AIBU to give my child an Irish name in the UK?

[FolkSongSweet]

Posting here for traffic. I’ve seen a few heated debates on this on baby name threads recently. I’m considering giving my child an Irish name where the pronunciation isn’t obvious from the spelling. We live in London. Will this be a huge burden to the child when they grow up/a mild annoyance, or not an issue?

(NB this issue could obviously theoretically apply to lots of names, not just Irish ones, but Irish ones are what I’m considering)

YABU - don’t give your child a tricky name
YANBU - it’s not a big deal, people will learn

@Runssometimes what is an Irish BAME name? Very curious as I live in Dublin! My daughters have Irish names but my ex Mil still spells dd2s name wrong! Drives me nuts. Yet I can spell Mils which is Middle Eastern, correctly.

Yabu, you'll be setting your child up for daily bullying, as there have never been any other children in the whole of the UK, specifically London, that have ever had Irish people living there, let alone with an Irish name 😱.

Seriously? 🙄

@LookItsMeAgain

Call your child what you want. It doesn't matter what name you give your child. It is extremely goady and wrong to start a thread "AIBU to give my child an Irish name in the UK". You are aware that there is a lot of anti-Irish sentiment on Mumsnet and in the UK aren't you? You're aware that there is a lot of pro-British sentiment on Mumsnet and in the UK, aren't you?

Try again OP.

Erm...how on earth is it goady @LookItsMeAgain? I am Irish but have lived in the UK for 12 years. I’m considering an Irish name for my daughter due soon. I don’t know how I could possibly ask the question in a different way and no other poster has had any issue with it.

I acknowledged in my OP that these issues crop up with other names, but in my experience often names from other cultures (eg Indian names) whilst not being familiar are at least more readily pronounceable than Irish names to English speakers

And if there is a lot of anti-Irish sentiment (which I’m fortunate not to have encountered in any meaningful way), then it’s actually a relevant consideration given the question I’m asking. If I’d had a load of posters saying it was a terrible idea because they were anti-Irish I’d probably still factor that in.

Interested to know how you think I could have put it better.

In my fifties. Only experienced anti Irish sentiment once about 20 years ago.

I think it depends on the child, which unfortunately you can't know in advance but it is something to consider.

I agree with previous comments that London is fine for this (lifelong Londoner) and the experience is probably different to living in the sticks where there is more of and English element.

That being said my best friend is Irish and has had real issue with this. Her son has an Irish name and as a relatively extroverted child he had no issue correcting the pronunciation and spelling, it was, as many have said, a minor annoyance.

However, her daughter who has always been shy and introverted found it really upsetting, would never correct people, was mortified at her mum correcting others. I remember as young as nursery age she didn't want to give her name or use her name and friend was then conflicted about being to blame for the 'burden'. She has now started secondary school with her very simple English flower name.

I am one of eight, we all have 'foreign' names and five of us now use either and anglicised version or a middle name. Personally, I find it hugely irritating that my parents did this for THEIR heritage, as its a very outward facing gesture. Preserving family heritage happens in the home and daily life not through the name you give them.

I have one of these names.

I work in England and many of my colleagues also have non English names. My feeling towards it is that people should make an effort (of course I don’t mind if people have to check or get it a bit wrong). It’s not that difficult and there are lots of us around. So I would say do it.

should say she started secondary with her English flower middle name. Perhaps give your DC an out with a middle name that is simple to spell and pronounce, just in case?

I am introverted and have no issue with introducing myself with my Welsh name/spelling it out/repeating it etc. It seems to bother other people around me like friends and DH's family more than me.

There is no guarantee how OP's daughter will feel about her name. She may love having an Irish name, she may not. If OP calls her a name like Sophie the daughter may love it, or she may wish she had an Irish name like her brother instead.

I love having my Welsh name as it links me to my heritage and it's a good conversation starter, especially for an introvert! Others who have unusual names don't like it.

So all OP can do is pick a name she loves, try and predict any specific issues with the name and find a new one if necessary* and hope her daughter likes it.

*my mother seriously considered Myfanwy for me in England - as a native Welsh speaker she just saw it as Muh-van-wee. My English dad saw it as 'My Fanny' and vetoed it. My actual name has much less bullying potential thankfully and I didn't get teased for it at school.

My children have welsh names, 2 of them are in uni/college in England and whilst they might need to explain them to people begin with, that’s usually all it takes.
Do it if you love the names.

@Hollyhobbi I meant to type name. It was an autocorrect.

Both my dc have Irish names or Irish spelling of names, myself and all my siblings have Irish names too, we live in London!

One of my acquaintances has a little known Irish name, so little known that if you google it the first two pages of results are all about her. It wouldn't be obvious to a non-Irish speaker how to pronounce it but if you've come across Irish names before then it follows the same rules (e.g. it has a bh in the middle so if you'd ever met anyone called Siobhán you'd be ok with it). She gets on fine.

On the other hand, I've got a cousin called Cathal. Easy peasy to spell, really common name. People with English accents (including me) can't say it at all.

I'd go for hard spelling, easy pronunication over the opposite any day. I know that's not your dilemma, but my point is that people can and do cope with 'unusual' spellings.

I and DD's dad are both of Irish heritage and my daughter's name is very common in Ireland but not at all common here. It's the Irish form of Anne and is a name I have always loved. Pronunciation is not at all obvious from the spelling to the average UK inhabitant, but once people have been told how to pronounce it, there isn't normally a problem. If you really love the name then go for it-people will learn how to pronounce it and it's part of your heritage

Such a good point about choosing easy pronunciation over easy spelling.

Agree Cathal and also Mícheál are hard to say in an English accent. Then there are the names which are doable but sound really different in an English accent. Like Cormac, which becomes caw-mack or Lorcan which becomes law-cun. Saoirse can become see-ah-sha. So, it's worth trying them out on someone with the local accent! We did that with ds. It does sound different, but we liked it in both accents, which is why we picked it.

Go for it. Due to son-inlaw being Welsh both DGS have Welsh names and live in the heart of Surrey. No problems at all. Irish names are gorgeous. Your baby, your choice.

It's fine to choose an Irish name.

I do think that it will often cause delays having to spell it out, and correct mispronunciation, and even trouble on government forms and legal documents, but probably that is not of overriding importance.

English born daughter to an Irish mother-English father here [waves] my name is 70:30 unrecognisable:recognisable in England and have had some funny spellings and pronunciations over the years, but I love my name and wouldn’t change it for anything.

Siobhan - this is a difficult one - unless you know! How would one work that out?

@tara66 I don’t think you can work it out from scratch, but once familiar with the rules Irish names are actually pretty straightforward. So when you know that the “bh” in Siobhan is “v” you might be able to work out say Dearbhla, Meabh, Ailbhe (Dervla, Maeve, Alva).

Go for it, my name is an Irish name, born early 80's. Lots of people couldn't pronounce it nor spell it but we just got on with it. As long as you polite in correcting it and prepared to spell it out you will be fine. Some people will neve learn, my nana still can not spell it nearly 40 years later however its a running joke when we see post from her now. Am well used to people who ask how to pronounce or get it wrong especially when were on holidays but as people say it is a good conversation starter or you have a good laugh afterwards. I have been called many different pronunciations in my life one or two now are nicknames, I love that my name is slightly different. My parents did however decided to name my sister a more normal common name though when she was born after me, and she hates it.

@BigBlondeBimbo

Such a good point about choosing easy pronunciation over easy spelling.

Agree Cathal and also Mícheál are hard to say in an English accent. Then there are the names which are doable but sound really different in an English accent. Like Cormac, which becomes caw-mack or Lorcan which becomes law-cun. Saoirse can become see-ah-sha. So, it's worth trying them out on someone with the local accent! We did that with ds. It does sound different, but we liked it in both accents, which is why we picked it.

Thanks yes - I agree re pronunciation/spelling. As I said up thread I hate the way Orla sounds in an English accent. My fave name is more similar to Sadhbh - hard to spell but easy to say, even for English people!

Ah yes, you said that already didn't you? Crack on then. How often really, do people need to write down the name? If they spell it 'Sive', to use your example, just correct them. Chances are most people she meets will never write down her name anyway.

Go ahead, but expect to put up with it being mispronounced and misspelt or your child using a nn.

If you call her Éabha, it will get misspelled as Ava a lot, and as i have done a quick google, I know it is pronounced Ebba.

My DH worked with an Eilidh and I thought he was calling her 'ayley. It was only when I saw her pop up on his FB I realised! He never normally drops his aitches

My Ddad is Irish and DD's father is Irish, so we gave DD an Irish name. It has never been a problem after you've explained it once...usually!

The only exception is my maternal grandmother, who is French, thinks it's ridiculous and has never made the effort to get it right. She's 95 now and don't think she'll ever change her mind.