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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder when complying with the law became optional?

132 replies

AlexaShutUp · 21/09/2020 22:35

I know lots of people disagree with the various covid restrictions, and I understand that position, but that isn't what this thread is about.

Rather, I'm really surprised by the number of people who say that they have no intention of complying with the law simply because they don't agree with it. They are not protesting against the restrictions, just ignoring them.

I always thought that people in the UK generally had respect for the rule of law, but it is as if people now think it's just a matter of personal choice/preference?

I know I shouldn't really be surprised. Our PM seems happy to break international law and his senior advisers freely ignore their own government guidance, so on one level, I don't blame people for thinking fuck it, I'll do what I want. But still, I'm surprised by the number of people who seem to regard obeying the law as optional.

AIBU to think that the law is still the law, whether we like it or not?

OP posts:
Pepperwort · 21/09/2020 22:44

You answered your own question. When our leaders consider themselves above the law there is no real reason to respect it.

swashbucklecheer · 21/09/2020 22:46

When you drive to Barnard Castle for an eye test

evilkitten · 21/09/2020 22:46

Isn't it fine to break it if you're doing it in a limited and specific way?

FatBottomedGurl · 21/09/2020 22:47

@Pepperwort

You answered your own question. When our leaders consider themselves above the law there is no real reason to respect it.
This ^

This "one rule for them and one for us" ideology has, historically, led to revolutions. A few folk refusing to comply with mask wearing and curfews isn't in the same category, but it's a start.

We are the many and they are the few.

mediumperiperi · 21/09/2020 22:47

People are treating COVID laws like term time holidays and think they are unlikely to be caught and if they are then they'll pay the fine. COVID laws aren't being enforced. I don't blame shops and public transport companies for this - (employee safety should be their top concern) or the lack of police (they don't decide their funding)

Mellonsprite · 21/09/2020 22:48

They’re just so fucking hypocritical I have no real issue ignoring them. The Cummings thing blew it for me. Why should I bother when I saw they lengths they went to defend him?

Mayorquimby2 · 21/09/2020 22:49

Your government have made it clear that you have to be a mug to abide by the law and the fact that there's such widespread disregard for the covid restrictions mean that there's none of the social shame that normally comes with breaking the law.

Also people will think what's the fucking point in me abiding by it when nobody else is.

StillWeRise · 21/09/2020 22:50

quite
and the restrictions don't have the moral force of law- they just seem to be rules made up on the spur of the moment, not publicly debated nor voted on by our representatives
and of course, not only does our government consider itself above the law but it's own advisors are not held to account when they break it

Ranunculi · 21/09/2020 22:52

I always obey the law, but in this case the law has gone too far. They will not stop me seeing my parents. It’s unacceptable.

StillWeRise · 21/09/2020 22:54

HOWEVER, when our government is clearly incapable of keeping us safe I'll be guided by the best evidence I can find to keep myself, my family and community safe- so I will wear a mask, keep distant wash my hands and limit my contact with others

dangerrabbit · 21/09/2020 22:54

Not only the Cummings thing, but also their open decision to break international law. Why should we keep to it when the people making the laws don't?

ItsGoingTibiaK · 21/09/2020 22:54

The obvious, glib, answer is that, if people complied with the law, we would need a lot fewer police, courts, lawyers, prisons, probation officers etc...

But seriously, I think, on the whole, responsible people comply with laws where they can see that their actions would have a direct victim. So not many people burgle houses, but thousands of people break the speed limit - with no adverse effects the majority of the time.

The problem is, with refusing to adhere to lockdown etc, the effect is too abstract. It’s easy to deny that your personal breaking of the law caused any adverse effect - it was the fault of the government, or people going to pubs, or young people etc.

canigooutyet · 21/09/2020 22:55

Depends if you mean actual laws or batshit laws made up by those who need to get a life.

Tootletum · 21/09/2020 22:56

Because they seem pretty made up on the hoof and are anathema to the way we've lived our lives for centuries? I must go and sit in an office, which magically has no virus. My kids must go to school. But if u stand in the playground to pick them up for five minutes I must now wear a mask because in some magical way that's a risk (realise that's a school rule, not law). I can go to a gym class with 10 people and breathe everywhere, but not to a coffee shop, except if I don't know the people. It's a joke.

MamaGothel · 21/09/2020 22:57

People have always broken laws if they think the danger is low and they are unlikely to get caught. Take speeding for example, or recreational drug use. Both very common.

WetdreamBeliever · 21/09/2020 22:59

Complying with the law always has been optional. I think that you're getting confused with enforcement.

HarryLimeFoxtrot · 21/09/2020 23:05

I expect the law to have had parliamentary scrutiny, not just to have been imposed based on what social media suggests might be popular with whoever Dom is currently tracking. Plus the government communication is dire - so most of the time it isn’t actually clear what the law is meant to cover.

But you’re right. Laws only work if people consent to be bound by them. The current government have lost the trust of the public on Covid. And they don’t have any mechanism for actually policing them.

Original poster
AlexaShutUp · 21/09/2020 23:05

Interesting responses.

I get the point about hypocrisy, totally. When the fuckwits in power don't obey the law, they lose the moral high ground completely. However, I didn't ever obey the law because I respected those who made it. It was more just respect for the law itself.

Interesting points about the lack of enforcement/lack of social shame. I can see why these might be factors in people's decision-making, though they don't factor in my own.

Someone made the comparison to term time holidays, which made me realise that maybe I'm just a rule follower by nature. I used to take dd out of school sometimes when it was authorised by the HT, but stopped when she wasn't able to authorise them any more. Generally, I will obey the law even if I think it's stupid. I would campaign to change a law that I thought was wrong (and have done so), rather than just breaking it.

I don't know, maybe I'm too obedient? Confused But then I think, if everyone just ignores the laws that they don't like, where could that end?

OP posts:
Ellapaella · 21/09/2020 23:06

When you have Dominic Cummings who breaks every single rule in the book, gets away with it and even manages to somehow justify it without even apologising to the public then I think we can't really blame members of the public for taking no notice of these rules themselves.
This government has very much a 'do as I say, not as I do' approach which is a style of leadership that has never gone down very well.

Original poster
AlexaShutUp · 21/09/2020 23:07

People have always broken laws if they think the danger is low and they are unlikely to get caught. Take speeding for example, or recreational drug use. Both very common.

True. Maybe it's just me then.

I drive within the speed limit and have never done drugs either!

OP posts:
MushMonster · 21/09/2020 23:08

You got it OP. They are just following Boris attitude to it

user1536853684 · 21/09/2020 23:15

You shouldn't respect laws because they're laws, you should respect them because they're respectable.

Do you feel the same way about blindly following laws "because it's the law" when it comes to those in oppressive regimes? Do you object to the people of Belarus protesting for instance?

StillWeRise · 21/09/2020 23:19

speeding and recreational drugs are bad examples though
speeding (I speak as someone who had to do the speed awareness course)- the chances of being caught may be low but the consequences to a pedestrian are much worse if hit by a car at 30 than at 20- so it's a law with a good purpose
recreational drugs- may if you are lucky have little impact on you as an individual but the risk to some consumers is significant and more importantly the international trade causes immense harm

MsJaneAusten · 21/09/2020 23:19

Are you single OP? Or in a relationship with someone you don’t live with?

It doesn’t take much imagination to figure out why people want (need?) to break the law. The law is a blunt tool. Real life is more subtle.

Jimdandy · 21/09/2020 23:22

I think people don’t have respect for low level laws, such as speeding, running red lights, littering, etc. Because the chances of getting caught are slim.

Same with this I suppose and as well when the government breaks the rules or interprets them to suit themselves and so does our local Mayor and several councillors you just think “what’s the point?”