What are we doing wrong with our boys?

[OhNoItsMonday]

NC for this. Mum of boys here.

I love my DC to pieces. They're too young for school yet. But I've already noticed that, whenever you hear complaints about badly behaved children in the classroom (or often outside it), it usually although not always seems to be boys who are being complained about. Just wondering why that is? What are we doing wrong with our boys?

@secondaccount

As a mum of 4 boys I don't always think the school day gives them enough opportunity to run and let off energy. Boys need walking every day just like big dogs and if you dont get them out they will act up like big dogs would. I used to particularly hate the teachers who would keep badly behaved boys in at break. Madness.

Yes exactly this. I had three boys in five years and when they were young it was vital to get out every day to let them let off steam.

When mine were in primary, a primary 3 child took a turn of manning the door for those wanting in and out the toilet in the infants playground at morning and afternoon break, meaning that if they all took their turn, each child would miss their break for this duty about once every 3 weeks - fine. However, some children were "too naughty" to be allowed to do this so they got their break all the time and DC like my son missed theirs more often.

Then they'd miss breaks in later years to do litter picking in the playground except my DC never dropped litter, others proudly proclaimed it was the janitor's job and dropped litter everywhere and once again, were not to be trusted with the litter picker things or even gloves and a bag.

Drove me mental but I guess it sets up decent DC for adulthood where they work hard to get by and troublemakers get stuff handed to them on a plate.

And I say that as a child brought up in poverty in a big family on a council estate. We all behaved though as my parents wouldn't have stood for anything less. My child was bullied, by boys and girls, half from very middle class backgrounds and half from poor backgrounds - it really made no difference.

We recently saw parents allowing their son to get away with whatever he wanted. The child looked about 10 years old. His dad gave him clear instructions, for example "sit down and eat your meal" and the child completely ignored him. The dad just shrugged his shoulders helplessly.

I couldn't believe what I was witnessing. It's no wonder the child wasn't doing as he was told, he knew there was no need.

Is this normal parenting these days?

I've heard this a lot over the years 'boys need lots of exercise to make them manageable'. My girls were exactly the same. We were out in all weather every day, walking, running, climbing ... then they would be happier to sit and watch a film later or do something calm(ish)!

They're late teens now and I remember the arguments with mother in law when DD1 would choose spiderman pyjamas or she'd turn up for sunday lunch in her chelsea football kit. MIL absolutely hated it "Why haven't you put her in a dress", "why don't you buy pink/fairy pyjamas like her sister wears" .......

No idea op. My sons always been friends with girls and I noticed the girls got away with a lot tbh. In primary they would hit him or snatch stuff and he wouldn't hit back as he would get in trouble. Really pissed me off. 'Oh she's only a little girl'. There was one who I'm sure only stopped because I told him next time hit her back. She cried to her mum and no I didn't tell him off. She hit him infront of me before then skipped of smiling little so and so.

I have 3 boys...

The first is caring, gentle, quiet and sensitive. He's 9. Loves to colour, crosswords, read. Hates football. Very sporty, loads of energy and will exercise forever if given the chance.

The second is 7. He's a dancer. Hates writing. Loves reading. Very elegant and into twirling and dressing up. A thinker

My third is 4. He loves football. He's cuddly, adores writing (writes loads of notes all day every day). He is boisterous.

It's just personality. Not sex. If I hear "boys will be boys" said by one more mother of a boy who has hurt one of my sons I won't be responsible for my actions... Take some personal responsibility. If my second or first child had been a girl I'd probably be saying the same, that girls just loved to draw and read.... because that's what mine do but they're boys!

Same as my partners niece thinking of it! They are teens but shes a tear older and she presses my buttons, she just hits him in the back and random crap like that, no one says anything to her and she hits hard! We dont visit them anymore as it was getting to the point he was so frustrated I could see him punching her in the face. If he kept hitting her bet they'd have something to say. I felt bad as was awkward for me to pull her up on it infront of all my partners family who obviously see no issue.

@trixiebelden77 agree 100% with what you said.

The relative lack of male primary teachers and a curriculum and methods of teaching that disfavour kinesthetic learners are big problems in getting better outcomes for boys. These things are well known, but nobody really is putting much effort into sorting them out.

Why can’t we just treat them all as children? Well exactly. I've got 4 kids, 3 boys. They all had their strengths and weaknesses and I never once dismissed a problem as just being because of their sex.

everything is so - it is simply laid down by nature that they are more active and not obedient. this is normal for children)

Scientists who research SEN may be male or they find male presentation of problems easier to spot. For example a child who shouts or hits out is easier to notice than a child who is sitting quietly trying not to cry.

From a classroom management point of view the latter isn't causing trouble to other kids so is probably ignored in favour of the kids who might lash out at other kids. (This is not a teacher bashing point- 2 adults and 30+ kids ie funding is the issue)

I suspect that many SEN are under diagnosed in girls rather than boys being the problem

As a mum of 4 boys I don't always think the school day gives them enough opportunity to run and let off energy. Boys need walking every day just like big dogs and if you dont get them out they will act up like big dogs would. I used to particularly hate the teachers who would keep badly behaved boys in at break. Madness

Totally agree.

I also think it's very unfair that when girls misbehave they are punished more severely than a boy would be, because girls are meant to be nice (and of course girls who tell other kids what to do are "bossy" whereas boys who do the same have leadership skills). Boys do get away with more in some respects - but on the other hand they are naturally boisterous and it does take time for them to grow out of it (and clearly many never do). On the other hand, the more we try to get boys to behave well, the less toxic masculinity we will hopefully have. There is a limit to how much you can iron out millennia of evolution, though.

I also think it's very unfair that when girls misbehave they are punished more severely than a boy would be

I really disagree with this. I think schools are much harsher when boys are badly behaved mainly because the bad behaviour presents differently. So the boys may hit each other...as this is a violent offence, it's an automatic detention and a phone call home. I don't disagree with this punishment. But a girl saying something really cruel and nasty, is dealt with by a teacher having a quiet chat with them. Like I said previously, my dd was greatly affected my one girl being so vicious to her...the hurt was far more than when a boy in my ds class hit him.

I also think it's very unfair that when girls misbehave they are punished more severely than a boy would be, because girls are meant to be nice

I have never seen (or done) this. Schools generally have behaviour policies about what the consequences are for different types of behaviour. It's not done according to sex. Girls are punished less, because their misbehaviour tends to be of a less directly challenging and confrontational type.

Not in my son's class (Yr 3) it's 50:50 - girls usually being unkind and bitchy and boys usually taking stuff without asking and pushing - schools tend to follow-up with parents on the physical stuff - unfair but there you have it.

According to my father and boyfriend is that schools are feminizing them. Dinosaur club.

schools tend to follow-up with parents on the physical stuff - unfair but there you have it
I'd agree that physical stuff shpuld be dealt with more harshly than unkind remarks tbh (unless it's something like racist or otherdiscriminatory remarks - which schools usually come down on like a ton of bricks).

I'd agree that physical stuff shpuld be dealt with more harshly than unkind remarks tbh

I'm not so sure. The horrible comment made to my dd deeply affected her and her confidence for years. My ds got punched by his best mate...got home and told me, then afterwards shrugged and said "we're still best friends".

I think bad behaviour/ bad parenting is more obvious in boys (very generally speaking). My DS had also had a teacher who were obviously favoured the girls which was upsetting. I have to say I've never seen girls more harshly punished!

There is one parent is DSs class who is constantly bringing out the 'boys will be boys' and specifically tells him it's ok to be physical with the boys but not girls - despite routinely making at least one boy cry per park date/ party.

Boys make nasty comments too. Up until teen years it was invariably boys calling my children fat, or commenting negatively on them doing some work well, or belittling their hobbies. Physically harming them was never an issue.

A lot of people are suggesting that the issue is that girls are parented more harshly and less indulgently, but I'm not sure this is true. Studies have shown that - upsettingly - people are more likely to describe newborn boys as 'angry' and girls as 'sad' when they cry, that perhaps because of this they're quicker to comfort girls and that parents touch and make eye contact with girls more often. Arguably we should be being softer, not harder, with our boys. Someone upthread pointed to the far, far greater number of criminal boys and men - but given that criminals are far more likely to have been abused as children than the general population it doesn't seem like their parents being too indulgent is the issue here, unless we're counting neglect.

I'm also not sure that we've got it right with girls and that we just need to do the same with boys - girls are, for instance, at much higher risk of mental health issues (though boys, somewhat paradoxically, have a higher suicide rate). Teaching girls to be compliant might make parents' lives easier but it doesn't mean it's better for them.

My DD is 3 and is being bothered, let's say, by a boy at her nursery. He's told her he's going to 'punch her in the face' and on Wednesday he followed through with his threat and hit her twice

You've got to wonder where a child is learning to make threats like that.

Very sad, and awful for your DD.

We expect our children to go to school, sit down, concentrate and conform from the age of 4/5! When all they want to do is run around and play

I don't think that's true of all children. I've known many a child who would rather read or draw than run around. One (a boy) taught himself to play a keyboard at a very early age and played music non-stop throughout his childhood. His brother was similar in temperament and their idea of exercise was a long walk in the countryside.