Ban the term "so-called" honour killings"

[areallthenamesusedup]

Am I wrong to think that we should stop using the term as it is sugar coating murder?

Using the word 'honour'...even with the prefix 'so-called'....is dressing something as "cultural" and thus disguises that these killings are just plain & simple misogyny.

Am I wrong to think that "so called-honour killings" are just murder.

It seems to be a term in wide use but I am genuinely puzzled why it is acceptable.

how about a culturally specific killing or homicide.
i think it cannot be called a murder until a court decides it was murder.
killing suggests a violent or sudden death that needs to be investigated.
murder is a judicial matter, likewise manslaughter.
it's the honour word that's the real issue.
terms do changeover time. i think something better could be found.

@HotPenguin

When white people kill family members who try to escape their control and abuse it is never called "honour killing". To me using the label "honour killing" is in a way minimising the crime, it's othering the victim and reassuring the rest of us that it won't happen to us it's just "part of their culture". I wonder whether the rates of men killing family members are different for different races and backgrounds?

This

@SandyY2K

Absolutely nothing and she was eventually raped and murdered with the full knowledge of her parents.

I’ve been reading about the Banaz Mahmoud case over the past few days and have been disgusted by the three men who boasted about raping her. What honour was there in that? The hypocrisy is astounding and rage-inducing.

However, I don’t think there is any evidence that Banaz’s father, uncle or mother knew she would be raped. It’s more likely they thought she would be killed quickly.

*Banaz Mahmod (auto-correct strikes)

Call it Culturally Motivated Murder

At times certain words reflect the circumstances of the crime

Race hate murder, honour murder, gang murder

you are not being asked to be understanding but the fact is honour in many cultures rests on the shoulders of women and girls should they Be perceived to step out of line they are violently punished This shouldn’t be ignored the word should be used as it’s relevant to their circumstances

@SandyY2K

Actually yes. Their culture and community think it's right...

Can we please be mindful of generalising a whole culture / community?

There are 12 cases of ‘honour’ killings (maybe we should call them ‘dishonourable killings’) per year in the UK. (There may be more that we’re unaware of). And there are over 4 million + Asians/Arabs in the UK. That’s 0.000003%.

Dishonourable killings are not a part of anyone’s culture, it’s an aberrant practice that’s not sanctioned by any ethnicity/race/religion. A man / group of men wielding power over their friends and family does not make cultural practice.

I’m Asian and reading about Banaz Mahmoud, Shafilea Ahmed, Surjit Athwal and every woman dishonourably murdered fills me with rage.

Agree the term should not be used.

I also hate “child pornography” it is images of child abuse.

"YABU. An honour killing is a type of murder. It's not being watered down or sugar-coated at all. You sound as dumb as saying that calling someone a "serial killer" is sugar-coating calling them a "murderer". It's not, you're being silly."

You obviously haven't been anywhere near the inside of the justice system. The language used makes all the difference. The OP is right and is being neither "dumb" nor "silly". Your own use of language @JunkCrumpet needs work

"Call it Culturally Motivated Murder"

Can't you just call it murder?

Can't you just call it murder?

(Patiently)
Well, yes, it IS murder but we also need to sub-categorize murder into different kinds. Otherwise, as pointed out by several PPs, it makes it harder to track said murders, collect accurate statistics, spot trends etc. all of which makes it harder to prevent such crimes or apprehend the criminals.

I don't think "culturally motivated murder" is right either. Such crimes have probably taken place in all kinds of cultures, and it risks being "unnecessarily" inflammatory.

I think we need to come up with a better term than "honor killings" but we do need a term of some kind.

'Just call it murder' well if you kill someone in self defence or knock a toddler over who stepped out between 2 parked cars and you did not see them, or give a meal and you did not realise they were allergic and they died and many other ways of killing someone

Can be considered murder but does calling it just murder help?

@greenteafiend thanks for that but you don't need to "explain" (patiently).

No, we don't need a "term" to be able to notice murders that are happening around us. Quite the opposite. Giving it a "term" gives it an excuse, a reason. And those who are reluctant to come forward and report what they know cling to that excuse.

Murder is just that.

"give a meal and you did not realise they were allergic"

That's not murder, the CPS would not take it as such

I think the use this word is helpful in identifying the crime accurately and discussions then happen in that context.

"Just call it murder' well if you kill someone in self defence or knock a toddler over who stepped out between 2 parked cars and you did not see them, or give a meal and you did not realise they were allergic and they died and many other ways of killing someone

Can be considered murder but does calling it just murder help"

In fact, you deserve a full quote because none of the incidences you describe would be tried as a murder charge.

I have two main issues I have with the term 'so-called honour killings'

The first issue, is that the wording suggests that there are some legitimate, justified and recognised honour killings 'that shouldn't be lumped in with the lies.' Which is billshit, it's still murder.

The second issue, as PPs have touched upon, is that there are no other types of murder that are categorised by motives. There are no 'so called serial killers', no 'so called aggrivated sexual attackers'. Murder is murder is murder for both reasons above.

Honestly though, my first impression wasn't that it was being glorified. It seems more like the media is trying to paint a negative picture on the practices of different storieies.

Let’s be honest here, this wasn’t MURDER
Continued

It was PRE MEDITATED MURDER.
For anyone who doesn’t know what that means , you can google it .
But it means it was Planned, arranged down to every detail .
She didn’t stand a chance no matter how strong she was or how hard she fought .
Totally shocking .

Can I just say my fil thought it would be an honour killing to lump off his mates first wife.

I do not agree with killing women for not abiding by I think any rules.

I don't agree with killing anybody or the death sentence.

Mariola321,
Religious Indian man ??
Are you drunk?
WTF .

@JunkCrumpet

This thread is hilarious. Why don't we stop using words all together? Just point at people and give a thumbs up or a thumbs down to determine if they're good or bad. Otherwise someone will find some reason to be offended by something.

Is it that simple? Ffs