To wonder if you know that the meat you buy could have been raised in a factory farm...

[MsWonderful]

And that the animals could also have been subjected to horrific cruelty even if the farm is Red Tractor approved?
www.daventry.radio/daventry-farm-suspended-from-red-tractor-scheme-amid-animal-welfare-concerns/

Well most meat I eat has existed solely in the first place purely to be eaten, has then been killed, cooked and eaten. It's a bit hypocritical to then get uppity about how said animal has been treated prior to ending up on my plate.

What bizarre logic.

I shoot the occasional deer for the freezer.

I don't set out to inflict pain or abuse it in any way. Just kill it quickly.

Your thought process is fucked.

Sadly people have to often prioritise cost, and many just stick their heads in the sand...I only buy Waitrose registered farms, or local traceable meat but it is not the cheapest.
I grew up on a farm and as a result know enough to take the view buy organic or give up meat, same principle with eggs.

The really shocking thing here is the totally uneccessary cruelty by people, similar to the recent incidence of terrible cruelty in a goat farm recently in the news......

What is mentally wrong with men (as it has always been men who are cought)that they feel the need to hurt the animals they are working with......that is really disturbed.

They will no doubt be slating the awful animals rights activists who put up the secret cameras next
Yep! Terrorists they are...

@Dragongirl10

Sadly people have to often prioritise cost, and many just stick their heads in the sand...I only buy Waitrose registered farms, or local traceable meat but it is not the cheapest. I grew up on a farm and as a result know enough to take the view buy organic or give up meat, same principle with eggs.

The really shocking thing here is the totally uneccessary cruelty by people, similar to the recent incidence of terrible cruelty in a goat farm recently in the news......

What is mentally wrong with men (as it has always been men who are cought)that they feel the need to hurt the animals they are working with......that is really disturbed.

Yes it is usually men, though I did see a very disturbing video of a woman shearing a sheep (in Australia I think) and she was beating it over the head with the shears repeatedly. I don’t know what’s wrong with people that they want to do this. Maybe they’re attracted to a job where they can abuse animals, maybe the nature of the intensive farming makes the animals seem like an annoyance with minds of their own which must be dominated so the work can be done. Either way it’s a shit life for these unfortunate creatures

They will no doubt be slating the awful animals rights activists who put up the secret cameras next. Yep! Terrorists they are...
I'm glad that this abuse has been uncovered and I'm a farmer. This is what happens when farming is carried out by large organisations.
We are in Scotland and are signed up to Quality Meat Scotland assurance scheme. Because of covid we had a virtual inspection this year which was a bit odd. I suppose the reason for this thread is to discredit Red Tractor completely but these schemes are a whole lot better than nothing.

People have become so used to cheap meat (and milk and eggs for that matter) they don't want to pay what it actually costs.

As a society we're too used to having the best cuts of meat for a cheap price whenever we want. There is a reason we still have the tradition of Sunday roasts - back in the day meat (or good meat at least) was a once a week thing.

We don't see cheaper cuts of meat for sale as standard. You have to make a special trip to the butchers. We don't eat rabbit or pigeon anymore.

We all buy chicken breasts, medallions or fillets of pork, steak and nice beef. We don't want oxtail or beef cheeks for example - I couldn't tell you the last time I saw those in the butchers, let alone the supermarket.

We have a fairly wasteful and entitled attitude when it comes to meat. As a society I think we should try to get back to basics and focus on higher quality meat less often, rather than cheap meat every day.

I'd be angry if I found out my red tractor farm assured meat was raised in bad conditions. I've grew up farming and many of my friends now are farmers. Animal welfare is top priority to them. Happy, well cared for, healthy livestock breed better, handle easier and produce better milk/meat. It's in the animals, the farmers AND the consumers interest to keep a sharp eye on the accredited farms to ensure they're keeping up to the welfare standards set.
Im a meat eater and whilst I can't afford the top end meat that supposedly live the life of luxury before slaughter, I do buy local, use farm shops where possible and refuse to buy caged hen eggs and products I know use them.

I'd be angry if I found out my red tractor farm assured meat was raised in bad conditions. I've grew up farming and many of my friends now are farmers. Animal welfare is top priority to them. Happy, well cared for, healthy livestock breed better, handle easier and produce better milk/meat. It's in the animals, the farmers AND the consumers interest to keep a sharp eye on the accredited farms to ensure they're keeping up to the welfare standards set.
Im a meat eater and whilst I can't afford the top end meat that supposedly live the life of luxury before slaughter, I do buy local, use farm shops where possible and refuse to buy caged hen eggs and products I know use them. I'm the same.

Sheep shearing, for some reason, seems absolutely rife with cruelty. I don’t know if it’s because people have that association that sheep are ‘stupid’ and therefore somehow deserve to be treated badly? It’s a horrible attitude.

@swimster01

We're currently in the midst of a crisis which the experts have said is linked to disregard for nature, the environment and mass farming.

And that there will be more virus outbreaks if there is no change.

If you don't care about where your food is coming from, then you're part of the problem.

This needs to be broadcast and everyone needs to take notice. Our current crisis is not a random coincidence

I don’t know if it’s because people have that association that sheep are ‘stupid I know that they are not but that's from experience. But I'm guessing you know nothing about them.

@Lockheart

People have become so used to cheap meat (and milk and eggs for that matter) they don't want to pay what it actually costs.

As a society we're too used to having the best cuts of meat for a cheap price whenever we want. There is a reason we still have the tradition of Sunday roasts - back in the day meat (or good meat at least) was a once a week thing.

We don't see cheaper cuts of meat for sale as standard. You have to make a special trip to the butchers. We don't eat rabbit or pigeon anymore.

We all buy chicken breasts, medallions or fillets of pork, steak and nice beef. We don't want oxtail or beef cheeks for example - I couldn't tell you the last time I saw those in the butchers, let alone the supermarket.

We have a fairly wasteful and entitled attitude when it comes to meat. As a society I think we should try to get back to basics and focus on higher quality meat less often, rather than cheap meat every day.

Seven quid in Waitrose. Or £16.87/kg if you prefer to think of it like that - so when you take into account that the packet is only 71% meat, that works out as £23.76/kg. Which isn't exactly economical.

@MsWonderful

Have I preached sanctimoniously, or have I just started a thread about something that actually happened and asked if anyone knew about it? I haven’t even said anything about vegetarianism or veganism I don’t think?

You haven't preached at all, I suspect those who have taken umbrage are the same people who refuse to engage in the welfare of animals because it may call into question their ethics and a realisation that they aren't as ethical as they purport to be.

After reading the thread, I think I finally understand, some not all vegetarians/vegans replace meat with sanctimony, maybe it adds flavour

@formerbabe

Sadly I have a neurological condition which means I can't swallow. I'm fed by tubes and sorts.

@ TheHappyHerbivore

you might actually be a lunatic and I would suggest that an OPEN FORUM where people can post about whatever the fuck they like is not an ideal environment for you.

Ermm.....................I'm not the one resorting to bad language

So, can I safely assume you just like to be on the offensive ( in all meanings of the word) ?

Your username speaks volumes........................

Also, last I checked, 63% of posters consider the OP's stance unreasonable, ergo, they ABU

@derxa

I don’t know if it’s because people have that association that sheep are ‘stupid I know that they are not but that's from experience. But I'm guessing you know nothing about them.

Derxa I have clashed with you before about your steadfast refusal to accept anyone else’s experience as valid because you have a small holding.

I grew up on a farm, the animals weren’t badly treated but it certainly could not be described as nice for them. As a child I felt some of it was wrong and I saw the cattle develop personalities, one learnt to unhook the fencing that he knew he could escape from.

I know that people aren’t going to give up meat but wouldn’t it be nice if their living conditions were made better and people ate fewer of them?

@JustAnotherPoster00

After reading the thread, I think I finally understand, some not all vegetarians/vegans replace meat with sanctimony, maybe it adds flavour

Intelligent contribution 👏🏻

I grew up in a farming community eating meat I had seen raised.
I still eat meat but stick to free range or organic as much as possible.
I can't understand the logic that because an animal is going to die it doesn't matter how it lives.

Derxa I have clashed with you before about your steadfast refusal to accept anyone else’s experience as valid because you have a small holding. I don't have a small holding. I have an actual farm and everything... I don't remember clashing with you and I don't remember steadfastly refusing to accept anyone else's experience as valid. But if I did then I'm sorry.

"Those cows labelled Free Range may have to stay out in the rain/sun/cold that they would rather be out of, just because we think that they should be." Isn't that where they were before humans came along and decided to put up buildings?

@MitziK they're not basic products though are they? They're pre-prepared and cooked for you already. That's a fancy ready meal, not raw meat.

I can't say I've seen those in the Waitrose near me unfortunately, since they do look quite nice!

I wouldn't say sheep were stupid but they show a remarkable enthusiasm for dying and putting themselves in death inducing situations.
I still don't think they deserve cruelty or poor treatment though.

@derxa

Derxa I have clashed with you before about your steadfast refusal to accept anyone else’s experience as valid because you have a small holding. I don't have a small holding. I have an actual farm and everything... I don't remember clashing with you and I don't remember steadfastly refusing to accept anyone else's experience as valid. But if I did then I'm sorry.

It was under an old name and I was under the impression that it was a small holding but maybe I remembered incorrectly. But anyway, I don’t think people should be shut down because they don’t have a few sheep or whatever. Everyone is entitled to speak out about the farm industry. That the owner of that intensive farm on the video sits on several major farming boards is an indication of how much it is not all about animals having a wonderful life in the fields before a swift death.

People want to believe that because it’s easier.

And I do think that the Red Tractor scheme is not fit for purpose.

When you have no money Worth a damn and your kids need fed, you’re going to go for the cheap option. Often, for me, that was veggie and meat was a treat on a Sunday - almost always a chicken because I could feed us all, strip the carcass and boil the bones for soup. Mince a night in the week eked out with veggies.

I was working, going to university to do a degree, had kids to feed and provide for Because my ex left me literally destitute and every single penny counted. So I ate the cheap meat.

I ate the yellow sticker reduced stuff too.

I’m not going to apologise for it and I refuse to feel guilty.

I fed my kids. And there’s lots of people like me.

Now, I’m not so skint and I can as I said, afford to buy from the butcher. But when I couldn’t I didn’t. And if I was that skint again I’d do the exact same. Because I put my kids welfare above any animal.

For the record. I personally would have no problem killing an animal to eat it. It’s not as if I’m asking to be insulated from the nitty gritty of what goes on.