Yes, there’s always a lot of forelock tugging/fawning to the very UC on these threads. Usually accompanied by sneering at those uppity embarrassingly gauche and rude, wannabe UC ‘nouveau riche’ types. The middle classes are terrible social climbers and the working classes as are all ‘salt of the earth types. It’s clearly utter bollocks. As PP have said, you get judgy, rude wankers in all walks of life, just as you get decent folk.
tarheelbaby · 04/10/2020 12:14

In general, you are not the problem here but you can manage the solution. It's hard to take but my best advice is make your own way and don't worry about those b*tches.

May I suggest, in no particular order, 3 entertaining and potentially enlightening books:
Snobs - Julian Fellowes (recently of Downton Abbey fame); you might be playing the part of the main character
Past Imperfect - Julian Fellowes again; the scene at the end when they go to an outdoor opera evening whilst staying with friends is priceless
Shire Hell - Rachel Johnson (yes, BoJo's sister); the husband character might sound familiar

As a non-British person who has married one (not posh but went to a famous school) and lived here for quite some time, I can tell you that in the end, you will never have your husband's friends' shared experiences so you'll just have to be yourself - that's why your DH married you - and muddle through. The nice ones will be nice, the mean ones will be mean and eventually you'll find your feet.

If you don't have to work, you might like to find some volunteering you enjoy (supposedly 'posh types' are involved in charities) or time consuming hobbies (horses? sailing?); that might be a way to build friendships with the nicer ones: what do they like to do?

Or you could find a job in your field and enjoy working whilst knowing that you don't need the money.

If your problem is more about using the wrong fork or dressing incorrectly for dinner Debrett's or your husband's female relatives might help.

Gwenhwyfar · 04/10/2020 12:21

"If your problem is more about using the wrong fork or dressing incorrectly for dinner Debrett's or your husband's female relatives might help."

First you said, 'be yourself', then you said read Debrett's!

WombatChocolate · 04/10/2020 12:26

Quite a lot of people like to consider the,selves ‘quite posh’ because they went to a lesser known private or public school or now have a big house or have a big career.

I think it’s right about some people having something to prove and those who are from genuinely old_famiky backgrounds like aristos don’t have anything to prove, even if they have fallen on hard-times - you can be genteelly poor!

I agree with the comment though, that although people don’t have anything to prove and seem to be unaware of everyone’s social class, they actually are aware and tend to marry within that group. In being brought up in that group, it’s taught very quickly (perhaps by osmosis) that it’s not the thing to talk about money or class or to make others feel inferior but to show largesse and be generous and open spirited towards all and to always make everyone feel comfortable. It’s unspoken but not In-noticed if you know what I mean. So those people might seem to treat everyone the same, but they always spot the class distinguishers and things that identify others like them (even if most people can’t spot the little things) and when looking for long term partners and spouses veer towards rehouse from a similar background.....not surprising really as most people are more comfortable with their own.

I think the more people vocalise their background, education, job, famiky, where they grew up, the more likely they are to have something to prove. With people from genuine old famiky and privileged backgrounds, you might suspect from an accent, but you won’t discover where they went to school or grew up or what they famiky did or do from them, but only by pressing for that info. And I think they spot those who keep quiet too - it’s a big indicator. Again, it tends to be those from new money whose kids can be seen in the fashionable seaside towns in the summer parading their lesser private school hoodies or talking loudly or whose parents are in the restaurants spending big and wearing designer gear and comparing house prices or career paths...it still has novelty factor to it.

Nothing wrong or right with any of it and old money and most of us who aren’t spectacularly affluent can easily be negative towards new money. Although there can be some crassness to it, lots of us are also probably a bit jealous of those who are able to ‘make it’ and so are a bit sneery about them.

Happymum12345 · 04/10/2020 12:26

A very posh lady I know (distant royal) walked into my 1930’s semi & said oh, it’s much nicer than I expected it to be.

HollywoodHandshake · 04/10/2020 12:27

@Mummyoflittledragon

Hollywood You really can get much much posher than Kate and Pippa. Their mum was from a working Class family. Her dad had ties to aristocracy but that’s from the early 19th century. Perhaps if I traced my family, I could find that too, lots of us could.... No idea.... They’re self made millionaires. Not proper posh.
It's William's friends who ARE posh, not Kate and Pippa - which is why they have been mocked so much, and were even laughed at in school.

But as posh as they were, William friends didn't really hold back.

Pippa very wisely married a wealthy man, but away from these circles and in one where her connection with the royal family are seen as impressive. The girl has done well, good for her.

mrscampbellblackagain · 04/10/2020 12:27

Agree with many others that you get nice and not so nice people through out every socio-economic group.

I never get the hatred for the self made on here. I have way more respect for those who have made their own money rather than those who have inherited it.

wewillmeetagain · 04/10/2020 12:27

I have a relative ( we are a working class family) who hasn't done badly for themselves through hard work and determination. They have however turned into the most overbearing, arrogant snob! They are extremely judgemental and only their opinion matters and is obviously always right!

JonHammIsMyJamm · 04/10/2020 12:28

@Happymum12345

A very posh lady I know (distant royal) walked into my 1930’s semi & said oh, it’s much nicer than I expected it to be.
How’s that for a backhanded compliment Shock!
mrscampbellblackagain · 04/10/2020 12:28

The Middleton children had a trust fund I believe which paid for their education from their father's family. They weren't exactly your normal middle class family.

HollywoodHandshake · 04/10/2020 12:31

@mrscampbellblackagain

The Middleton children had a trust fund I believe which paid for their education from their father's family. They weren't exactly your normal middle class family.
you are talking about wealth, not background. The 2 are completely unrelated.

Some people have both, or just one, or neither. It's irrelevant.

JonHammIsMyJamm · 04/10/2020 12:32

@mrscampbellblackagain

Agree with many others that you get nice and not so nice people through out every socio-economic group.

I never get the hatred for the self made on here. I have way more respect for those who have made their own money rather than those who have inherited it.

I feel the same, @mrscampbellblackagain. The idea that ‘old money’ is somehow more respectable than newly acquired wealth is laughable, especially when you consider how a lot of the old wealthy families made their fortunes.
HollywoodHandshake · 04/10/2020 12:33

What I find amusing is there's always a post about "only in the UK".
It's true that with a Monarchy social classes are pretty obvious, but most countries have "posh" folks, have people from wealthy circles, new money, old money, middle class and working class, and a lot of "aspirational" elements.

It really is not specific to the UK, why would you ever think it would be!

IncandescentSilver · 04/10/2020 12:35

Theres so many degrees of "poshness", its all relative. A lot of people who aren't remotely posh may try to look down on others for not fitting into their "set".

My family are relatively posh, though in a rural, landed gentry way, as in a lot of them didn't have to work for a living and lived in Georgian country houses. I grew up in one for part of the time so my childhood was spent teaching my pony to lead down an ancient set of polished stone steps around the back of the walled garden to his field and evading everyone who told me (rightly) that it was dangerous because they were so slippy (but it was much quicker). I was always slightly orange tinged in winter, before fake tan came along, because our water came out of the taps that colour when rainfall was high.

Anyway...I treat everyone the same and am disappointed when they are not. I don't consider myself posh and deliberately don't cultivate a posh accent, although when drunk or annoyed it can become very posh. My mother was the same and used to look down upon people who were either too "brash" (new money/can't stop talking about it) or just ill mannered. She had an inbuilt hatred of housing estates (even expensive new ones), monobloc driveways and men who drink regularly in pubs. She also hated Edinburgh's New Town for some reason, and referred to the rears of the tenements as "looking like falling-down slums".

I know a lot of "posh" people. Some of the older aristocratic Scottish men at the top of the landed money pile are seriously unpleasant with little good to be said for them, especially those around East Lothian/the outskirts of Edinburgh. The ones from Perthshire always seem to be nice. A lot of Eton and Harrow educated men are very decent. The worst I find are these late forties plus women who have never worked but have somehow married into money and then wasted years building up their self image to something far more important than it actually is.

But my family are also very clever and well educated, and thats a whole other level of posh. I moved to the Borders for a while and I remember being out with a local hunt and being asked by one of the snooty wannabee posh girls there, as I was hinting that one of my horses was for sale, whether I was a horse dealer. "Good heavens, no" I said. "I'm a lawyer. What is it you do?"

As for men, I'm single and I can sniff out a whiff of what I can only describe as "roughness" all too easily. Its something to do with the ability to smirk, or rough skin, or a pointy nose, or something! Or just the general attitude. I was speaking to a man online dating the other day and it was all going well - his skin wasn't terribly rough and his feature were relatively symmetrically arranged - until we discussed hobbies. He told me his included "like going to the pub for a couple of pints, don't usually drink much in the house" and that was enough to put me off. I previously dated a man who was unemployed for a couple of years, so its not anything to do with money. Its much more intrinsic.

But in answer to your question OP, I'd say the real deciding feature is whether you have the confidence to stand up to anyone who is treating you wrongly and put them in their place politely yet icily. Or whether you have the confidence to be slightly eccentric and comfortable enough in your own skin to go your own way - this post is an example of that.

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