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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not want to do hours of unpaid work

97 replies

needAbackBone1 · 01/09/2020 11:41

I'm pretty sure i'm not being unreasonable but maybe I am or someone can help me get out this situation.
In short, I run a very small consultancy (just me). A distant family friend runs the sort of business I help out. About 5 months ago this friends elderly mother died, not unexpectedly she had been ill for a long time. Right up to her death she helped out a lot with the business (was originally hers) and after she died family friend asked for some help getting things in order as things had slid whilst she was ill. I said off course and spent many hours with him helping him improve what was being done.
Over the last 4 months I have answered every call and helped in anyway I can but its starting to get a bit much. He is now expecting me to essentially manage the business for him, in the last week he has called asking me to deal with a crisis (expecting me to interrupt time allocated to a paying client), sent me a pile of expenses to analyse where we can cut costs and given my number to his staff and asked them to call me with any problems. I lost a lot of work due to corona so currently have the time to be dealing with these things but I can't help feeling a little put out.
Anyway the AIBU would be am I being unreasonable to tell family friend that whilst I was happy to help sort out the immediate mess after his mums death if he would like me to continue to help and manage aspects of the business he needs to pay me? I wouldn't necessarily charge my standard rate but at least a token offering would be appreciated since my income has dropped almost 50% since January.

OP posts:
ImperfectTents · 01/09/2020 11:42

Don't cut your rate . Charge him. Cheeky fucker

needAbackBone1 · 01/09/2020 11:43

Also meant to include so as not to drip feed that I really need to avoid this turning nasty, although he is a distant family friend he still sees MIL regularly and we are very close neighbors so see each other almost daily going about our lives although don't socialise as he is considerably older than me.

OP posts:
ImperfectTents · 01/09/2020 11:43

Send him am estimate of costs for the work and then move on

ImperfectTents · 01/09/2020 11:46

He should have paid you from the start, don't worry about his feelings he doesn't give a shit about yours

Marylou2 · 01/09/2020 11:49

Make it extremely clear that you will be charging your full professional rate from September 1st. He is absolutely taking advantage of your kindness. Quote him for the job and send a contract/T&C. A firm hand is needed.

TheHappyHerbivore · 01/09/2020 11:50

There is no need at all for it to turn nasty (unless he’s a total twat, but that is not under your control).

Just have a chat and explain you’ve been happy to help him through this rough patch but you can’t afford to keep doing so. Let him know he can either start paying your going rate (you are not remotely obliged to offer a discount so only do so if you actually want to and can comfortably afford to do so) or look for someone else to assist.

You’ve done more than enough already - you don’t need to feel bad about putting a stop to an arrangement which absolutely doesn’t work for you.

ZenZebra · 01/09/2020 11:51

Just tell him that you now need to concentrate on your paid work.

That leaves the way clear for him to offer to pay you for your time if he wants you to continue.

Elouera · 01/09/2020 11:52

If you give out 'mates rates' to everyone, you will never get anywhere.

you have helped him out for 5mths, for free!!! Of course you need tocut ties and let him get on with it. if he hasnt sorted out a manager or someone else by now, he never will. If its easier, say, from X date, you need to back to your own job role, so can no longer provide the same support. Who have YOU planned to take all this one???

needAbackBone1 · 01/09/2020 11:54

I think you're all right. DP has been telling me to charge him since the second session I spent with him. I am just a complete people pleaser the second someone starts to get angry or act upset me instinct is to do anything to make the situation pleasant again.
Going to have to put on my brave pants and tell him if he wants this level of work he needs to pay. I am pretty new to the consultancy industry and I have probably earned a bit of a reputation as being someone people can call and ask quick questions to but I think he is taking advantage of that good nature.
Trying to decide if it would be better to send an email or to lay it out next time we meet in person that any future meetings/work sent/crisis management will be charged for.

OP posts:
DinGaddy · 01/09/2020 11:55

As previous posters have said, show him that your time is as worth as much as his time. Otherwise you are putting money into his pocket in order to 'save' him and his business.

In a funny sort of way, if this awful life event hadn't happened, you'd be able to both communicate on professional terms. instead the emotion of the life event has distorted the conversation into this 'favour' situation.

I think you'd be right to explain you can only take on paid work from September (now) onwards due to COVID-19 impacting on your revenue. Dont let him come back with "but what about the business it will fold without your input" - that's for him to work out. He can get a loan, he can go into savings, the constitution and continuation of the business is his problem to manage.

DinGaddy · 01/09/2020 11:58

@needAbackBone1

I think you're all right. DP has been telling me to charge him since the second session I spent with him. I am just a complete people pleaser the second someone starts to get angry or act upset me instinct is to do anything to make the situation pleasant again. Going to have to put on my brave pants and tell him if he wants this level of work he needs to pay. I am pretty new to the consultancy industry and I have probably earned a bit of a reputation as being someone people can call and ask quick questions to but I think he is taking advantage of that good nature. Trying to decide if it would be better to send an email or to lay it out next time we meet in person that any future meetings/work sent/crisis management will be charged for.
I would meet in person as soon as you can - call a meeting with him to explain that the situation has to change due to your need to prioritise paid work.

If he is truly a business person and not some over emotional person desperately trying to bail out water from a sinking ship, then he'll understand.

If he tries to get emotional, reverse the situation - ask him what he would do in your shoes. Would he be able to fulfil all your client's requests for you for free? Would he be ok with your business going under as long as you continue to support his workflow?

Then follow up immediately after that day in writing, with your proposal of 50% off (if it's something you can genuinely afford - put forward whatever discount gets your business moving, and what he can stand -not what you think is pleasant for him).

ZenZebra · 01/09/2020 11:58

Trying to decide if it would be better to send an email or to lay it out next time we meet in person that any future meetings/work sent/crisis management will be charged for

I would send an email. That way your position is clear and you won't be tempted to backtrack. It also means that he already knows the score if/when you next meet.

RNBrie · 01/09/2020 11:59

I think this is pretty easy to solve... just say you've really enjoyed helping him out and it was good for you too to keep busy during lockdown, but work has really picked up again and you need to concentrate on your paying clients now. You'd be happy to take him on as a client, please see attached for your rates.

DillonPanthersTexas · 01/09/2020 12:00

My wife is an accountant and people are always asking her to 'have a quick look at their accounts' as if it is some 5min job to reconcile a year's worth of piss poor book keeping.

You did a nice thing OP but time to wind it back. Provide a date in the near future that you will be stepping away to concentrate on your increased work load. That will allow them to find an alternative account at.

missatrick · 01/09/2020 12:01

Dear Friend,
Thanks for your email. I just wanted to give you a bit of an update on my work situation. As you know, I lost a lot of income/business, due to covid, and i was happy to help you during that quiet time for me.
However just now, i really need to concentrate on my paid clients, and see if I can recoup some of those losses accrued these last few months.
I hope you understand, but I'm a bit skint at the moment.

RubixMania · 01/09/2020 12:01

YANBU and they’re a CF.

You can keep it light and breezy:

‘Hi X. Just looking at your recent email about X. I’ve been happy to lend a hand through lockdown but as work is getting busier now I’m afraid I don’t have scope to keep helping out sorry. Happy to have a quick chat by phone or email if you have any final questions at all this week though. Thanks’

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 01/09/2020 12:05

Tell him that you're very sorry, but you also have bills to pay and you need to take as many PAYING jobs as possible to catch up on lost business, so Oh-so-sadly, you won't be able to do any more freebies for him now.
Sorry an' all that.
IF he's interested in paying you, "this" is your going rate - don't cut it - and he can let you know. Otherwise "this" is the number of another consultant in the same business who might be able to help him out.

You have to look out for yourself here - he's taking the piss entirely and you're letting him, so you need to stop.

People like him will take as much as you'll give and then expect more, and bitch and whinge when they don't get it. They don't appreciate the value of what you're doing because they're not paying for it.

Might be an idea to tot up the hours you've already done for him, calculate how much it would have cost at your standard rate and let him know exactly how much money's worth he's already had out of you!

Humbersider · 01/09/2020 12:05

I am just a complete people pleaser the second someone starts to get angry or act upset me instinct is to do anything to make the situation pleasant again

You really do need to get a handle on this, OP, or your business will never achieve its potential. Consider this current situation as practice for a new, more assertive and business-minded approach.

needAbackBone1 · 01/09/2020 12:08

dinGaddy I think you are completely correct, in fact we had discussed me maybe helping him out as a paid client late last year. At the time I was really busy and didn't have time to take him on and said I would let him know when a few of my short term contracts had finished up. Then corona and his mums death has changed the situation entirely making it a lot harder to say sorry no. Definitely a lot of emotion attached as his mum was a lovely lady who had poured her life into the buisness.

I think going down the angle of now corona is easing and paid work is picking back up etc etc is a good idea so thanks to everyone suggesting that. Its a perfect excuse rather than simply if i'm not being paid i'd rather spend my time doing something fun which is nearer the truth

OP posts:
Newfornow · 01/09/2020 12:10

Do not work at 50 percent reduction. Your time and skills are worth paying for.

IntermittentParps · 01/09/2020 12:11

I think meet in person. You can explain with a friendly face and gestures etc, and it'll come off much better than an email where you can't judge tone.

Just say calmly that from September ie today you'll be charging your usual rate for any work he requires from you. Have your rate(s) in your head and/or laid out on paper so you can pass them straight to him for his info.

Any guilt trip attempts, smile and say, 'I was very happy of course to help you with getting things in order over that difficult period. I'm applying normal rates and conditions from now on.'

You don't need to apologise and you certainly don't need to give him details about having bills to pay or needing to catch up on lost business.

Intelinside57 · 01/09/2020 12:12

Don't apologise (do not use the word sorry). Email him - Dear x, before I start work on the latest batch you have sent me I think we need to clarify that I will have to charge you for it at my usual rate of x. I was happy to help you out for a short period of time but I think you will agree that I've more than done that. I can't afford to carry on working for free, and turning away paid work as a result.
You're saying things like "if he wants this level of work" and you need to change that mindset. You've done a massive amount of work for him at a cost to your business (your potential earnings with others). There's no negotiation about the type of work, or how much, this is a professional relationship going forward - you charge your normal rate. If he's not happy no problem, box up his stuff and return it to him.
And - if you haven't already you need some sort of service level agreement setting out expectations for your customer. It will say that you will deal with phone calls within a reasonable timescale. You will not interrupt meetings or calls with other clients in any circumstances.
Get a backbone or go under Op!

frazzledasarock · 01/09/2020 12:12

Invoice him. Send him a pro-forma ask for half up front and rest on completion.

Do not offer him a discount. It’s your livelihood. Does he come round to yours and do your accounts/housework/cooking for free? No well why are you?

Why are people afraid to charge for their work? People often ask me to do xyz for them. I always say my hourly rates are £xxxxx or do you want to go shop around as I’m very senior in my field and they could get a cheaper person to do the tasks.

Eddielzzard · 01/09/2020 12:12

You shouldn't give him a discount. You will resent it / him.

Use the excuse that you no longer have time, but he's being a total CF expecting you to work for nothing. He ought to be ashamed, but remember, it won't be you souring the relationship. It'll be him.

SpaceOP · 01/09/2020 12:13

Various versions of the emails PPs have suggested are all good. You were happy to help but can't continue to spend this amount of time not doing your paid work etc etc.

I am pretty new to the consultancy industry and I have probably earned a bit of a reputation as being someone people can call and ask quick questions to but I think he is taking advantage of that good nature

Incidentally - this is something you need to take into account and incorporate into your rates. It will probably take a while to get to the point where you're comfortable with this, but basically, your rates need to cover you for everything - the 30 second emails sent 3 x a day, the time spent thinking about the client or chatting about them with a third party that can enhance their business in some way, your holiday and sick pay etc. So the technical per hour rate might be high, but actually, it's fair.

I have a client who pays me for 3 days a month. I make it clear that if I get anywhere NEAR actually time sheeting 3 days, then we need to increase the fee as we both know that a) I'm available to him 24/7 which is pretty sweet for him considering how little he pays b) there's a lot of to'ing and fro'ing that doesn't get timesheeted - quick calls, emails, texts etc c) there are other things i'm doing that have an indirect benefit for him and d) my day rate for him is heavily discounted.

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