If you have no parental help, how do you cope with children?

[afternoonitsraining]

Husband and I are thinking about TTC, but we are both careful people and want to work out finances and things before trying.

Everyone we know seems to rely on their parents for childcare help, and help to buy baby things. We would have none of that due to various issues, we would have to do everything ourselves.

I know it may seem as if counting chickens before they've hatched - maybe we can't conceive anyway. But Childcare is around £60 a day in our area and with no parental help, I just wondered how people who don't earn mega salaries manage with childcare. We wouldn't get universal credit or anything, just child benefit and I would not want to give up working.

What is difficult and costly is childcare, but unless you’re going to never leave the town you grew up in (or stay within a ten mile radius of it) all your life, then you have to pay for it.

what a ridiculous comment, many families cannot afford to pay a nanny, school clubs do not offer long enough hours, holidays club are not available every half term.

Most of us have planned all that when they decided to have a child or several, it's not a surprise, but it's not easy and it's not just "sucking it up"

No family around, I went PT while DW worked full time. A lot of juggling. Gets easier/ cheaper when they start school

We just accepted that once I returned from maternity leave we would have 2 years of childcare being higher than our mortgage before we were eligible for the 30 hours free childcare. We got some discount from the tax free childcare scheme. Then we made a spreadsheet setting out a monthly contribution to EVERYTHING (including eg car and house maintenance, haircuts etc - no nasty surprises) and decided we could afford it.

We spend less on going to the pub and for nice meals out now we have kids.

Round here most people have their parents nearby to help out with childcare, babysit for date nights etc and I'm so jealous but not enough to want to up sticks and move.

We both work full time - no universal credit and because I earn more than DH even though our combined income isn't that high we don't get child benefit anymore

This is how we did it.....and also with twins on the way this is our plan!

• scrap the nursery idea at £60 a day - we had to go with a childminder at a much more reasonable £35 a day

• we will have the twins on a term time only contract so we'll have to take annual leave to cover all "school" holidays but it's much cheaper in the long run. - but as much annual leave from work as you can (both of you)

• find a childminder who is signed up to the tax deee childcare account - government tops up 20% of whatever you pay in

• cut every household bill to the bone - back went the sporty BMW and in came a Ford c Max. Sky got cancelled. Cheapest mobile phones. Food planning is a MUST to save money on the food bill. No luxuries - no holidays, kids clothes from Sainsbury (which are pretty good quality anyway), look for discounted days out tickets, join every loyalty club going to get money off shopping - the Boots parent club is a good one

• budget budget budget - I have spreadsheets and also an expenses app on my own - every single expenditure is logged in there against a weekly budget - if I overspend one week then I have to make more savings the next

• for the twins we plan on taking a £25k bank loan over 10 years and using this to effectively spread the cost of 3 years childcare until 30 hours kicks in

@teawithbetty

So no one with children should ever leave mamas apron strings santa? And you don’t think that’s just a bit ridiculous?

who said that?

What is ridiculous is to pretend that everyone has a well-paid job with short and flexible hours in a job down the road, unlimited wrap-around care in their area, and that everybody can keep their job easily if they feel like it.

In many families one parent, usually the mother which makes sense, had to become a SAH parent because it's physically not possible to do everything.

Pretending that SAH is a CHOICE for everybody is ridiculous, and so is the idea that all areas have all the childcare facilities you want.

There was nearly a year waiting list to put my last one in a local nursery... and that was the easy time!

No parental help here.

We both worked ft with dd1. 2 year age gap then I went back pt 3 days a week. Spent a lot on childcare! Both dd were in nursery then once they were at school we got a childminder for wraparound and some holidays.

Dc are 6 and 8 and I work 4 days a week. We pay around £450 a month childcare, which is obviously much lower than preschool care.

We were pretty broke in the preschool years!

@PotteringAlong

You just crack on. We pay a fortune for childcare. There’s a reason my car is 15 years old and we spend our holidays in a tent, and it’s neither environmental nor due to a love of the great outdoors...

Yep, this. We spent more on childcare than I was earning for about 3 years (two DC, 18mths apart, both in nursery full time, joint earnings slightly too high to qualify for tax credits) so it would've made more financial sense then to give up work till they started school, but jobs are hard to come by in the industry I'm in so it's nigh on impossible to re-enter after time out, plus I needed to work for my own sanity. Youngest DC has just started primary school and we'll be paying back debts for a good few years yet, especially as there's no wraparound childcare available to us right now due to Covid so I've pretty much been forced to go part-time. You just have to cope and make the best of it. DC benefited far more from being in nursery than they would've with me as a SAHM though, I'm convinced of that.

Changed to combinations of shift work/nights and home working with the first dc. Then to full self employment with a childminder for back up. Meant I never really had maternity leave of longer than a few weeks, and there was lots of working through the nights and caring for the dc in the day. But also meant we paid no childcare other than occasional few hours.

@SantaClaritaDiet

What is difficult and costly is childcare, but unless you’re going to never leave the town you grew up in (or stay within a ten mile radius of it) all your life, then you have to pay for it.

what a ridiculous comment, many families cannot afford to pay a nanny, school clubs do not offer long enough hours, holidays club are not available every half term.

Most of us have planned all that when they decided to have a child or several, it's not a surprise, but it's not easy and it's not just "sucking it up"

I’m not the one being ridiculous. I know at least five families with no family help at all. Not one of them have a nanny. In fact, I don’t know even one person with a nanny.

This thread is bonkers.

teawithbetty

I know at least five families with no family help at all. Not one of them have a nanny. In fact, I don’t know even one person with a nanny.

Apart from a few very high-paid couples, I don't know any family at all with 2 full time-working parents and no family help, none 🤷
Go to a local primary school any day of the week and at least half the pick-ups are done by grand-parents, or siblings.

What is ridiculous is picturing every parent doing a well paid 9 to 5 local jobs. Clearly some are, and SOME people are able to juggle work and children. Pretending that everyone is able to do that is just stupid. Why would you even want to do that? Most parents have help because they really need it.

Providing more infrastructures to help more parents would be the solution, not pretending that everything is fine and working with kids is easy.

@afternoonitsraining

Husband and I are thinking about TTC, but we are both careful people and want to work out finances and things before trying.

Everyone we know seems to rely on their parents for childcare help, and help to buy baby things. We would have none of that due to various issues, we would have to do everything ourselves.

I know it may seem as if counting chickens before they've hatched - maybe we can't conceive anyway. But Childcare is around £60 a day in our area and with no parental help, I just wondered how people who don't earn mega salaries manage with childcare. We wouldn't get universal credit or anything, just child benefit and I would not want to give up working.

For me chasing the money when it came to work helped. Also dividing all childcare and household duties 50-50 with DH even during maternity leave - it makes it much easier to fall into a decent routine when you return full time.

@teawithbetty - you are right. I have a really high income and know only high earners with nannies. All the lower earning parents I know are professionals who work full time and tend to use flexi time / wfh to balance home and work life.

No parental help. We used nursery. We paid more in childcare than our mortgage and literally counted down the days till DD turned three, got some.free hours so the bill came down. There's no magic way around it. We cut our cloth accordingly. So no holidays abroad, ran our cars into the ground, swapped the food shop from Asda where we'd spend a small fortune cos DH is attracted by offers to Aldi, got rid of sky, always swapped out utilities and insurances Evey year. Having a child meant we didn't really go out often so saved money there. You just make it work.

I worked 3 days then 4 when we got the free 15 hours childcare. Long hours and a long commute. Luckily husband could drop and collect from childminder on my work days.

@SantaClaritaDiet

teawithbetty

I know at least five families with no family help at all. Not one of them have a nanny. In fact, I don’t know even one person with a nanny.

Apart from a few very high-paid couples, I don't know any family at all with 2 full time-working parents and no family help, none 🤷
Go to a local primary school any day of the week and at least half the pick-ups are done by grand-parents, or siblings.

What is ridiculous is picturing every parent doing a well paid 9 to 5 local jobs. Clearly some are, and SOME people are able to juggle work and children. Pretending that everyone is able to do that is just stupid. Why would you even want to do that? Most parents have help because they really need it.

Providing more infrastructures to help more parents would be the solution, not pretending that everything is fine and working with kids is easy.

But santa you are making it sound as if grandparents are needed to have a family. They are not.

There are other options. A SAHP is one. Childcare is another - after school clubs or childminders. But for most parents it’s flexible working. My DH would be able to pick the kids up most days but he is working from home - it’s a quick twenty minute break in the day. Or one or both of you works PT. Or FT but including a weekend.

No it’s not necessarily EASY but it isn’t on a par with finding the lost city of Atlantis either.

My husband works full time but shifts which he can get into 4.5 days a week. I work 20 hours over 2.5 days a week. It has been a long slog but means one of us is always about. I plan to go full time as soon as the youngest is secondary age.

We don’t have parental help due to geography. Childcare - reduced/compressed working hours to limit the number of days you are needing to use nursery/childminder, and childcare vouchers or the newer childcare account which is essentially a tax break on a certain amount of money being used towards childcare.

We pay for a nanny and also for nursery.

We only use family for ad hoc childcare.... so for a night out.
We've never used them for regular childcare- just nursery when he was younger and now it's flexible working and wrap around care.

I don't know anyone that has a nanny - it certainly not a thing where we live or in our social circles.

Oh and we both work full time

I became a sahm. I still am one now 12 years later! There's no wrap around care at dd2s primary and local holiday clubs all finish at 3pm. I don't know how else we'd manage!

Echo PPs that you just have to compromise massively on your standard of living. We are boringly careful with household bills. Eating out is a thing of the past. Days out are on the cheap with a picnic. My clothes are ‘vintage‘, but not on purpose!

Apart from a few very high-paid couples, I don't know any family at all with 2 full time-working parents and no family help, none 🤷**

I was going to counter this and say 'oh, I know LOADS. But actually when I sat down and thought about it, I'm not sure I do, apart from us.

DH's family all still works, my DM is dead and DDad lives over 100 miles away, so family help wasn't an option. So we paid, a lot. Ours are school age now and we're still paying £700 a month for wraparound care for them.

With DC1 I just didn't go back to work and then worked shit hours for shit money so I could make the most of nursery hours! I didn't have a career anyway but I shot my self esteem and sense of self worth in the foot.

Then we moved to Germany where childcare is government subsidised so actually reasonable - €450 a month for a full time place. Less once they're over 3. And you can claim a third of it back in taxes. After school care is incredibly cheap, too, and holiday schemes you have to be quick on the day they release them but you generally get coverage and they are only about €70 a week too - €140 for a specialist one (e.g. climbing/horseriding) and €200 if it's an actual camp ie they sleep there.

The UK seemed like a really progressive country when I lived there, from the outside it seems totally different. You have to be earning a significant amount of money to have any kind of comfortable life in the UK.

A word on tax-free childcare.....

Lots of people here saying the top-up is 20% of whatever you put in. That’s not correct. The maximum amount of fees you can get a top-up on is £2000 in a 3 month period, so the most you can get is £133 back per month on a maximum amount of £667. If you have to pay more than £800 per month in fees you won’t get anything back on what you pay above £800.

Our nursery fees are around £1600 per month for 4 days (London!) and we only get £133 back from the government, as I’ve explained. Which is definitely very helpful, but not the 20% I’d assumed while pregnant!