To think that the current traffic restrictions are fucking ridiculous

[Gobelinoisawitchescat]

I live in SE London - and since these sodding barriers have gone up all over the place the roads are just completely blocked with traffic.

While I know someone is going to come on talking about climate change etc - am not sure how directing all the traffic to one location makes a damn bit of difference - the cars are still on the roads, they’re just concentrated in certain ones.

Am I missing something?

@ivykaty44 no you see, it’s not my opinion it’s an actual fact. And ironically your saying the same thing - it’s people who, through no fault of their own are now living with increased pollution. Thinking about the main roads which are affected I’d put money on the majority of people who live in some of the not having a car themselvesas there’s no parking.

Brockleygirl46

It does though happen elsewhere, just an observation

South London also bad because two bridges are closed and one had road works - it's causing big jams

Gobelinoisawitchescat How do you know there is increased pollution? You have the pollution levels from before and afterward?

mrscee Well perhaps the lane is empty as all the cyclists got to where they want to go - there are cycle counters showing how many people are using bikes.

Many years ago top gear did a race across London with a car, boat, bus & bike - this was long before cycle lanes and the bike was the quickest with the car being the slowest

@ivykaty44 glad you asked! Thanks to the handy link someone posted earlier it’s actually very clear to see....
January vs 5th September

So all of the places with LTNs have higher pollution in surrounding streets?

Have they implemented an LTN at Epsom?

@ivykaty44 I think it’s quite clear from my and many others posts what locations I’m talking about.

The pollution has changed in many different areas on the map you have shown - why have the other areas got higher pollution if they don’t have LTNs?

But that’s the whole point. If your journey isn’t made very much harder than it was previously, surely you’ll just carry on making it? At some point you’ll buy a bike instead

@ivykaty44 probably - but it’s pretty clear that I’m talking about A specific location in London- which surprise surprise is quite markedly problematic.

Wondering whereabouts you are as I’m betting it’s far away from all this crap.

Again - that’s the point. Eventually somebody stuck in that line of traffic will think - “I might as well be on a bike instead! Then I’d be moving!” So he ditches the car and gets on a bike. Other stuck motorists see him the next day and think “this is a nightmare - perhaps I should try cycling too?” Then the next day...

Also affected by the gridlock in SE London. No way am I cycling on these streets and we need to get to locations that are too far to walk

@AmateurDad well no - I won’t be doing the weekly shop on a bike or by foot. I will never by a cyclist - I just don’t like it (didn’t as a kid either had quite bad accident that ended up quite literally scarring me). I might get it delivered instead come time, but obviously right now that’s tricky. To be fair going to the supermarket is about the highlight of my week at the moment!

Probably, so the seven oaks area, Epsom all probably have LTNs and that’s why there pollution has gone up?

I live somewhere with very high pollution and wish they’d do something about it

Dsis lives in a south London area where LTN has just been implemented. We grew up in this area, I know it like the back of my hand but I'm fucked if I can work out how to drive to my dsis's house these days. You just don't seem able to get into her little 'zone' from outside it. Luckily she lives works and shops within a few hundred yards.
I've found one of the barriers has a larger gap than others so I've just been driving through and going on my merry way.

Meanwhile in my own area whole swathes of car-width lanes have been set aside as Covid-19 Cycle Lanes. Is the virus now cycling around as well as floating along on the air streams? Chaos.

But that’s the whole point. If your journey isn’t made very much harder than it was previously, surely you’ll just carry on making it? At some point you’ll buy a bike instead

I travel in Central London. I don’t live in Central London

Dd travels to SE London by car regularly. She sees a friend who doesn’t drive and lives away from the tube station.

I prefer it if when she leaves the friends house at night she gets in a car and drives home than walking on her own to a tube station or getting on a bike for a 12-14 mile journey home at 1am

I won’t be getting a bike as I have to transport things that just wouldn’t fit on a bike.

I would say most of the traffic is from people who don’t live in the area so for the majority of time people looking and thinking about getting a bike is never going to happen

The longer Covid lasts, the more people will drive where previously they’d taken public transport. The number of cars on the streets is increasing, and many of those cars will be single-occupancy, short trips. What do the opponents of LTNs suggest as an alternative? Doing nothing is not an option. Many of us in favour have been campaigning for safer, traffic free streets for years, and have been fobbed off with reasons why you can’t inconvenience drivers. Now it’s time to give these changes a try, because if we don’t, increasing numbers of cars on the road will make everyone’s life miserable.

Most of the traffic where I live is endless deliveries and builders. They aren’t going to start cycling.

Another big contributor are the schools. With many parents not living locally again, I don’t see how that will be reduced.

The ones who end up being penalised are the locals who are stuck in the jam and who have the privilege or breathing someone else’s fumes.

A third of all car trips in London are less than 2k (content.tfl.gov.uk/technical-note-14-who-travels-by-car-in-london.pdf)
That's about a 15 -20 min walk max I think. Don't tell me that some of those car journeys can't be done by walking or cycling.
The point is that people don't want to walk or cycle not that they can't. In London we can't afford to have that much traffic on the road long term. Something has to be done and these are steps towards doing something.

I’ve already suggested a load of things that could be brought in, permits with one per household, rationing petrol, incentives for electric cars. My biggest objection is that LTN’s affect people disproportionality. The Lee LTN has the highest percentage of car ownership and those in the main roads (taking the extra traffic) the lowest percentage. If streets want to vote for LTN’s they need to put their money where their mouth is and get rid of their car completely.

Most of the traffic where I live is endless deliveries and builders. They aren’t going to start cycling.

But the thing is, they are. Amazon don’t care about driving for it’s own sake, they’ll use the transport that’s most efficient and cheapest. If that isn’t vans it’ll be electric cargo bikes; DHL switched loads of their vans to cargo bikes in 2012 for the olympics, with deliveries going to a logistics centre then out on ebikes. Isn’t that better than white vans causing congestion?

The bike does reduce the need for a weekly shop though...you can easily park up right by the many shops you cycle past on a daily basis and get what you need for a day or two....with some good quality panniers it's very easy. Ok, maybe you need to stock up occasionally on bog roll or nappies in bulk with delivery or car but otherwise bike is so much easier than the car.

Delivery by bikes in London is a huge growth area. Not just DHL but others too, like Pedal Me. And there's Veluba and Pedal Me taxi services too. Changes are happening, and that's a good thing. Every non essential car journey off the roads makes more space for the essential ones.

pedalme.co.uk/

veluba.com/