To think masks are just being treated as completely optional?!

[JuniperFather]

I went shopping today in Sainsburys and Asda, needed to get some items for DD that would have taken too long to arrive if online. For reference I live in the South East (M25/A3).

I wore a mask, as I have done since the rules have changed. Yes it was uncomfortable in the heat, but it was done to respect and protect others. If I have the privilege of being able to use a public space and shop, then it's hardly a privation to protect others as per the Government guidance.

Yet today, on my two visits, I reckon I saw maybe 30 or 40 people wandering around without masks. Probably more than that.

Quite a few were young men, late teens early 20s, completely oblivious. One was a lady who glared at anyone who even dared look at her. A few were local workmen. Another lady in her 50s, a few who were a bit younger.

I would go as far to say that maybe half of the shop were wearing masks, and half weren't.

My AIBU question is, do you think people are now just now viewing masks as completely optional when in such spaces, rather than an enforceable requirement as per the Government's steer?

YABU: No they're not being viewed as optional. All these people probably have hidden disabilities.

YANBU: You're right. People are just doing what they want.

I start this thread in the fear however that I will get a slew of responses from people saying

• I suffered trauma which means I can't cover my face
• I have breathing difficulties

etc..

This post is not for you - the Government make it clear in the 7 August face coverings briefing that you are exempt.

However my question is, was everyone I came across REALLY in this category? Is Britain a country with thousands of people with breathing difficulties and unresolved traumas, when continental Europe, Asia etc have much higher rates of mask compliance?

Or as per my question, my real suspicion is that the dozens of people I saw, just can't be arsed with a mask and won't ever be told what to do. They know those two shops won't challenge them, and the likelihood of the police being called or getting fined is low. So they just do what they want.

AIBU to think it's all just being treated as completely optional, and those of us bearing discomfort and wearing masks to protect others are just sheep?

The government said to us that from the 24th of July we had to wear masks because the observation evidence said it would reduce cases by 40%. I’m still waiting for it any reduction! It’s not stopped new cases at all.

The massive majority of people are wearing masks when at the higher of the epidemic hardly anyone was yet we have still continued in a downwards trajectory. Hospital admissions are at there lowest.

There is no evidence what so ever that masks work.

I wear one purely so I can get in a shop.

@Sockwomble they were being loud enough for the whole of Tesco to hear.

Your experience matches mine op. I work in a supermarket inside the M25 and I'm noticing more and more people not wearing masks as the week goes on. Social distancing is also thin on the ground too, lots of people not following the queue system and also not standing where they should in relation to the shields round the till.

@myhumps123 spot on, I think the majority of people would be gobsmaked if they realised the number of women who had been raped/sexually assaulted, most of these women have lived in silence or only spoken anonymously to charities - why should they have to disclose this to some self righteous mask wearer anyway? People are so intent on proving they are better than everyone else they seem unable to comprehend the trauma (not just rape but other traumatic events) many have gone through.

Another big trauma women face is birth related ptsd, I’ve seen estimates of between 1-9%, many face issues with having any sort of breathing restriction to the point where exercise and even yoga are enough to be triggers, how do you think a face mask sits with them?

Added to this there are many other many traumatic events where breathing restrictions can be triggering for survivors.

You would be so surprised at how many people are walking round every day having to deal with traumas, they are survivors so most would normally not know. But something obvious like masks points them out.

Many be, just maybe, rather than sitting in smug self congratulation at being lucky enough to be able to wear a mask without it causing severe psychological distress (sometimes with very physical consequences) you should spend the time learning about the hell many of the people I. Your community live through every day , even in normal times.

I'm in Sheffield and it seems, especially in shops, compliance is very high.

The only people not complying with the masks in Waitrose yesterday were a young couple in their late 20s or so.

The only person I saw without a mask, was an elderly lady.
I assumed she had an exemption

You wear your mask with pride and keep your nose out.

People who keep their nose out are wearing their mask wrong

Sorry OP, very high compliance here. I'm usually the only mask-free customer in the supermarket.

@ilovesooty

Am I missing where the OP said they were outraged?

ha you're not missing anything where it said that.

It's just the usual lowball tactic from people who like to make an OP look silly by completely falsely claiming "overinvestment".

An OP can calmly set out an argument, and then those made uncomfortable will respond with

• "You're overinvested, you need to take a step back and chill"

• "Why the outrage? Why so incensed? It's not a thing"

etc etc..

Such emotional gaslighting would be jumped on in any other circumstances.

@Lifeisgenerallyfun

Oh ffs it’s not like this around here- I’d say well over 90% of people are wearing them. The woman who glared at your is probably fucked off beyond all belief at self righteous cunts glaring at her, she’s probably got more than enough to deal with.

I suggest you take the energy of your outrage And direct it somewhere useful.

So it's ok to call someone a self-righteous c_ for making an observation? How on EARTH do you know "she has enough to deal with" and isn't just one of those people a previous poster described overhearing, saying "Oh i forgot a mask...but doesn't matter, they can't challenge me anyway if I don't have one".

None of us know anything about anyone. But I'm entitled to start a post about the general mask wearing compliance in the UK.

And yeah I censored the word as a male before anyone starts - just as I hope some sectors of society might censor the N word even if with an A at the end.

I do think it's unlikely that all the people without masks had an exemption. But this is MN where there are no naughty kids, no benefit chests and all rude adults have undiagnosed SN.

Compliance is high here (SE) which means I wear one even though exempt as I can't face the nosy buggers who will raise it with me. From what I know from other exempt people they're also wearing them for the same reason as me.

If you can wear a mask you are not exempt.

@AnneElliott

I do think it's unlikely that all the people without masks had an exemption. But this is MN where there are no naughty kids, no benefit chests and all rude adults have undiagnosed SN.

Compliance is high here (SE) which means I wear one even though exempt as I can't face the nosy buggers who will raise it with me. From what I know from other exempt people they're also wearing them for the same reason as me.

Your second sentence pretty much sums up how I feel about this thread and this forum. Of course it's unlikely all the people without masks have an exemption, but if you dare to raise that point, you get hammered, bullied and re-directed towards talking about people who DO have exemptions. It's like a kind of relentless obfuscation to stop debate about the named issue.

Where is the evidence wearing a mask works?

Yippee, another mask thread! (Pulls up chair)

It's obvious the government doesn't care about this issue very much, unlike the citizens of Mumsnetland, given how many vitriolic threads there about masks. Notice that they did not tell us why they suddenly made masks compulsory in shops, having previously dismissed masks as no good. The government knew it would give them favourable headlines, it would make them appear to be doing something, at no cost to themselves, and the fact that they didn't bother to implement a costly system of exemptions, but instead went for a haphazard and unenforceable system says it all about how much they really value the masks. Perhaps some members of the public have sensed this.

The public have proved that they're willing to act as enforcers for the government (Easter eggs, toilet roll, the fictional 1-hour rule for exercise, etc.); the government knew this, so they threw in the masks, like throwing a bone to the public for the two sides to fight over, and knew that an unenforceable system would do just fine. They threw in the token line that the police would enforce it (it seems even the police weren't consulted about this), but they don't need the police: there is a whole masked Mafia, willing to do the job unpaid.

Personally I am more hacked off with people who don't SD when they have a mask on. I am fed up with masked people standing right next to me in shops, leaning over in front of me to grab something rather than either saying excuse me so I can move out of the way or waiting, or pushing my young DC out of the way. So much rudeness now. Much better when no masks and proper adherence to SD IMHO. Now too many people think masks provide sufficient protection. Rant over

I live in NE London & it's the same. No one under 30 in a mask even on the trains. No one at all in a mask in the mahoosive corner shop which has extended & added a butchers meat counter & patisserie counter so it's customer numbers have quadrupled.

I’m not sure that everyone not wearing one is exempt, but about 95% are in our Sainsbury’s so really high anyway.

@wanderings

Yippee, another mask thread! (Pulls up chair)

It's obvious the government doesn't care about this issue very much, unlike the citizens of Mumsnetland, given how many vitriolic threads there about masks. Notice that they did not tell us why they suddenly made masks compulsory in shops, having previously dismissed masks as no good. The government knew it would give them favourable headlines, it would make them appear to be doing something, at no cost to themselves, and the fact that they didn't bother to implement a costly system of exemptions, but instead went for a haphazard and unenforceable system says it all about how much they really value the masks. Perhaps some members of the public have sensed this.

The public have proved that they're willing to act as enforcers for the government (Easter eggs, toilet roll, the fictional 1-hour rule for exercise, etc.); the government knew this, so they threw in the masks, like throwing a bone to the public for the two sides to fight over, and knew that an unenforceable system would do just fine. They threw in the token line that the police would enforce it (it seems even the police weren't consulted about this), but they don't need the police: there is a whole masked Mafia, willing to do the job unpaid.

This. There is zero proof that the masks work! Absolutely no decline.

@wanderings

Yippee, another mask thread! (Pulls up chair)

It's obvious the government doesn't care about this issue very much, unlike the citizens of Mumsnetland, given how many vitriolic threads there about masks. Notice that they did not tell us why they suddenly made masks compulsory in shops, having previously dismissed masks as no good. The government knew it would give them favourable headlines, it would make them appear to be doing something, at no cost to themselves, and the fact that they didn't bother to implement a costly system of exemptions, but instead went for a haphazard and unenforceable system says it all about how much they really value the masks. Perhaps some members of the public have sensed this.

The public have proved that they're willing to act as enforcers for the government (Easter eggs, toilet roll, the fictional 1-hour rule for exercise, etc.); the government knew this, so they threw in the masks, like throwing a bone to the public for the two sides to fight over, and knew that an unenforceable system would do just fine. They threw in the token line that the police would enforce it (it seems even the police weren't consulted about this), but they don't need the police: there is a whole masked Mafia, willing to do the job unpaid.

And many other governments around the world are involved in this hoodwinking are they? If it was only in the UK I could understand your suspicion but I really doubt that all government's are in cahoots to trick their people.

No one can have any idea of individual people who are exempt but when you see friendship groups of several people without masks in shops it's difficult to imagine every one of them has an exemption.

However my question is, was everyone I came across REALLY in this category? Is Britain a country with thousands of people with breathing difficulties and unresolved traumas, when continental Europe, Asia etc have much higher rates of mask compliance?

100% agree. The trouble is, all you have to do to be exempt is say you're exempt. I imagine that if exemption was based on a doctor's note there would be far fewer exemptions. Yes, there are genuine reasons for not being able to wear a mask, but I think there are also a high number of people who, for whatever reason, just don't want to.

@ilovesooty

"No one can have any idea of individual people who are exempt but when you see friendship groups of several people without masks in shops it's difficult to imagine every one of them has an exemption."

Totally agree.

And many other governments around the world are involved in this hoodwinking are they? If it was only in the UK I could understand your suspicion but I really doubt that all government's are in cahoots to trick their people

It’s not hoodwinking - they entirely missed the boat. The gov said there would be a 40% decrease. Where is it?

One was a lady who glared at anyone who even dared look at her.

I can't wear one and have used "the glare" when I've been glared at, so it's possible she was waiting for someone to start on her.

if you can't wear one, It's not particularly comfortable experience going in a shop, because you know you'll get hard looks. If I return the favour and they say nothing, it's a bonus, as I really can't be doing with telling someone to fuck off and mind their own business, which I'll do if I have to.