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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The Secret

281 replies

Stackys · 21/08/2020 09:29

AIBU to give “the secret” any thought?

I toyed with it years ago. Asked “the universe” for a £10 note. Walking through York the night after, found a wet soggy £10 note on the floor in a graveyard.

Played with it again a few weeks later. Asked the universe for a red balloon. Immediately afterwards I put YouTube on to listen to some music and the first recommended video was a song called something like “10 red balloons”. I’d never heard of the song before.

When I was a child, before I knew of “the secret” we were moving house and I desperately wanted a garden with steps in it. That would have been highly unusual in this area but I kept on thinking about it obsessively. The house we moved to had steps in the garden (the only house in the whole street that did).

My friend goes on about the secret all the time, I put all my “successes” down to coincidence as the alternative sounds batshit but some people truly believe it works, intelligent people!!

I watched the movie yesterday and I’ve decided I want £50k in my bank by New Year’s Eve 😂 ironically DH said to me this morning “we have nearly x amount in bank! The most we’ve ever had!” (Nowhere near £50k) ... maybe it’s already working lol

This is of course lighthearted but I’d be interested to hear other people’s experiences of it?! Please don’t turn it into a “you’re a fucking imbecile OP” type thread, it’s just for fun.

OP posts:
donquixotedelamancha · 21/08/2020 18:31

This thread demonstrates a key problem in the A-level system. Kids specialise too young, end up with zero scientific education from 14 or 15, and bob up in adulthood on threads like this entirely ignorant of scientific laws, practices and theories, but wittering on about ‘energy’ and ‘vibrations’ because they can’t distinguish between Einstein and Rhonda Byrne.

All UK children study Science up to 16. They should learn more than enough to know why this is bollocks.

Fundamentally someone who falls for this shit is vulnerable in some way- unhappy life, mental health issues, poor reasoning skills, poor education, grief- there are many factors which can make us succeptible to charlatans. Even educated, intelligent people can be fooled when something in their life is making them want easy answers.

Newfornow · 21/08/2020 18:33

It’s woo shit!!

DGRossetti · 21/08/2020 18:37

It's not just humans that fall for magical thinking ...

io9.gizmodo.com/how-pigeons-get-to-be-superstitious-5746904

B.F. Skinner is a psychologist best known for the Skinner Box, a kind of sensory-deprivation device which limits the creature inside it to only one form of stimulus at a time. Using one such box, he discovered 'superstition' in pigeons.

donquixotedelamancha · 21/08/2020 18:48

I'm confused, I said everything is made up of energy and people are trying to counter. Did you not learn science?

I should hope so, or I will need to ask for my money back on that degree.

The universe is not 'made of energy', it's made of matter. Nor is the 'law of vibration real'.

Energy is quite interesting because it's much less real than people think. Analagously you might rear a cow and sell it for £100 then buy a sheep for £30, leaving £70- but the money isn't changing into a sheep or a cow, it only has what value we give it; it's a way of keeping score and exchanging real objects.

It's perfectly valid to talk about an object having kinetic energy and we can mathematically describe how much might be exchanged into elastic energy, but that doesn't mean those two phenomena a really part of the same thing. We are using the 'types' of energy to describe a Scientific Model, nothing more.

Still, no matter how much Energy may be a social construct, that doesn't mean that identifying as someone who can use special energy to control their ex's twitter will make it so.

serenada · 21/08/2020 19:05

@donquixotedelamancha

Can you say some more on energy? I thought energy changed from one form to another - it cannot die as such.

Jellybeansincognito · 21/08/2020 20:10

‘I'm not sure that any of that follows from putting a wish out there to win the lottery, land your dream job or manifest your dream man? How is that dangerous or narcissistic? People don't suddenly start spending with gay abandon and to the point of bankruptcy because they know (or believe) that they're going to get a windfall of £50k by Christmas or something’

^

Because there’s people piling cash into things and only looking at the positive side of it, believing it won’t fail.

So many people have succumbed to financial loss over this stuff.

JoysOfString · 21/08/2020 20:15

Hmm, I thought scientists don’t actually know what the universe is made of, but matter and energy are two aspects of it. Matter can turn into energy and at least theoretically, vice versa. Also it’s true that matter vibrates/moves - that is, in effect, what heat is.

Of course it’s all theory but only in the sense that all science is.

That doesn’t mean that wooisms about vibrations, the universe and quantum are also right. They’re usually a huge misinterpretation of the scientific theories.

Namechange6005 · 21/08/2020 20:16

I've never heard of "the secret" but I believe the universe has powers! I have in past written to the universe and my wishes have come true.

Russellbrandshair · 21/08/2020 20:18

Of course you can, which is why following the way in which he interprets it in the doc is not a very good idea. I don’t know much about the rest of the theory or the book, just pointing out that this particular conman was indeed full of shite and not to be listened to

Of course he was a con man! But those people didn’t die due to the “secret” lol. They died of dehydration/ heat exhaustion in a sweat lodge.
Nothing whatsoever to do with visualisation lolol

Jellybeansincognito · 21/08/2020 20:19

@Namechange6005 it’s sad you can’t accept it for what it was and have to believe this instead.

Coincidence.

ZaraW · 21/08/2020 20:21

@Namechange6005

I've never heard of "the secret" but I believe the universe has powers! I have in past written to the universe and my wishes have come true.
Lol
Glitteryone · 21/08/2020 20:23

I’ve read the secret and the magic. Plus had the audiobooks for listening to in the car.

Neither really lived up to the hype for me..... I didn’t see any difference to my life.

Ethelfleda · 21/08/2020 20:42

Only read the first few pages but it does seem like confirmation bias coupled with taking more action because you feel more positive.
For example, on the flip side, I currently feel very low, have no self esteem and am convinced that most people don’t like me. I keep being proved right. Over and over again.
Maybe I should snap out of it and I will start to notice that good that happens, rather than the bad, and feel more confident which draws people to you I guess?

SamsMumsCateracts · 21/08/2020 20:43

Derren Brown did a programme about this once and basically proved that lucky people and people who view themselves as lucky, attract luck because they are more likely to go after what they want and take opportunities, no matter how small or insignificant they seem.

Lucyccfc68 · 21/08/2020 20:59

@LilaButterfly you didn't get those things because you 'wished' for them.

You got them because you 'looked' for them. You actively went about finding what you believed.

I teach this mind set on leadership workshops. For example if you actively look for the bad in people and the mistakes they make, you will find them. If you actively look for the good in people you will find it.

Most of what people are describing are NLP techniques - goal setting, actions, visualisation, positive language.

I have never heard any of it called 'the secret' it's a new one to me.

ThatsNotMyNameItsTooFluffy · 21/08/2020 21:04

Brings back Prince for a pp Wine
sometimes it is just snow lovely

FuckwitMcGee · 22/08/2020 07:21

What a pile of horseshit.

smallestleaf · 22/08/2020 09:11

I have in past written to the universe and my wishes have come true

So why did that women in Grenfall towers with two young children, two and four, who livestreamed herself praying as smoke billowed in underneath door not have her, I am sure very fervant wishes, come true? Was the universe on holiday? Or the six million jews, I am sure prayed and wished very fervantly too? Did the universe not answer because the universe is anti-semitic? Or is the universe's power limited to helping middle class professional women get promotions, parking spots and boyfriends?

Can you really not see that the 'Universe' granting your wishes is filling, in a modern secular form, one of the roles that organised religions used to play? It says something interesting about human psychology, and our deep evolved needs, but says nothing about the Universe.

smallestleaf · 22/08/2020 09:18

and basically proved that lucky people and people who view themselves as lucky, attract luck because they are more likely to go after what they want and take opportunities

I didnt' see that programme but have read a book by Richard Wiseman on the same topic. Basically the people you describe are not more 'lucky' but they live their lives in ways which mean they come across more opportunities and are more likely to take advantage of them. For example, 'lucky' people are likely to be more sociable and keep in touch with people. This means if they ever need help with something, they are more likely to know someone who can help them, they may think ' gosh how lucky that I knew someone to help with that specific thing' but its not really luck. Its the way they live their lives.

ActionNeeded · 22/08/2020 09:38

Not read (or even heard of this book) but I’m rather intrigued.

When I was a child, I remember ‘asking’ for things - I think I thought I was ‘praying’ at the time. I haven’t ‘asked’ for anything for years and years now, because it seemed I always got exactly what I asked for, but never in the way I’d envisioned. (Eg. At 6 or 7 I remember asking to be ‘one in a million’ and I was standing at the bottom of the garden by my rabbit hutch) - little thing had his jabs and reacted badly and ended up with a huge scab on the back of his neck which the vet referred to as ‘one in a million’ chance of happening - I felt awful!!! Yes, probably just a massive co-incidence, but it scared me.

Instead of asking, sometimes I’d just get a feeling - like, I needed to go to a specific place (sort of like the felix potion in Harry Potter) and I always met or came across something or someone which turned out to be super fortunate for me. This happened more as a child, rarely happens now.

Most recently, someone was selling raffle tickets and as I went to buy, something just clicked and I said if I buy a strip will I get the number 400? The next strip was 396-400, so I didn’t buy ‘out of turn’ or anything. I just knew 400 would win (no idea why). Sure enough, I had an email a few days later - come and collect your prize - which ticket was on the prize? Yep. 400.

These examples are teeny tiny silly things, but I do wonder if there’s more to it. Why do we sometimes have that internal ‘you need to do this?’ or as an above poster said, how did their Mum ‘just know’ that she was going to win the car?

Namechange6005 · 22/08/2020 10:40

@ActionNeeded

Not read (or even heard of this book) but I’m rather intrigued.

When I was a child, I remember ‘asking’ for things - I think I thought I was ‘praying’ at the time. I haven’t ‘asked’ for anything for years and years now, because it seemed I always got exactly what I asked for, but never in the way I’d envisioned. (Eg. At 6 or 7 I remember asking to be ‘one in a million’ and I was standing at the bottom of the garden by my rabbit hutch) - little thing had his jabs and reacted badly and ended up with a huge scab on the back of his neck which the vet referred to as ‘one in a million’ chance of happening - I felt awful!!! Yes, probably just a massive co-incidence, but it scared me.

Instead of asking, sometimes I’d just get a feeling - like, I needed to go to a specific place (sort of like the felix potion in Harry Potter) and I always met or came across something or someone which turned out to be super fortunate for me. This happened more as a child, rarely happens now.

Most recently, someone was selling raffle tickets and as I went to buy, something just clicked and I said if I buy a strip will I get the number 400? The next strip was 396-400, so I didn’t buy ‘out of turn’ or anything. I just knew 400 would win (no idea why). Sure enough, I had an email a few days later - come and collect your prize - which ticket was on the prize? Yep. 400.

These examples are teeny tiny silly things, but I do wonder if there’s more to it. Why do we sometimes have that internal ‘you need to do this?’ or as an above poster said, how did their Mum ‘just know’ that she was going to win the car?

I have also experienced things like this all my life.
donquixotedelamancha · 22/08/2020 13:30

I thought scientists don’t actually know what the universe is made of, but matter and energy are two aspects of it. Matter can turn into energy and at least theoretically, vice versa.

We know pretty well what the universe is made of: matter and (probably) something else. We know a lot about the matter. It's certainly true that mass can decrease and some types of energy (which is more about why things happen than what they are made of) be released but that (perfectly reasonable) way of describing it as 'matter changes into energy' is very simplistic and doesn't really tell us much unless we can define what we mean by energy.

@serenada

Can you say some more on energy? I thought energy changed from one form to another - it cannot die as such.

That's certainly the way I prefer to teach it (which highlighting the limitations). The problem with it is that it leaves you open to 'well there might be unknown types of energy which butterflies use to sell furniture and you are just being closed minded'.

The Institute of Physics have successfully pushed to move teaching in the UK away from this model somewhat. I'm not a fan, because I think 'what is energy?' is one of the more complex questions in Physics and the 'energy transfer' model you describe works great in most situations and is easily understood.

To illustrate the problem:

Say you are next to a fire. You can detect the 'heat energy' and 'light energy' coming off the fire thanks to cells in your eyes and skin. Those two things really are part of the same phenomenon (Electromagnetic waves).

As that heat and light impacts on the surface of an object near the fire that object will heat up. The particules in it will vibrate faster. That's a completely different phenomenon. We can calculate the energy hitting the object and it will heat up by that much, but the only thing linking the two phenomena is the currency we use (Joules) to measure the energy involved. Really the heat energy travelling from the fire and the heat energy of the object are not the same thing at all.

If you bend that object you 'give it elastic potential energy', but really what you are doing is distorting the bonds between molecules to a higher energy state and when they snap back the object will transfer that energy to something else. If it hits your hand it will impart some heat energy, for example. Is that really an 'energy store' in the same way as when you store energy in food? Possibly, but what about when you store energy by raising the object in a gravity field, is that the same too?

Now the truth is that a lot of these phenomena are related because they are about how the matter of the universe behaves in relation to fundamental forces. You can describe how sound, elasticity, heat, movement all relate to each other closely enough to perhaps unfiy them under 'energy'- but does that make them the same as EM waves or nuclear binding energy.

My (very, very longwinded- apologies) point is that Energy as a thing in it's own right doesn't really exist. We give various phenomena the same units (joules) and use maths to work out how they affect each other, and we unify them all under the concept of energy because it's a really, really useful tool for working out how the world works.

But they are real, measurable phenomena governed by the way the physical properties of the universe- the model is always simpler than the reality. There can be no unknown mysterious 'vibrational energy' and you can't use it to send messages to some universal Father Christmas.

DGRossetti · 22/08/2020 13:36

dark energy

if you listen very quietly, you'll hear a pop as Prof. Brian Cox exasperates. And if that doesn't do it ...

dark matter

That's it. He's in orbit Smile

donquixotedelamancha · 22/08/2020 13:45

dark matter

I mentioned that.

"We know pretty well what the universe is made of: matter and (probably) something else.

dark energy

I am not even slightly going there.

To answer your teasing seriously (boring)- none of the uncertainies about how galaxies move or how the universe expands change my basic point that Energy is nothing like what the mountebanks, hucksters and snake oil saleswomen make out.

At the risk of continuing the derail: I am pretty sure you could cover this stuff a lot better than me DG.

BananaShackles · 22/08/2020 13:50

But they are real, measurable phenomena governed by the way the physical properties of the universe- the model is always simpler than the reality. There can be no unknown mysterious 'vibrational energy' and you can't use it to send messages to some universal Father Christmas.

I'd quite like to put this as a sticky not alone on all 'cosmic ordering' threads, but on general 'woo' threads, where the scientifically-illiterate prattle about vibrations and energy and the ghost their mum's hairdresser (a total sceptic) really, definitely saw when she was falling asleep aged five, and then they discovered that someone had DIED in the house, seriously, and end by misquoting Hamlet on their being 'more things in heaven and earth' with an air of great cleverness.

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