to ask what people find painful about ghosting?

[CoffeeAndWhisky]

Just had a conversation with DH about this yesterday and realised I find it quite difficult to understand why people feel hurt by it. My logic has always been...

... either we didn't get on as well as I thought, in which case it is a shame but a conversation won't change that

...something happened in their life that keeps them busy but that they don't want to share with me, in which case they don't owe me an explanation

... we have grown apart and the 'ghoster' doesn't feel it is worth the time and effort to re-build the friendship/relationship, which is fair enough

...I may have said or done something that made them do it - in that case, I retrace my steps and if I can't find anything unreasonable, it is their loss. If I did fuck up, I apologise and take it from there.

Don't get me wrong, I have never ghosted anyone and I have not really been ghosted much either.

The reason it came up between me and DH was that our single-household bubble friend was ghosted by a friend she met at the beginning of this year and was in tears about it. Obviously, we tried to help her work through this but when we talked about it more generally after she left, DH mentioned that he is still surprised by how little I care on the rare occasion that someone ghosts me (naturally, I did not say anything like 'no big deal' to our friend). However, he also couldn't really explain why/what he finds hurtful about these situations - so I guess my question really is, why do some people find ghosting hurtful?

YABU = I'd feel hurt if someone ghosted me
YANBU = I wouldn't feel hurt if someone ghosted me.

I have a friend who was actually ghosted by her FIANCE. Do you think your list applies there or would you see the issue?

For me it's the not knowing when to stop trying.

If someone I care about suddenly stopped replying to me, are they going through a terrible time and benefiting from their their good friends still reaching out now and then to show they're still thinking of them? Or are they rolling their eyes wondering when I'll get the hint and leave off?

I don't mind having friendships that wax and wane based on how busy we each are because there are times when I'm terrible at keeping in contact too. But I never want to be the pathetic hanger-on who can't take a hint. With silence is hard to tell when to draw the line and cut your losses.

I have only been ghosted once, by a very long standing friend from uni. She didn't ghost me personally, but more left behind her old life, of which I was a part. She deleted her social media presence, moved house, got a new job etc. It's a shame she chose to do it that way but I have always just accepted that she did, and there wasn't much I could do about it.

Ignorance is rude and rudeness can hurt people.

As PP's have mentioned, it takes moments to send a text/make a call. In a time when everyone's communication capacities are constantly expanding, it's understandable that people being ghosted might feel hurt. I also think people are more disposable now; my parents have the same friends now they had when I was growing up, whereas my generation tend to switch friendship groups more easily.

Because it's an expression of contempt, refusal to respond to or acknowledge is a way of saying (by implication) 'you no longer exist'

I voted yanbu because I personally wouldn't give a shit.
In fact, thinking about it now there have been people who just vanished. I never even noticed, much less care. I hope that doesn't make me a cow 😂

But just because I wouldn't care doesn't mean I can't understand that others feel differently. I think it's the not knowing that gets to people.
At least if you know what caused someone to go off you, you're not left wondering.

@BertieBotts

Perhaps you're not neurotypical, OP? I'm not and I relate to the kind of thing you're saying although I think I'd still be upset if someone I called a friend suddenly stopped responding to contact. I would feel a bit rejected by that. It's only happened to me once that I noticed and the person discovered a religious fervor which is why they stopped speaking to friends who don't share those values which I sort of understand but wonder why.

Perhaps OP just doesn't have a personality that craves explanations or reasonings, especially external ones?

The example OP gives is about a short term friendship that fizzled out. Hardly something to cry over (I'd actually presume that was sort of 'last straw' crying about other stress rather than being actually deeply hurt).

I agree with @MagMell - I'd hate to be officially 'dumped'. Quite apart from the fact that most of the friends I'm less than close to these days might still run into me at mutual friends get togethers.

I've been 'ghosted' I guess by an old friend who lives very close to my parents. Close enough to exchange favours with them. I'm not going to make it awkward for either side, I'm just not going to bother with it.

I don't need some angsty reasoning. I know she just doesn't care about the relationship. Meh.

I just miss him and the amazing (to me anyway) messages we used to share now and then. It was only an occasional thing but I had chats with him that I won't have with anyone else.

I understand perfectly well that he doesn't feel the same way but he just disappeared and that still makes me sad now and then

The disrespect. If you've had a pleasant time together mostly and the person just wants to end it for whatever reason. But doesn't think you're worth a conversation.

This happened to me after being together 2 months. I've heard of it happening to people after years! Pure cowardice.

If a friend goes quiet for a while, I assume there's something going on good or bad that they're dealing with, and they'll tell me if/when they want to. I don't regard not being in contact for a few months as some kind of unforgivable friendship sin. I'm happy to hear from them again when they want to, but am not hanging about weeping into my tea in case I might have caused offence

Neither do i

But i do if its been years!

Although obviously i didnt ‘weep into my tea’ 😀

I've been ghosted and also ghosted someone else.

When it happened to me, the friendship had been on its last legs for a couple of years but we kept trying to keep it going. She ended up with a lot going on in her personal life and just decided that she didn't have the energy to flog our relationship any longer. I was initially pissed off when she ignored a few of my texts over a period of time, she eventually replied explaining the friendship was over and why and I didn't reply to that one as I'd have hated to think she could ignore me again - the line was drawn and in some ways it felt like a relief. Obviously I had some closure there but it followed weeks of being ignored.

I ghosted an old friend about 5 years ago. She was one of my closest friends who i confided in about everything, some really deep personal things that it turns out she couldn't be trusted knowing. I'd questioned her a few times but she always assured me she wouldn't hurt me. As soon as I had proof that she'd betrayed my trust that was it - blocked her on everything and never spoke to her since that moment. I owe her nothing at all! She can fuck off, and she knows exactly what she done. I wouldn't lower myself to give her another opportunity to lie to my face or try to worm her way out of it.

I feel kind of the same way about it as the OP I think, although I do understand why it can cause hurt.

I think if you have been close friends with someone for years, through thick and thin, just deciding one day that you never want to speak to them again is hurtful and demeaning. Friendships fade and wax and wane but who the fuck just wakes up one day and decides never to speak again?

I was ghosted by someone I considered one of my closest friends fifteen years ago. She had more friends than me and I think I was not as special to her as she was to me but she would have considered me a good friend, I am sure of that.

The heartbreak of being ghosted was akin to any relationship break up I have ever had and in fact, maybe lasted longer. It is no exaggeration to say that she broke my heart. The hardest thing to deal with was understanding why, I have come up with various theories over the years but I will never know.

I have come up with various theories over the years but I will never know

At least i found out why in the end...and we had a chance to reconnect

The other one can go fuck herself 😀

If it was just a date or two or someone I'd met once or twice I'd find it very rude but wouldn't give it much thought. If it was someone I had an actual relationship with (platonic or otherwise) then of course it's incredibly hurtful and likely to cause anxiety. I wouldn't know what I'd done wrong, whether there'd been some gossip about me or some misunderstanding that hadn't been cleared up and I would worry the same thing would happen in another friendship. If the friendship just petered out naturally due to different lifestyles or interests that's completely different. Not even having the respect to tell someone that you're too busy to see them or that you feel you've drifted apart is really unkind.

(Obviously this doesn't apply to people who are abuisve in which case it's fine to remove yourself as quickly and safely as you can from the relationship).

Have you got autistic straits op?
I only ask because my autistic nephew has the same detached view of relationships - he's not very close to anyone, so he doesn't get bothered if they withdraw even more from him.

I'm NT and I would be very hurt by a friend ghosting me (which is different from a friendship drifting or ending naturallly)

I was ghosted after a 2.5 year relationship. If someone can't see why that would hurt, a lot, then I would suggest they need some kind of help!

I have ghosted someone before, I'm not proud of it but at the time it was what was best for my mental health.
We became friends when she was in a position of power over me (think boss, teacher, etc) and she was always a bit pushy. I visited her in her new home when she left the position and she pushed/felt forced to go on a working holiday with her to another country even though I'd made it clear I couldn't afford it/really didn't want to go as I'd be expected to give a public presentation. After this I did a master's but struggled to gain employment in the field after finishing so I moved home (less commutable opportunities but saved a bunch of money), I was also struggling with my mental health and imposter syndrome. I confided in her during this period and instead of being supportive and encouraging she tried to push me to apply for jobs I didn't want and was uncomfortable with. Eventually I told her I didn't really want employment advise but over the following weeks/days she continued to push so I just stopped replying, she got her boyfriend (who I'd also worked with) to message me a few times so I gave non committal and vague replies but eventually stopped replying to them too. It's probably been 2/3 years since but I still dread birthdays and holidays where she may message and ask what I'm up to. I'm happy to have her on my social media as I don't use it all that often and it's still nice to see the occasional update from her but I won't be replying to any messages anytime soon as I feel she used her position over me a little too much and didn't respect my wishes. I don't doubt it probably hurt her at the time but think we're both better off with things as they currently stand.

I was totally ghosted after 20 years of marriage. ExH walked out one day without me having a clue that anything was even wrong to go and live with the OW.
I had to get through the divorce without being able to speak to him without any aspect of it being discussed, didn't know where he lived, was unable to have any of my questions ansered which I thought I damned well deserved after 20 years of taking care of him financially and physically.
He left loads of debt and unfinished business behind which I had to deal with whilst I was quite seriously ill.
It was the cowards way out - he wanted to start a new life with OW without having to be bothered with tying up the loose ends of his old life. He let me do all that and it almost led to a complete breakdown. Not only was I left with all this unresolved grief there were also practical things I needed to sort out and couldn't because he wasn't around to give me account numbers or signatures.
Its disgusting to do that to another person who cares about you.

I don't think I've ever been ghosted or ghosted anyone, but I have fallen out with people or we have drifted apart. I'm sure I've been phased out as well, but not necessarily deliberately, that I know of. The thing with telling someone you don't want to be friends anymore is that you then today burn your bridges, when it may be that you are still someone's friend but you both, genuinely, are so busy you end up seeing or contacting each other less and less.

But I don't think that's the same thing as ghosting, where I think someone out of the blue stops talking to you at all? I know a friend who had that and he was so hurt. The friend who ghosted him was a total twat tbh, so no loss really, but it was very hurtful at the time. My friend was genuinely worried about the ghosting friend and called him from a withheld number to see if he picked up, honestly to see he was alive and well, as he'd gone from best buds to no contact and refusing to answer the phone. Anyway, he picked up all happy sounding and my friend then knew he was avoiding him and that was that for the friendship. My friend had thought the other friend was unwell or in some awful situation where he couldn't answer the phone. Very inconsiderate and twatty, I thought.

It isn't something I have ever done or experienced and I don't know why it is such a thing now, based on how often it gets talked about. I know it happens a lot in O.L.D. as well. Someone decides they aren't into the other one and goes from all over them to zero contact, which again, is awful behaviour imo.

@madcatladyforever what an arsehole! I thought my ex was bad!

Because it is a rejection.

ALL rejection hurts. Whether it’s being dumped, not getting a job you interviewed for, not being invited to an event when all other friends have been..... rejection is a very real emotion and regardless of whether you can rationalise it (ie someone more experienced got the job over you) it still smarts.

The thing with ghosting is that you have absolutely no clue why you are being rejected. The person is telling you loud and clear that you are absolutely not even worth two minutes of their time or effort.
Yes it is because THEY are immature / emotionally incapable - but trying to rationalise this when you feel rejected is really hard.
If you’ve been ghosted of course it’s most likely not your fault but I think most people are predispositioned to feel that the rejection is personal (as in there’s something wrong with their looks / personality etc)

I was ghosted by a friend back in my Late teenage years, I still don’t know what I did or what they didn’t like about me. Of course now it doesn’t matter but I spent many years wondering

Yikes, yes, what happened to @madcatladyforever has got to be the absolute worst ghosting! Similar happened to my lovely former colleague. She had no idea anything was wrong, came home and the absolute bellend had written her a wee note saying he was off .

I agree with you OP.

Firstly I think the "ghosting" thing is massively over-used. You have to distinguish between "ghosting" in an intimate relationship, which is a bit of a snub, and ghosting in a much less important friendship: people complain about having been "ghosted" because someone doesn't reply to their invite to a coffee morning and I think in that case there's not much more to it than that they are busy and didn't get round to it. It's annoying but not worth sulking over for months. People are busy and sometimes they forget, it may be easy to reply to a text message but they have millions of other things to deal with. Yes its marginally rude but its not a fundamental insult or a sign of deep imbalance in the Force.

I think people also overstate the need for "closure" quite a lot in personal relationships and think its some sort of birth-right to get a full debrief on why the friendship went wrong. You see people coming on MN all the time saying "my friend ghosted me -- I just wanted to know what I'd done wrong etc". When in fact its almost always one of two scenarios: a) the friends have grown apart or b) the ghostee has been a bit rubbish and knows they've been rubbish but is offended that they've been called on it.

I've pulled away from friends in the past because I've felt dissed by them at some really primal level and sometimes I've taken the view that its something I can't come back from: that the friend may apologise but the action pointed to a fundamental lack of respect or an imbalance in the friendship. In that scenario I wouldn't bother telling someone what they'd done to hurt me because I wouldn't expect them to understand or to be able to truly make amends. So you can call it "ghosting" but I prefer to call it cutting my losses and not expending vast amounts of emotional capital on something I will never get back.

@madcatladyforever

That’s an incredibly cruel thing he did to you. Surely he must be a sociopath. I can’t believe after 20 years there’s not even a text.