What is the point

[RealityExistsInTheHumanMind]

In living, if we aren't allowed to live.

Human beings are sociable animals. We went into lockdown to save the NHS from being overwhelmed

Yeah, well that happened months ago

I don't see the point in going on any more - government on a power trip. My life curtailed for nothing

Waste of time

And why the fuck should they wear masks? They are about as much use as the plague masks of the 17th century.

There is a very large body of scientific and medical opinion that would disagree with this.

Very proud of the young people I work with

Some are now the only workers in there households due to furlough or redundancy

Coping well, they are not stupid, they can see it’s not going to rumble on untilll they are old themselves!

Those of you saying people should speak to their GP - I’m a GP, what do you think we can do? People aren’t suffering from “normal” depression. They’re despairing because their lives have been messed up. I can’t get their business up and running, I can’t get them their job back, I can’t cheer up their unhappy kids, I can’t put money in their bank account, I can’t pay their rent, I can’t restart their hobbies - the list goes on.
I am absolutely convinced that deaths due to lockdown measures will outstrip deaths from Covid by many thousands. Poverty and suicide will be the memorable killers of the the Covid 19 pandemic .

minty

It's worrying that you don't know what you can do.

Life events will always be there. You do what you've always done-direct and treat as you can, and distinguish between people who are ill (needing treatment and likely to respond ( and those who are actually ok but finding it tough (so not ill).

A few weeks ago Chris Whitty said we were at the limits of what we could safely do and that if we want to reopen things other things would have to close. At the time it was said that reopening schools might mean closing pubs, but I think this is the alternative they have chosen. So reopening schools is the priority which the government has been clear about. I do agree it is important for children despite the risk to teachers and people like me who work in the school. That is not ideal and don't get me started on year group "bubbles". But in general if the price we have to pay for getting kids back to school is this reduction in social gatherings I think the children have to come first. They do need that social contact and their education.

And good job you're not a psychiatrist. Do you think all their patients spontaneously generate their illnesses with no environmental trigger? Of course not. Do they have a wand? No. Do they successfully stabilise mood etc? Quite often! Would it be nice if they didn't have to? Of course.

shocking the mythical “counselling” so readily advised on MN is not so readily available in real life. There is no NHS face-to-face counselling now, it’s all by phone, which makes it limited. The services are overwhelmed. Anyway, people don’t want to talk to counsellors. They don’t want medication. They don’t want therapy. They want their lives back. For many of the patients I speak to there is literally nothing I can do, beyond 10 minutes of sympathy every few weeks.

You need to reassess your way of thinking now, no point in making yourself unhappy, and downbeat about everything. Most people are being affected by things this year.

I don't think anyone is being unreasonable for feeling a certain way about things and everyone will have a different experiance of the current situation.

I had a health scare this year and while there was a slight delay I still got tested and seen by the relevent people. I've think the NHS has been really efficent as at all my appointments have been really quick, no waiting and telephone appointments where appropriate. I know this will vary region to region but I hope people know that all other treatment hasn't just stopped.

And in other news, somebody somewhere today had a serious accident and lost their legs/their husband/their child/etc.

Im sorry but it is 20-45 year olds that account for 90% of infections. Nobody is throwing them under the bus. Those of us who follow the rules are being thrown under the bus.

I'm angry at ppl who dont SD or wear masks, those who dont quarantine, ppl who've had house parties with too many ppl and those at illegal raves.

If ppl were more considerate of others we would be much closer to getting our old lives back.

We went into lockdown to save LIVES not the NHS.

You believe that? We went into lockdown as the NHS is screwed and Johnson was shit scared the NHS would be fucked over even more than it is now.

Saving lives? That's not on their agenda at all.

I'm old myself and sick of the sentimentalised attitude towards old people who have already lived full lives

A serious over generalisation. Many older people have had very restricted lives - many women denied careers due to the attitudes of their day, lives without the labour saving devices we take for granted now, lack of an NHS to treat their illnesses, men conscripted to war, stunted education, unequal pay, limited travel, mental health issues not even recognised as a condition, even attempted suicide was criminalised until 1961!

This isn’t an ‘old’ V ‘young’ situation - it’s a virus that has taken 42,000 lives in the UK (probably more). It’s a crisis overseen by an inept Government who reacted too late, prepared insufficiently, puts vested interests first, has lied and chopped and changed its response to events so few people know what is the right thing to do.

What particular part of your life is being curtailed?

My sex life has gone right out the window

Funny isn’t it? Pre Covid, if anyone started a thread where they were clearly struggling with their mental health to the extent that they were suicidal (like the OP here) they’d get a supportive message from Mumsnet directing them to resources, plus empathetic responses from other posters. Not just ‘be glad you’re healthy’ (by healthy do you mean she doesn’t have Covid? Because being in the absolute depths of despair like the OP doesn’t seem healthy to me. Does only physical health matter now?).
I hear you OP. Please speak to someone (if anyone gives you an appointment) and get some help.

I agree with you OP.
I am tired of the bullshit.

Get where you’re coming from OP. It feels like this year is kind of just a write off. It’s a struggle.

minty

I do hope you will make a referral if you come across someone showing clinical signs of mental illness as you clearly don't treat it as a medical problem. If someone comes to you just for a little moan but is basically well, we're not talking about the same group of people.

Morning, everyone.

We've had a few reports asking for some links to support for this thread and we can see there are quite a few people here feeling pretty low.

Here's a link to our mental health resources page. We hope some of the numbers and websites there are of use.

We can see the OP has posted in AIBU, which, by its nature, does invite disagreement and we know some people have found some of that a bit much here. While AIBU is for robust discussion, it isn't a bear pit and we hope that everyone can agree or disagree in a polite and civil way.

There are also lots of similar discussions happening over on the Coronavirus and Mental Health boards so please do pop over there and post or lurk as you wish, too. There are lots of posters in similar positions on both boards who are always happy to offer support and advice.

to anyone struggling today.

@RealityExistsInTheHumanMind

I don't want to live at the expense of young people giving up living.

Temporary measures is not "giving up living" ffs.

Younger people aren't giving up living.

My ds is 12. He's at school all day. He sees his best mate at the weekends, we go cycling, eat pizza, talk to friends and family. Karate is restarting next weekend. Hopefully swimming too. We managed to organise a birthday party for him. Life can go on perfectly happily for children with just a few adjustments.

The worst part of this is the teens/twenties having to cope with redundancy without the years of experience needed to know it's not personal. I feel desperately sorry for them.

shocking where would you like me to refer people to? The waiting list for a psychiatric outpatient appointment is about 6 months. The Crisis team will only speak to people who have plans to kill themselves that very day. The various mental health support services will direct people to counselling etc, which obviously I also do.

Most people who are depressed due to Covid don't want medication or counselling. As I said, they want their lives back.
You do know that there isn't a mental health magic wand don't you?

@NoemiaElara Tue 08-Sep-20 23:21:23
We went into lockdown to save LIVES not the NHS. It was to equip the NHS with time to figure out how to successfully treat covid, what PPE requirements we will need to protect staff and patients, what protocols are in place to avoid becoming overwhelmed. It isn't about saving the NHS. It never was. It was a buffer to allow time to figure things out! It didn't happen months ago. It has been happening all this time. It is still happening.
So the government saying 'Save the NHS' didn't mean that then. Hospitals are currently half empty, most have no Covid cases, it is not 'still happening' like it was. Deaths from Covid very low. Deaths from other things way above average for the time of year. Not Covid so don't matter - except they matter just as much to the people that have lost them.

@Whoknowswhocares Tue 08-Sep-20 23:40:54
@Hont1986

Perhaps "today's generation" don't really mind wearing masks in shops if it curbs a bloody pandemic.

Well if all it took was wearing a mask to curb it, then there would be no need for new measures.
Exactly

Lockdown has merely kicked the can down the road. As soon as people mix, cases rise.
No idea what the answer is, but certainly the current plan is failing spectacularly all around the world. Let’s all continue to hope a vaccine turns up, but it might not for years if ever.
Plan B?
And vaccine trial currently on hold because someone has developed a serious illness that may be related to the developed vaccine.

@EveryPlanetHasAYorkshire Tue 08-Sep-20 23:41:54
I have been awake until the early hours the past few days in tears and wanting to walk down into the city and throw myself off the bridge.
I hope you are feeling a bit better today. It is for this reason that I am so angry. There are healthy young people all over feeling like you. It is no life. For everyone that is coping well, there is someone else who isn't. And more young people are going to die from the effects of the 'lockdown' than from Covid.

@StoneofDestiny Tue 08-Sep-20 23:46:43
We are very lucky
Older people in the UK had childhoods/teenage years/ young adulthood blighted by polio, whooping cough, scarlet fever, rickets, diphtheria, typhoid fever, rheumatic fever, tuberculosis, smallpox, German measles, flu epidemics etc etc

Yep - we survived all that - and now we are locked down for something else that we will survive, and would have survived better without all the hysteria.

@allDrTemperanceBrenna n Tue 08-Sep-20 23:53:23
You’re not unreasonable at all OP. Most young people appear to be presenting without symptoms - they are not coughing or sneezing, meaning that, according to Government advice that this is passed on through coughing and sneezing, the chances of them passing it on are minimal.

Three people died of the virus in England yesterday. Three. And while it’s tragic for those people and their families, I can almost guarantee that the suicide rate will far surpass that figure. At some point, the public lost complete control of any ability to assess risk, think critically, or question the official party line. The mental health fallout from this is going to be catastrophic, but as long as the word Covid isn’t involved, nobody gives a damn.

You get it - I'm angry, not mentally ill. This isn't a world I want to live (I will, I am not actively suicidal) it's a rational response to a situation made more shite by politicians. And the complacency of people being walked into a police state taking away our human rights.

@Shockingstocking Wed 09-Sep-20 00:27:56
OP, young people need services that haven't been flattened by a covid wave. We're not going to leave you to die if you get ill, are we. Well then, we'll have to treat you. So if you want to help the younger generation, stay home. Don't suggest you're somehow sacrificing yourself and helping young people by advocating for a more 'normal' life.
The services are now flattened by overreaction not Covid. A post yesterday from an NHS employee, being paid to sit there doing nothing as the service is open and nowhere else in the NHS needs them.

@Jojobar Wed 09-Sep-20 00:38:19
I know of at least 3 people in my local area who have committed suicide since March due to their MH deteriorating massively as a result of lockdown, financial and social pressures.
Yep - more people that are healthy will die from suicide than from Covid.

@BogRollBOGOF Wed 09-Sep-20 00:42:05
I'm tired of existing this meaningless shadow life now. Life has felt pointless beyond servicing my family for months. I'm not depressed, but existing in a continued void through the winter and every hope being routinely smashed within days could tip it.
I am tired.
I am angry.
I totally agree with everything you say.

@PercyKirke Wed 09-Sep-20 00:43:30
And why the fuck should they wear masks? They are about as much use as the plague masks of the 17th century.

There is a very large body of scientific and medical opinion that would disagree with this.
The evidence that I find says that wearing medical grade masks correctly may make a difference. The people doing that are few and far between. Cotton masks; masks worn wrongly; masks constantly touched and adjusted - no evidence at all.

@Mintychoc1 Wed 09-Sep-20 00:52:41
Those of you saying people should speak to their GP - I’m a GP, what do you think we can do? People aren’t suffering from “normal” depression. ... I am absolutely convinced that deaths due to lockdown measures will outstrip deaths from Covid by many thousands. Poverty and suicide will be the memorable killers of the the Covid 19 pandemic.

Thank you for what you are doing - and I do think for many someone hearing them does help them cope with the shit even though it doesn't change the situation.

@ForrestTrump Wed 09-Sep-20 01:39:37
And in other news, somebody somewhere today had a serious accident and lost their legs/their husband/their child/etc.

but it only counts for them, the world doesn't seem to care because it's not Covid

@Torvean32 Wed 09-Sep-20 04:01:18
Im sorry but it is 20-45 year olds that account for 90% of infections. Nobody is throwing them under the bus. Those of us who follow the rules are being thrown under the bus.
Easy answer, continue being careful but make your own choices.

The more fit people get this and recover the soon we can get back to normal (real normal) life.

The vaccine may be years away. Trials have just been halted because one of the volunteers has been hospitalised with possible side effects.

@PhilCornwall1 Wed 09-Sep-20 04:41:06
... We went into lockdown as the NHS is screwed and Johnson was shit scared the NHS would be fucked over even more than it is now.

I hear you

@DownstairsMixUp Wed 09-Sep-20 07:53:43
Totally agree. I'm young, most of my friends to have all played by the rules and still getting the blame. Everyone says it's not for long but life has been on hold for months now. I really am done with it.

Good, get out there and live - distance where you can, wash your hands and live. We need you all to make it impossible to police. We have a right to a life

@allDownstairsMixUp Wed 09-Sep-20 07:59:52
Also lost my dad in a hit and run in April, couldn't have a proper funeral, I accepted it. This was hard. My dad was well liked, he never got to retire and died working. We've been holding on to the hope we can plan a memorial wake next year, again it's put on hold. In the normal world people are still dealing with actual traumatic events. Nobody knows if this vaccine will be ready next year, it's holding onto false hope. So done with it and I'm not surprised people are being noncompliant now and fed up. The whole thing is a joke.

Totally agree

@Kaktus Wed 09-Sep-20 08:04:11
Funny isn’t it? Pre Covid, if anyone started a thread where they were clearly struggling with their mental health to the extent that they were suicidal.

Thanks @Kaktus. Luckily I am not suicidal as such. I'd rather not be living in this crap but I am just angry that we are being walked into a police state. People are blaming others - the government are playing the divide and conquer game.

We should be given the information and take responsibility for ourselves. The measures are worse than the problem and will be felt for far longer. Yes a lot of people have died, we can't bring them back and carrying on like this a lot more people will die from the effects of the restrictions than will die from the virus.