Why do people on here always bash (apparently) higher earning posters with money issue?

[strivingtosucceed]

There have been a few recent threads where posters have complained about money issues they were facing either as a result of job loss, or reduction of hours. Other posters have then unhelpfully piled on the OP with comments like 'this is tone deaf' or 'such a stealth brag' and going on the call the OP vile names.

Can we not understand that everyone is allowed to have their own money issues, and that there will always be someone better or worse off. Only the person wearing the shoe knows where it pinches, and giving them a headache about how privileged they should feel doesn't help.

Case in point, i'm now unemployed due to COVID. I've held off on applying for some roles because they were much lower paid than my previous salary at £23-26k. If push comes to shove then i'll definitely start applying to them, but would I be stealth boasting if I posted this exact dilemna??

I think high earners can’t talk about money problems in real life so they turn to an anonymous forum to share - not thinking the MNers aren’t just like them.

I think it’s ok to worry and to talk about it. Just talk about it to the right people about the advice you need about keeping up with payments for private school, mortgages etc...

Just don’t expect to suddenly feel you’re able to identify with someone who is trying to make a fiver last a week.

Because higher earners can always find ways to economise, however unpalatable those economies might be, but those struggling on lower incomes have already done everything they can to cut costs to the bone.

[quote NameChange9824]@CSIblonde - that was absolutely not my point. I'm not saying that benefits are easy. I'm pointing out that compared to, say, my father who came from a country where there is absolutely no safety net, no NHS, often no access to medicine at all, and where the disabled were likely to end up begging in the street, anyone who lives in the UK is lucky and sheltered and has access to more of a Plan B.

You are saying you tend to not to sympathize with people from a more middle class background who fall on hard times because they have more options than people like you who live pay cheque to pay cheque. I'm saying that you have more options than many other people in the world. It's all a spectrum. Someone will always have it worse.[/quote]
I come from a country just like this, there is no plan B, either you find a way to make money (legally or otherwise), or you die on the streets.

It's sad that if I had a money dilemna that I could do with varied advice for, MN would think i'm stealth bragging or goady.

I think it’s ok to worry and to talk about it. Just talk about it to the right people about the advice you need about keeping up with payments for private school, mortgages etc...

MN has those people though, there are people on threads who apparently make £80k+ but unless there's a thread of just high earners looking for advice, their money posts have to be posted in the forums that various people frequent.

No people tend to have a problem with tone deaf threads like the one where the op has 1.5k left after all her bills are paid for leisure and was pretending it wasnt much and her and her husband are so hard done by. No one cares if they earn 75k a year, but to pretend your fucking poor on that wage when they had savings and no debt is just a joke.

@Namechange9824, I'm educated, middle class and am not living pay cheque to pay cheque. If you read my original post, it says I'm not rich but neither am I poor. My point is benefits are not the fallback you see them as. They now only pay 75per cent of people's rent so thousands now can't cover their rent and are ending up homeless. If you refuse to take work that doesn't pay your rent, they stop your benefits. I can't find sympathy for people with a myriad of options when all the poor have is a benefits system that fails them on a daily basis. And the NHS can't offer what private health care can either so again it's an unfair comparison. I used to have BUPA but decided it was a waste of my money as I've never used it.

@Shaniac , perfectly & succinctly put.

MN has those people though, there are people on threads who apparently make £80k+ but unless there's a thread of just high earners looking for advice, their money posts have to be posted in the forums that various people frequent.

I know, so they’ll have to just sift through replies then.

What does bother me though is when a person on 80k thinks they are in the same boat as someone on a lot less money than them. I’d rather struggle on 80k than 20k let’s put it that way.

My point is benefits are not the fallback you see them as.

I feel that you are having a misunderstanding here. Your point is this, other poster's point seems to be that there is something here. It's not great but it's better than nothing. Which is what some places have. Nothing.

I think for many people who are struggling to get by, those types of threads are a stark reminder of the financial divide in the UK which is why it annoys so many.

We currently have 40 pounds in the bank until next week, I know I may well have to borrow money from family and very grateful to even have that option when so many don't. We will walk everywhere we need to (despite me being heavily pregnant) as don't want to waste money on bus fare or petrol. Not every month is like this thankfully but Corona has affected things. Life is pretty shit when you are struggling financially hence the frustration on those threads because some OPs do come across as tone deaf.

As a child of immigrants I have relatives in a third world country so know what poverty is. We speak regularly and when they came to know that many, many British people live below the poverty line even they found it unacceptable that in one of the richest countries in the world people are having to live like this. Not everyone here has a plan B, or a safety net or emergency fund. It's not always jealousy or envy, it's incredulity that whilst some are making meals stretch or going hungry so their DC have enough to eat there is someone on 100k complaining about not getting their bonus this year or not being able to afford a foreign holiday.

I think @shaniac has summed it up succinctly! It's fine to ask for help and tips to change your spending, wherever you are starting from. It's kind of insensitive to ask a question about whether it's even possible to get by on more disposable income than most of the country have access to. What people object to is not the person being rich, or richer than them, it's the inability to appreciate their highly privileged position. Personally the 'I'm in no way wealthy' phrase uttered by anyone who has a child in private school is the one that grates on me the most. Of course you are! Ask away and get the help you need for sure, but also think about how others live. It's not helpful to be in a bubble as it can make people entitled and can lead them to minimise the very real problems which many of our fellow citizens are facing (and which can't be solved by taking kids out of private school and slumming it in a state school with the rest of us or selling the holiday home, range rover, family jewels etc.).

@SchrodingersImmigrant - yes! Thank you! I'm not saying people on benefits are living it up here. God knows I know they aren't - eight years ago I was living on a mattress on the floor of someone's garage, shortly before being hospitalized with the same condition that killed my grandmother. I didn't die because of the NHS (even if it's apparently not as good as BUPA), and in hospital I got a social worker who helped me with housing. In my father's home country I probably would have died.

However, I do not think that the fact that others have it worse means that I have no right to remember that time as horrible and traumatising. Just like the fact that I had a really shit time and was homeless for a bit and unwell and all sorts doesn't mean other people aren't still having a bad time having to sell their family home. Yeah, the "but I want a skiing holiday" posts aren't great but I really don't see many of those. I see more posts from people who are dealing with a change in circumstances or financial stressors.

It's all on a spectrum, someone always has it worse, doesn't mean your problems don't count.

I think it is because some of us have genuinely struggled so it is galling to see people we see as wealthy complaining they can't manage.

I'm in an ok financial position now but remember that constant feeling of dread when I ended up being a single mum on benefits for a while.

@NameChange9824 totally agree with your post from yesterday!

Even if your household income drops from £300k to £200k you’re still likely to be in the shit because your commitments will be based on that £300k. It’s not so easy to just stop paying the mortgage on your second home etc.

There’s a lot of bad advice given out re money because people seem to think you can just decide you don’t want your £50 a month contract anymore and get a ‘sim only’ for £5. It just doesn’t work like that.

@schrodinger, I'm not misunderstanding I'm saying benefits which @Namechange see as a viable Plan B, quite simply, arent. Also, I had experience of NHS v BUPA at age 15. I nearly died thanks to being left to bleed on an NHS ward for 3days, no consultant visit til I was about to cark it. At 18 I nearly ended up blind due to NHS incompetence over a very simple eye issue which my Dad's BUPA sorted in the end. And, it was an NHS GP who told my Dad his brain tumour (he had textbook symptoms )was high blood pressure.

*NB I don't know what BUPA process is currently ,but back then you saw your GP first before requesting you took the private route.

If you have never struggled for money then you won't appreciate how much a thread saying I earn 60k how will I cope pisses people off.
I have struggled on benefits through no fault of my own and on minimum wage jobs. I'm not on a fantastic amount of money but I budget to make sure bills are paid and some money saved.
I don't understand why these people earn huge amounts and say their mortgage is really high and the school fees are expensive there is a really simple solution to both those problems.

[quote CSIblonde]**@schrodinger, I'm not misunderstanding I'm saying benefits which @Namechange see as a viable Plan B, quite simply, arent. Also, I had experience of NHS v BUPA at age 15. I nearly died thanks to being left to bleed on an NHS ward for 3days, no consultant visit til I was about to cark it. At 18 I nearly ended up blind due to NHS incompetence over a very simple eye issue which my Dad's BUPA sorted in the end. And, it was an NHS GP who told my Dad his brain tumour (he had textbook symptoms )was high blood pressure.[/quote]
You know what. You win. People with no benefit system don't have it worse, nor do people without state and free at point of access healthcare. It's only here where it's horrible.

It seems like this is what you want to hear.

High earners struggling with money is almost always due to bad budgeting and over spending. They can make changes as money buys you choice. People on crap wages struggle because of their crap wages. They’ve often run out of options

Exactly. Even if you fall on hard times as a high earner you have options. Sell a bigger house and move into a smaller one. Sell the 2nd/holiday home. Sell the Chelsea Tractor and buy a Fiesta. You get the idea.

I've lost my job more than once over the years but I've never been on a the breadline because I have husband who earns, and because we're both savers, so we've always had savings to rely on. Yes I've been well off enough to save, but lots of people with a similar income don't and then find themselves in financial trouble. So it is ok to tell them to learn some money management skills and be a bit less insensitive.

Mind you, those with money seem to always come through ok (thinking of company directors who go bankrupt and start again weeks later - oh and Chris Grayling, who has got a job working 1 day a week earning £100K).

I recently mentioned on a thread about the holiday let I owned, and was told in an angry manner that I was super privileged for owning more than one property.

In reality, my main property is a modest 2 bed flat and the holiday let is an even more modest 1 bed, which i bought with money inherited after my mum died.The value of both combined is likely to be less than the value of many Mumsnetters main property. But because I own 2 small properties, rather than one large one, this apparently makes me privileged.

Even if your household income drops from £300k to £200k you’re still likely to be in the shit because your commitments will be based on that £300k.

If your household income is 300k you should have the wherewithal to do some proper financial planning for the 'what if' scenarios and not be 'in the shit' because your income is 'only' 200k.

I think it’s less about them being a higher earner and more about the total lack of self awareness these posters seem to have. There is after all a vast difference between “we’ve had this life changing event happen and are now left with only bringing in 20% of our former income, is it manageable?” and “oh woe is me, however will I live on this huge amount of disposable income each month?” and for the most part how they present the issue will be the key factor in how others respond to them. The former question is far more relatable to others regardless of income, whereas seeing someone struggling after bills on more money than you take home in a month is much harder to relate to.

DH and I are extremely fortunate to be higher earners, and in jobs that have fared well during Covid, but we are also well aware that this isn’t the case for many and are very conscious of the challenges others face. When I saw the £1500 a month disposable income post (which incidentally wasn’t even disposable) I did wonder how anyone could be quite so tone deaf given the current climate of furlough, redundancies and recession. I’m not wholly convinced they deliberately set out to be goady, but their thread was definitely misguided at best.

@DrManhattan

I know what you mean but some threads are just goady. " We only earn £100k a year etc" - that's great, good for you but its not a reality for many people through no fault of their own. Its not necessarily the issue but how it can come across.

^^ this

Isn't this though, bit like if people were telling someone moaning about their 4 kids to fuck off because it's insensitive because many people cannot have children or more than 1 so they should be happy with what they have no matter what? It's a same principle...