To be annoyed at new boss' pregnancy?

[Biscoffscoff]

Ok so I know I probably am. But I need to vent (and preferably not at a pregnant woman) And maybe get some advice about boundaries.

I work in child protection, and it's a stressful job. I'm not going to complain about that part - you have to accept that when you choose the role. But having a good manager makes a massive difference to being able to do the job without burning out, especially as good supervision helps deal with the emotional side of the work. The nature of the job means it's very difficult for people to cover if a manager isn't available - not just because the other managers are too busy with their teams but even if they were free, the manager needs to know the families and the dynamics to be able to help.

The woman who got the managers job used to do (my level) job years ago, so she knows what it's like to be in it. She left to move away from front line work as she wanted more a break/more predictable hours. I was surprised to hear that she'd gone for the job.

A month into post and she's announced her pregnancy. She's already had to take quite a lot of time off sick, or working from home - the team aren't WFH and not having the manager in the building is difficult.

I can't help but be a little bit peed off that she went for this job. She got married earlier in the year and from what I've heard from colleagues in her old team, she was very open about hopes of starting a family once she was married. I know noone knows when/if it's going to happen when TTC but her old job was secure and far less stress, so I just feel a bit peeved that she chose this time to go for this job. I can't imagine that she would/could return to the post after mat leave - the job really isn't accommodating for childcare. I know thats not very feminist but it's the reality - its mainly a female workforce and people usually move out of this part to have kids and move back when they're older.

New boss is already asking me to cover for tasks when she's not in, or in late/leaving early, eg supporting less experienced colleagues. I'm also struggling with the idea that I've got no real support for the next six months - doesn't feel like there's any point getting her up to speed when she'll be off soon.

How do I put in boundaries about the extra work that's being expected of me when new boss isn't around? And how do I get past being annoyed that new boss is going to be just passing through, and not really there for support ?

I think you had a bad choice of title there OP. Had you said "AIBU to not want to do my Line Managers job for no extra pay" then I doubt anyone would have said YABU.
You have been dumped in it and it does seem unfair that you're expected to pick up LM responsibilities because she isn't around much. Presumably had you wanted the role you would have applied for it.

Do you have a union rep you could talk to about the extra work you're getting burdened with ?

@022828MAN but it is. That's the problem. In this line of work, especially child protection, your manager is your go to for everything. You have supervision with them every 4 weeks where you discuss your cases and emotional wellbeing.

Your manager knows your cases, is on your speedial for instant decision making. In dangerous / urgent situations. You get my point. If they aren't there, it can't just wait.

[quote StormzyInaDCup]@022828MAN but it is. That's the problem. In this line of work, especially child protection, your manager is your go to for everything. You have supervision with them every 4 weeks where you discuss your cases and emotional wellbeing.

Your manager knows your cases, is on your speedial for instant decision making. In dangerous / urgent situations. You get my point. If they aren't there, it can't just wait.[/quote]
No, it really isn't. People will take new jobs, leave, get pregnant, be off sick.
It is not the sole responsibility of the manager. Social Work is an entire sector. If there's issues with leadership and management (not ONE manager) then that's an institutional problem, not something for one single individual to solve, nor should she put her family life on hold either.

@StormzyInaDCup

You viewpoints on this woman’s pregnancy is very concerning particularly as your in a position of power being ‘3 grades higher’.
What you said about the role of a child protection manager is true, however you opinions apply that childbearing women have no rights in such a role, I wonder how much your viewpoints prejudice the recruitment decisions you make. Social care has always been a female dominant profession therefore it should have the infrastructure to expect and cope with pregnancies not blame one woman for her choices. The sooner women like you retire from the role the better. I hope the next generation are forward thinking regarding women’s rights to family life.

@rookiemere I thought I'd addressed it in the OP but I didn't expect so many would just respond to the title.

Honestly, the posts in here have made me wary of seeking direct support through work in case I'm perceived as being discriminatory. I will try and seek support but more when something comes up I'll badger other managers to step in I think - to highlight that the support isn't there.

A few posters have asked me how id feel if a man was in post who was trying for a family. In my experience, working in this part of the service takes a lot (from anyone). If anyone of any gender had a reason that meant working long or unpredictable hours was difficult I wouldn't expect them to do it in a full time CP job. It's really normal in this work to move internally (eg to an adoption team or fostering team, which are still challenging but in a different way) for reasons such as having a long term health condition that means you need time off/appointments, or fixed hours to fit in with caring responsibilities, or going through a tough time in your personal life where you need to protect your own resilience (eg dealing with a divorce). Those are equivalent pay/grade and thats just what people do - it's not considered a bad thing, if anything it's good for your CV to have a range of experience. People who want to make their career out of CP commonly go work in another area for a change after a certain number of years then come back to it once they feel a bit refreshed. It's a really common way to ensure longevity in the field. I'd not thought about that being unusual compared to other industries before but it's probably because that's so normal in my workplace that it was a suprise someone came back into it at this point in their life, at that level.
As I mentioned doing it at a social worker level is tough but still doable, though usually only if the partner has a more flexible job or if you've got a lot of family support as you can't just walk out of a visit at 5pm on the dot.

I've worked in a CP team where in the space of 2 months we had 3 different managers so oversight and support wasn't really happening (it was dangerous) so I completely get why you're worried about the next few months. I think your ire is misdirected though. Really it is for higher mangement to recognise that your team needs to be adequately supported and to put that in, either by having a deputy manager who will know the cases or by relieving you of some of your case work to take on management tasks. Your manager's pregnancy isn't the issue - the lack of response from higher management is.

You’re being ridiculous - Fine to take a new job - trying for a baby or not!! And what she does when she comes back to work after the child is born is not really your business / you can’t know it’s not suitable to do this job and find childcare to suit - have you ever heard of a nanny!? Or maybe her husband will do the childcare

I started off being unsympathetic but actually I really am sympathetic now because until this woman goes on mat leave the reality is that her team will have to bear the extra strain of having nobody 'present’ for them and it’s shit. I’ve just taken over from someone who’s WFH for months and the team are so thankful to have me in the office, it’s not the same when you don’t have those corridor conversations in a fast paced and high stress job especially where you deal with distressing and upsetting things. Nobody puts cover in place for someone who’s nominally still ‘doing the work’. I get why the woman took the job, but it is still shit for the team. Both sides have a right to feel as they do.

FWIW I’d like to TTC but I won’t until my EDD will be after the end of my contract because I took this specialist job knowing the contract length and I don’t think for the sake of a month or so it’s fair to fuck things up for my team. I wouldn’t ask anyone else to do that but it felt like the right thing for me.

[quote Biscoffscoff]@StormyZinaDcup thanks for your post. I can tell many don't understand the role as its not one where you can just 'say no' and leave work on your managers desk. And if a child is a risk or an asye is looking panic stricken or someone comes back after an awful visit I'm not going to just point them to a phone and say it's not my problem. I would of course love it if working conditions were better for women in this part of the sector, and I'll be optimistic things might improve but it's going to be baby steps. My (geographic) area hasn't done well with over the last ten years (unemployment, associated crime and drug use of deprivation, cuts to services etc) and that means our dept probably isn't in a good place compared to some others posting in the thread. We're certainly not unique but maybe not representative (or I hope it isn't)

I've been pushing for supervision so I can raise some of these issues but haven't had a response as yet. I will continue to do so. I don't think the need for support is yet recognised by others, partly because new manager will (, understandably) be wanting to give the impression she's managing, partly because noone will want there to be issues and partly because she's officially still working most her hours, but as iv said earlier when we're in the office and she's WFH the support isn't as effective.[/quote]
I’ve said no before. Not, obviously, in scenarios where there is an immediate risk. But boundaries are incredibly important, and the ability to assess when saying No is the right thing to do. You can’t pour from an empty jug, as they say.

I sympathise with the constant management changes - it’s incredibly unsettling and in my experience very common - but it’s a structural issue not a personal one. I dealt with the issues by leaving, which I’m afraid a lot of people do.

And yes the problem is with the organisation rather than this woman in particular

I also think that part of the reason SWs go without enough support sometimes is because they just suck it up and do the work so there's no onus on higher management to take any action.

I think you need to raise the additional work you are doing as an issue with your manager and ask how it is going to be resolved. If that isn't satisfactory, raise it with higher management. Don't just accept crap - make management manage effectively.

I'm not suggesting you leave any child or nqsw in the lurch, but record it, raise it through the correct channels and say that it's an issue for you.

No I’d be annoyed too. You need some one solid in this role and some one planning a family just doesn’t cut the mustard. It effects everyone including the kids.

I know that’s very un PC but when your talking about child welfare the person in charge needs to be dedicated - You can’t do that if your planning a family especially in social care.

I have a SW friend who is at breaking point and thinking about quitting but too involved with cases to leave it’s having a massive impact on her relationship, she has no kids. I also have a friend that has long term fostered that is basically getting no help from the agency despite repeat requests.

OP this isn’t about sexism this is about people not be available when they are most defiantly needed - man or woman. If you take on a managerial position in child protection you need to be ready to dedicate your self to it. It really isn’t a 9-5 job

@Shayisgreat I'm not angry at my manager. Just a bit disappointed when we got the news, as id thought we were finally getting somewhere! Ironically id previously moved from another LA that was worse....

I hope they'll put someone in but I can't see that they'll do so until she's on mat leave at least. She's still working for a while yet. I'm not questioning the validity of her wfh (and I don't know but I would think with covid that'd need to be encouraged anyway for her own health?) just that unfortunately it does impact on the team and it does make the job harder.

Im not looking to take on management tasks (not by choice) I didn't apply for the job when it came up as it's not something id want to do. Realistically they wouldn't take my cases off me as its primarily court work and that doesn't easily transfer (or it's certainly not something senior managers would want transferring unless unavoidable eg when staff leave)

I think your Line Manager’s pregnancy is a red herring here OP. If you'd worded it without referring to the pregnancy, you may have received more constructive replies, rather than so many focussing on calling you anti-feminist, or telling you that you are policing your LM's womb(!).

"After a long period without a permanent LM, a new one has just been employed in the role, but she has already taken lots of time off and has been asking me to cover for her and to take on some of her job. On top of this, she has asked for a 6-12 month sabbatical, which she is due to begin in 6 months time. This will mean we have another, temporary LM to cover for her.

My job is stressful and involves child protection. It is imperative that I have a good relationship with my LM, that they have a working knowledge of my caseload and are available at all times, to make quick decisions in relation to the protection of the children on my caseload. Additionally, the role of my LM includes monitoring my mental health, to ensure that my caseload is not taking too much of a toll and that I remain fit to do my job.

I am concerned that she is not focussed on the job, that I and the rest of the team are not getting the support we need and that her heart may not be in it. AIBU to expect more, consistent support from my LM, and if not, how should I go about getting it?"

A bit late now, but I absolutely get the gist of your post and agree that YANBU. @StormzyInaDCup appears to have lots of experience and some very sound advice, I hope some of it helps.

@Shayisgreat

I also think that part of the reason SWs go without enough support sometimes is because they just suck it up and do the work so there's no onus on higher management to take any action.

I think you need to raise the additional work you are doing as an issue with your manager and ask how it is going to be resolved. If that isn't satisfactory, raise it with higher management. Don't just accept crap - make management manage effectively.

I'm not suggesting you leave any child or nqsw in the lurch, but record it, raise it through the correct channels and say that it's an issue for you.

Yes! Absolutely this. I’ve met quite a few martyrs in the job. Me, I’m an ornery bugger. But also the one that everyone else relies upon to speak up and speak out.

It’s weird that it’s a job that requires resilience, assertiveness and communication skills, yet so many SWs struggle to use these skills when talking to management.

I don't agree - social workers and social work managers shouldn't be expected to have nothing outside their job. That's an unfair expectation and leads to situations where SWs are completely overworked as they feel that they have no right to say no.

She has every right and yabu

Just to clarify, I’m not suggesting that OP is a martyr, but I do think these are conversations you need to be having, Biscoff. I do get how you feel as I found constant changes in management highly stressful - for me, my manager is the most important part of the job - but rather than focus on her choices and get pregnancy, you need to be having conversations with senior management about the impact on staff and how they will be intending to address these issues.

Just to add as I'm sure some posters in here think I was just posting to be goady or insult pregnant women - what I was actually looking for in the thread, and had specified (but I presume many skipped over) was advice about boundaries.
I am sure my new boss isn't having a great time if she's needing this time off anyway and I was feeling guilty over being stressed about the extra work/impact. In the team were all one title, but as I've been doing the job a while peers do naturally come to me for guidance (which Im happy to do - but to a point!) So one of the reasons for posting was about how to handle this situation, and whether it was even fair of me to try and assert some boundaries over this or whether I should suck it up to be supportive..

At least despite the obvious conflict in this thread the consensus on both sides seems to be that I am allowed to feel aggrieved at the impact on my role and responsibilities and to push back on that. As said above I will be very cautious about how I go about it but at least the right to do so is something I'm feeling a little more confident about.

I don’t think your being unreasonable, I’d be pretty pissed off as well.

@FenellaVelour I disagree that SWs often sent assertive or don't have communication skills. In my experience SWs ask for stuff, pressure those above about workloads, how unrealistic the work is, request senior managers visit to see it, take it to unions, take it to BASW, etc - unfortunately doing all of those things rarely results in enough things changing in the system to make a lasting change to the job.

The managers above us aren't evil, they were in our shoes once. They're sympathetic but their hands are tied in many ways - the demand keeps growing and the support services have been cut to the bone. A societal shift about how the services are funded and valued would be needed for the overall conditions to change. Those senior managers might not be doing as emotionally draining work as they're a step removed but they also work long hours and have a lot of responsibility.

@Mumisnotmyonlyname

She has every right and yabu

As a female to reproduce yes, but morally does she have a right to take a position in which she can’t dedicate her self to children that are in dire need?

What’s more important - her need to reproduce or the kids that seriously need help immediately? She could pass up that role at satisfy both at different times.

I’m an ardent feminist, but seeing what I’ve seen it’s not fair on the living breathing kids that need in immediate help if your planning on taking 9 months away.

[quote Biscoffscoff]@FenellaVelour I disagree that SWs often sent assertive or don't have communication skills. In my experience SWs ask for stuff, pressure those above about workloads, how unrealistic the work is, request senior managers visit to see it, take it to unions, take it to BASW, etc - unfortunately doing all of those things rarely results in enough things changing in the system to make a lasting change to the job.

The managers above us aren't evil, they were in our shoes once. They're sympathetic but their hands are tied in many ways - the demand keeps growing and the support services have been cut to the bone. A societal shift about how the services are funded and valued would be needed for the overall conditions to change. Those senior managers might not be doing as emotionally draining work as they're a step removed but they also work long hours and have a lot of responsibility.[/quote]
Oh I agree, which is why I left local authority social work. I personally found that there were plenty who didn’t speak up and were basically drowning as a result. I was personally very strict with boundaries, which helped me cope until I saw that nothing I said or did would ultimately bring about any structural change, and I think the situation you are in is one that definitely calls for assertion of boundaries.

@everywherethatmarywent nope - even SWs are morally allowed to have children. Do you really think the whole child protection workforce should be 1. Childless people 2. People whose children who are older? I think that's a very unreasonable expectation. We're allowed lives outside work. (And we're certainly not paid enough to compensate for not having lives outside work) If you removed women who may have young children or get pregnant at some stage in the next few years from the workforce, you would decimate an already stuggling area. Why do you think SWs should be martyrs to their job?

It's not often I'll not RTFT before replying but I think you need support and it's late @Biscoffscoff

I've worked in many front line teams and in child protection. In one team I joined as there was a shake up and didn't receive adequate supervision and know how this can impact on your work.

So,I don't think that you're BU in your frustration but think that this is a structural/systemic problem and needs to be viewed this way.

I'm now going to bookmark and read the rest of your thread tomorrow. I wanted you to know that there are others who can relate and to offer empathy and support through this before I turn in for the night and to wish you a good night's sleep.

Take lots of care of you,you know this is essential so you can help others