to ask what people find painful about ghosting?

[CoffeeAndWhisky]

Just had a conversation with DH about this yesterday and realised I find it quite difficult to understand why people feel hurt by it. My logic has always been...

... either we didn't get on as well as I thought, in which case it is a shame but a conversation won't change that

...something happened in their life that keeps them busy but that they don't want to share with me, in which case they don't owe me an explanation

... we have grown apart and the 'ghoster' doesn't feel it is worth the time and effort to re-build the friendship/relationship, which is fair enough

...I may have said or done something that made them do it - in that case, I retrace my steps and if I can't find anything unreasonable, it is their loss. If I did fuck up, I apologise and take it from there.

Don't get me wrong, I have never ghosted anyone and I have not really been ghosted much either.

The reason it came up between me and DH was that our single-household bubble friend was ghosted by a friend she met at the beginning of this year and was in tears about it. Obviously, we tried to help her work through this but when we talked about it more generally after she left, DH mentioned that he is still surprised by how little I care on the rare occasion that someone ghosts me (naturally, I did not say anything like 'no big deal' to our friend). However, he also couldn't really explain why/what he finds hurtful about these situations - so I guess my question really is, why do some people find ghosting hurtful?

YABU = I'd feel hurt if someone ghosted me
YANBU = I wouldn't feel hurt if someone ghosted me.

Ghosting in its pure term is just disappearing though isnt it. Sort of mid chat / mid relationship/ mid date etc.

It’s not friends drifting apart or blocking someone who has absolutely fucked you over (like a PP who blocked an indiscreet friend), it’s ‘fine one minute, gone the next’ - with no explanation or reason (given).

@2020iscancelled Pretty nailed it. It's the worse kind of rejection because you have no idea why it's happened and it's sent a message that you're not even worth 2 minutes of their time to let you know.

Ghosting happens in varying degrees and madcatladyforever has received the most awful treatment on the worst end of the scale.

As others have said it is the rejection and not knowing the reason for it, I think that is the worst part and the fact there is no proper end to it. It shows the person doing it doesn’t even care enough to even send a text and say it’s not working for me and I’m ending this. It is cruel and makes it very hard to move on.

HandfulofDust

"It's the worse kind of rejection because you have no idea why it's happened and it's sent a message that you're not even worth 2 minutes of their time to let you know."

I get what you mean but I think people are slightly disingenous with this and there are quite a few double standards. In reality no-one ghosts because the person isn't worth 2 minutes of their time to let you know. They ghost because they are awkward about a confrontation and because they doubt whether the upside of having the confrontation is worth the downside.

So with romantic ghosting: its horrible to go through and I'm not justifying it but let's be honest: you do have an idea why its happened. It's happened because that person no longer wants to be in the relationship and they are signalling this in the clearest way possible. It's cowardly and shitty but it does what it says on the tin pretty effectively. If you're talking about a decades-long relationship then there's no justification for this but if you're dating someone who's turned a bit stalkerish sometimes its the only way.

I think "ghosting" has become a bit of a blanket term for anyone who doesn't respond to your messages but actually there are many shades of it. People are expected to over-communicate so much. If you're exiting a marriage then you do owe someone an explanation but if you want to extricate yourself from a friendship which never really got off the ground, some things really are better left unsaid.

I was ghosted by someone who I thought was a very good friend of 6+ years , and I know she thought the same as me ( or at least she said she did) I still to this day don't know why, but it affected my confidence for a long time.

I've since learned that I'm not the first person she has done this to, and she's very much a one friend person who moves on when someone better comes along which doesn't really make me feel any better about it

Thanks to everyone who has already replied. I'm in zoom limbo, i.e. between meetings, right now, so can't respond to every post.

A quick question though, to those of you who say they would just like to know why they were ghosted, or who feel it is awful because they don't know if/what they did wrong - how do you think that last conversation would go?

Just one more question, do you really think that this would be a constructive last conversation or would it be more likely to be all tears and screaming?

They ghost because they are awkward about a confrontation and because they doubt whether the upside of having the confrontation is worth the downside.

I think the reality is that they feel the upside of a confrontation to them is not worth the downside. If you want to end a friendship obviously the upside to the confrontation is all for the other person - you already know what's going on and aren't going to be left wondering.

I don't think it necessarily needs a big confrontation. If it's a friendship which has drifted and the other person wants to keep going it just needs a text 'look I'm so busy and feel our friendship has drfited apart so don't think I'll be able to meet for that coffee, I hope everything goes well for you though'. It doesn't need a dramatic break up scene. Obviously if it's a 20 year marriage then yes it does require a more lengthy explanation!

If you're honest in not wanting to continue the friendship and they still persist or they've done something obviously awful like sleep with your husband then yes I think it's fine to stop responding.

I find it very hurtful because it's like I'm not even worth the bother of an explanation.

Exactly. Or, in the words of NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace, "I'm not even good enough to be told that I'm not good enough"

Really goady thread op try harder

I think it's respectful to tell the person why you no longer want contact with them

I think it's disrespectful not to tell them and to ghost them

I'm interested that you come across as a cold clinical person and yet you think that a respectful 'end of friendship/relationship' conversation will be emotionally charged and tearful

Maybe your views are rather squewed and based on your own personal fears

I've never been ghosted by anyone but would consider somebody really rude if they did. If you want to end a relationship with someone, I think you should have the decency to tell them and explain why. Even if it wouldn't make a difference to that relationship, it might help future relationships by giving peple the opportunity to reflect on their behaviour.

Being ghosted by a long term friend for me was like I had to go through a grieving process with no closure.

We'd been so close for 10 years, she was meant to be one of my bridesmaids but couldn't come to the wedding and it all went downhill from there.

It hurts me that she's never met my children and I'll never meet hers. It hurts me when a shared memory comes up, or something happens that reminds me of our friendship and my first instinct to this day is to call her to laugh about it. I found out that her grandma had passed away so I sent her a message to say I was sorry to hear the news but got no reply and was left on read.

We saw each other three years ago at a mutual friends son's baptism. We didn't speak to each other and I regret that now because it could have been a way to resolve whatever issue there was.

All you need to do to get into the headspace of somebody that's been hurt by ghosting, is to imagine it was your DH doing it to you. You clearly have nice times together with in depth conversations. So do a lot of people who end up being ghosted. They think everything is fine until it's not.

If you're honestly saying that your DH could leave for a work trip one day, never talk to you again, and you wouldn't be hurt or upset, then I guess it's understandable that you wouldn't see why ghosting can hurt.

I would be worried something bad had happened to someone who ghosted me and probably start trying to phone their relatives or turn up on their doorstep.

If ghosting turns into a thing my worry is that more people will go missing or be taken ill at home but everyone will assume they are being ghosted and not contact the police etc.

A quick question though, to those of you who say they would just like to know why they were ghosted, or who feel it is awful because they don't know if/what they did wrong - how do you think that last conversation would go?

Even if it was just a text with an honest reason.

e.g. 'Thanks for your message, to be honest I feel like we don't have much in common anymore and my life is just so hectic at the moment that I don't think I'm going to have time to meet up for that drink. I really hope everything goes well in the future'

or 'I feel really hurt that you weren't there for me after the break up and it's made me realise that I think our friendhsip has probably come to an end, I wish you well in the future though'.

or 'I feel our friendship has become a bit unbalanced as you never make the effort to ask after me and just use me to offload on and it's become a bit tiring for me, at this point I feel it's best if we don't continue to meet up'.

At this point the other person might reply with an explanation which you can either take on board or just say 'thanks for letting me know but I still think our friendship has run it's course'.

It may be too late for the friend to actually repair the friendship but at least they won't be left questioning and can change their behaviour for the future.

I think with a relationship (or someone you're dating) it's the waiting and wondering what's happened and whether you're going to hear from them again. I think that's really cruel.

I have ghosted one friend because I knew that if I tried to talk to her she would not remotely concede any of the reasons I was fed up with the very one-sided friendship and her selfish behaviour. Another wasn't really ghosting as she kept saying we would meet and then just left it hanging until I got in touch again, so in the end I stopped chasing. If anything she ghosted me.

I’m a bit like you. When I’ve been ghosted by very close friends (it’s happened twice), I figured they’ve just moved on and no longer want to be friends or at least as close and in as regular contact. One was after I had my first baby and the other was when they got a new job with new friends and a whole new personality to go with it.
I just shrugged them both off. I don’t see the good in twisting yourself in knots over what other people think of you. If you know you’re trying to be the best version you can be of yourself, nothing else matters. :)

If you value your friendship or relationship with someone, it seems natural to me to be a little bit sad or hurt about being ghosted with no explanation. At least if you know, you can move on.

My honest opinion OP, is that the older I get the more I don’t give a shit if a “friend” ghosts me, so I’m with you on this. I have been ghosted a couple of times and tried to get in touch to find out why only to be ignored of course

I used to find it so hurtful when I was younger but now at 41, I have lost a lot of faith in people unfortunately. Now it’s school mums who ghost me instead of dates/friends. Of course if it were husband then that’s a different story altogether!

I much prefer my own company these days, says a lot about the person doing the ghosting really, if someone does something like that then I don’t want them in my life anyway.

I think it depends on the ghosting context really.

If it’s someone you met on tinder and had a single date with, after which they never contact you again, then they probably just didn’t want to see you again and couldn’t be bothered with a conversation. That’s a bit rude but not worth getting upset over.

If it’s a boyfriend of 3 years who just disappears one day and refuses to contact you or be contacted, then it’s about him having mental health issues and generally being unable to cope with you being smarter and better liked than him (well it was when this happened to me). It’s a shocking way to treat someone though.

At the time, I didn’t want to know what I’d done wrong, but to have any idea what was going on. I didn’t actually do anything wrong. I’m not perfect but it really wasn’t about me. He ghosted me because of his own issues and inadequacies. Ultimately he just lacked the ability to tell me straight and it was easier to run away (literally; he went to live miles away - to a job, which showed that he’d been planning it while pretending otherwise, and talking about proposing etc). I was totally confused when he just disappeared. I was more than entitled to be informed that he’d decided to end the relationship, even if there would be no explanation for it.

He is married with kids now, I think. Hopefully he sorted himself out and grew up a lot. Because no one deserves their husband (or father) to just disappear on them like that.

I would imagine anyone who just upped and left their spouse in a ghosting fashion would have serious mental health issues. You’d be worrying that they were a serious suicide risk of it were your husband and they just disappeared like that. Otherwise they’d be unspeakably cruel.

I'm fine with being ghosted in the way that I understand the term -which is someone doing a disappearing act and never contacting you again in the very early stages of a dating relationship. I'd much rather they just politely went silent than explained exactly why they didn't like me, in actual words. Them discreetly exiting stage left is far preferable to me than them telling me they don't like my big nose or whatever.

It’s painful because you don’t know why. Is it something you did? Something beyond your control that happened? Did they cheat? Were you mistaken in thinking they cared? If you loved the person, not having an answer eats you up.

I think people also overstate the need for "closure" quite a lot in personal relationships and think its some sort of birth-right to get a full debrief on why the friendship went wrong.
The point is with ghosting you don't even get the courtesy of even being told the relationship has gone wrong (you're left to work it out for yourself), never mind an explanation as to why!
I agree with the PP that one of the frustrating things is not knowing when to stop trying because you have no idea whether the failure to respond is deliberate or not. I'm sure there are people out there who play on this and enjoy keeping someone dangling.
At best it is inconsiderate and rude, and at worst it is cruel. Either way of course it's hurtful and upsetting even if you do realise it probably says more about them than you.

I was ghosted by a friend of 15 years, our children grew up together and I regularly had her children over for dinner, more so when they were at senior school and I lived conveniently close to the school.
We celebrated her DD's 18th with them, when it was my DD's birthday just a couple of months later we heard nothing from anyone in the family and haven't heard from them in the 2 years since. I sent a couple of messages and just gave up after no responses.
I feel used and foolish for thinking we were friends and it made me look at other friendships and wonder if I'd misjudged those too.
I'm fortunate that I have a good circle of friends who reminded me that I'm not at fault, it must be far harder to move on without that support.

CoffeeAndWhiskey

"A quick question though, to those of you who say they would just like to know why they were ghosted, or who feel it is awful because they don't know if/what they did wrong - how do you think that last conversation would go?

Just one more question, do you really think that this would be a constructive last conversation or would it be more likely to be all tears and screaming?"

I'm with you OP. If people are really honest with themselves these conversations never go well. They never actually lead to a tearful reunion and apologies, they are about evasion and lies: We've all had them: they go one of two ways:

Blatantly dishonest and unsatisfactory:

Ghostee: "Why did you ghost me?"
Ghoster: "I didn't. I was just busy."

Or:

Honest, hurtful and offensive:

Ghostee: "Why did you ghost me?"
Ghoster: "Because I think you're dull and limited, your fiance is a controlling bastard and I would increasingly prefer to be alone than spend money going to a wine bar to hear about your wedding plans/interior design plans/views on politics/ideas about starting your own business."

Apart from circumstances where a very specific offence has been committed, in the majority of cases these are about incidents which have suddenly brought to light what you've suspected anyway, which is that you and your friend have grown apart. Airing this all in public, with our own hurts and biases, helps no-one and makes everyone feel like shit.

A lot of the time it is actually better to walk away.