To think masks are just being treated as completely optional?!

[JuniperFather]

I went shopping today in Sainsburys and Asda, needed to get some items for DD that would have taken too long to arrive if online. For reference I live in the South East (M25/A3).

I wore a mask, as I have done since the rules have changed. Yes it was uncomfortable in the heat, but it was done to respect and protect others. If I have the privilege of being able to use a public space and shop, then it's hardly a privation to protect others as per the Government guidance.

Yet today, on my two visits, I reckon I saw maybe 30 or 40 people wandering around without masks. Probably more than that.

Quite a few were young men, late teens early 20s, completely oblivious. One was a lady who glared at anyone who even dared look at her. A few were local workmen. Another lady in her 50s, a few who were a bit younger.

I would go as far to say that maybe half of the shop were wearing masks, and half weren't.

My AIBU question is, do you think people are now just now viewing masks as completely optional when in such spaces, rather than an enforceable requirement as per the Government's steer?

YABU: No they're not being viewed as optional. All these people probably have hidden disabilities.

YANBU: You're right. People are just doing what they want.

I start this thread in the fear however that I will get a slew of responses from people saying

• I suffered trauma which means I can't cover my face
• I have breathing difficulties

etc..

This post is not for you - the Government make it clear in the 7 August face coverings briefing that you are exempt.

However my question is, was everyone I came across REALLY in this category? Is Britain a country with thousands of people with breathing difficulties and unresolved traumas, when continental Europe, Asia etc have much higher rates of mask compliance?

Or as per my question, my real suspicion is that the dozens of people I saw, just can't be arsed with a mask and won't ever be told what to do. They know those two shops won't challenge them, and the likelihood of the police being called or getting fined is low. So they just do what they want.

AIBU to think it's all just being treated as completely optional, and those of us bearing discomfort and wearing masks to protect others are just sheep?

Chloemol you mean like in France.

@AlcoholicHippo

You are completely missing the point of a hidden disability. This is exactly what people who have hidden disabilities have been saying for YEARS. You ever so kindly finished your post by passing down your approval to the people who really have a HD, and aren't faking it like the bastards you saw in the local shop.

How did you occupy your time before mask policing became so popular? Maybe revisit that.

I'm not missing the point of a hidden disability. I understand and respect those who have this.

So every one of those 7 lads that were grouped together buying cold drinks today in Sainsburys...every one of them had a hidden disability and a valid exemption?

I don't police people wearing masks or I wouldn't be on this thread, I"d be so busy.

but for goodness sakes, can we ever have a discussion in this country without someone bringing up the disability exemptions like a fire blanket thrown over a chip pan fire?

It's plain to me that those who don't wear a mask for personal choice, fully well know that all they need to do is cry "hidden disability!" and the conversation is over.

Those seven lads I saw today didn't want to wear a mask. Some of the other people I saw today just didn't want to.

Why can't people confidently stand by those choices? We'll never get anywhere with controlling the virus in this country if people are so odd about explaining why they just don't want to wear one.

Did any of those people you saw today tell you they were exempt?

Where I live most people are complying. I go to sainsburys, Tesco and M&S to do my shopping weekly and I've only seen 1 in Tesco without a mask, and around 5 in sainsbury's on a busy Saturday afternoon. Numbers hardly worth mentioning. Vast majority are complying

Ah so they need to tell you that they are exempt. Otherwise it's all frothing and PC gorn mad.

I'm out.

You've got a thread full of mask loving disablist posts so crack on the lot of ya.

Do you want everyone who doesnt wear a mask, have a sign on them saying why they dont.

@NotEverythingIsBlackandWhite

100% compliance now in both M&S stores nearest me. About 40% compliance in Asda. About 90% compliance in Sainsbury's.

I think it just depends on the area. Most of those in Asda in a poorer area a few miles away were BAME so I don't know if it's a cultural thing as it was right across age groups. Not going there again. Will stick to M&S.

Poorer people are more likely to have health conditions and therefore be exempt, so you are basically saying you won't go near the dirty plebs.

@AlcoholicHippo

Ah so they need to tell you that they are exempt. Otherwise it's all frothing and PC gorn mad.

I'm out.

You've got a thread full of mask loving disablist posts so crack on the lot of ya.

No they don't all need to tell me they're exempt...

I'm looking however at statistics. How does Majorca (mentioned earlier), Singapore, New Zealand, have such high rates of mask adoption when they also have populations with varying needs?

but like I said before ,we can't have any kind of conversation around mask adoption now on here. I get that.

I'm between both of your options and I think a lot of the people you've seen without a mask are too. Yes I'm wearing a mask. Not because I think it makes the tiniest bit of difference, but because it's being enforced by the state with a £100 fine as a penalty. So I'm wearing one, under duress. However the second I get a chance not to reasonably wear one (have half a bus to myself, 10 minute queues at checkout in a shop that can't be bothered to get air conditioning in a heatwave, bought my purchases so can't be chucked out because I'm going out) - off it comes. I'm wearing a mask because I'm being forced to (in prolonged 40 degree heat - I'm in London) not because I have any choice and yes my behaviour will reflect that.

Ne Scotland here, compliance seems high according to dh. Certainly I don't feel comfortable going anywhere they are mandatory despite having an exemption (and a letter from my psychiatrist).

The problem is that people can self identify as not needing a mask. My experience is that men under 30 ish aren't wearing masks as a group and bigger groups of young women aren't (individuals tend to though) lots of people in their 60's refusing to as well, they can't all have copd, severe asthma, ptsd from being raped etc! Whole families (with teens) without masks on trains, when confronted they just cite asthma.

Basically it's optional, no enforcement and for what it is worth I think they are false security and people aren't distancing as much wearing them (hand when you sneeze though I admit, I have hay fever)

And you can't possibly tell percentage compliance, because everyone could be complying with the law (face covering or not) and you wouldn't know.

What you mean is, 40% of people were wearing face coverings. But 100% of them could have been complying with the law.

@minnieok

The problem is that people can self identify as not needing a mask. My experience is that men under 30 ish aren't wearing masks as a group and bigger groups of young women aren't (individuals tend to though) lots of people in their 60's refusing to as well, they can't all have copd, severe asthma, ptsd from being raped etc! Whole families (with teens) without masks on trains, when confronted they just cite asthma.

Basically it's optional, no enforcement and for what it is worth I think they are false security and people aren't distancing as much wearing them (hand when you sneeze though I admit, I have hay fever)

This is spot on, I agree I think this is the reality.

One great thing about masks though is I no longer have to take my motorcycle helmet off to shop, they didn't bat an eyelid in Tesco express where before there was a remove your helmet rule!

Where I am in the SE everyone is wearing masks. I've barely seen the odd person without.

I've also seen a lot of late teens/early 20s men and women not bothering.
When I went into town the other day, of those wearing masks (which was the majority), approx a third of them only had them over their mouth and tucked under their nose
Why bother if that's what you're going to do? You have all the discomfort/heat of wearing a mask and it's not really having any benefit.

Nearly everyone I’ve seen whilst shopping has worn a mask. Everyone in John Lewis and everyone in a garden centre too.

The things that bother me are the young people going around in groups, riding bikes in groups, congregating in town centres and pubs in the evening in groups and not respecting any of the guidelines at all. Because they’re young and therefore will be fine. It makes me very angry.

[quote myhumps123]@JuniperFather I know it's a pandemic but my God calm yourself down. This government has pulled us from pillar to post, contradicted itself too many times, covid 19 advisors didn't stick to the rules so don't expect others too. The sooner you accept that the better for your own mental health. You comply to the guidelines and let others get on with it. It's very difficult to weed out the piss takers as no one knows anyone's life history.
It's funny how you comply to the government mask wearing policy but don't seem to agree with the long list of exemptions that the government outlined. One rule for you and one rule for others. You remind me of the people who would spy in others people baskets or trolleys to see if they have essential items.
I'm more worried about people dying needlessly due to suicide, loneliness, and delayed treatment as NHS has been effectively shut for everything apart from covid.
But you crack on eyeing up non mask wearers.[/quote]
I don't think it's juniper who needs to calm herself

Where I live (south east) the majority of people are wearing masks in the supermarkets.

People keep comparing us with Spain and how people there all wear masks...yet they're seeing a huge spike in cases. It does make me wonder whether they're really effective. However I will continue to wear one as it makes others people feel more comfortable.

Not what I've seen. Really rare to see anyone without one in shops where I am

You don't know that any of the people you saw were pretending to be exempt. Even if some weren't exempt you have no idea if they were pretending to be exempt.

Lots of non-mask ppl where I live in London but tbh although I wear one as I’m a rule follower by nature, I really don’t care what other people are up to! The people that annoy me are the ones trying to police other people’s behaviour.

Just leave it to the actual police to enforce. Oh wait, they won’t. Clearly it’s not that important then.

Re the 'Pleb' comment earlier, about differing rates of compliance in regular supermarkets and 'posh' ones - I thought the same at first, that people with health conditions are more likely to be on a more restrictive budget etc, but then I remembered that I've abandoned Tesco in favour of Waitrose long before masks came in because the social distancing in Tesco was almost non existent, but people were far more careful in Waitrose.

I'm blatantly going to get shot down here, but one of the problems IMO is that some people are looking to find an exemption, rather than looking to find a way to comply. For example, if you have asthma you are exempt from wearing a mask, but if it doesn't cause you difficulty, and you can manage it, you should, rather than feeling like the box is ticked so you don't need to.

In reality, the amount of discomfort a person is willing to put themselves through to wear a mask before we say 'no' varies (whether or not they are technically covered under the exemptions), but in a lot of the world that discomfort bar seems to be set far higher. And a law that cannot be enforced isn't exactly an effective mechanism for control...

Where the hell is this place where no-one seems to wear a mask? I'd like to move there please. Everywhere I go, 99% plus of people are wearing them. I'm getting really tired of randoms talking about supposed non-compliance. Build a time machine, get your knitting and go back 230 years and sit by a guillotine.

I live in a similar area to you and this is not my experience I haven’t seen anyone not wearing a mask when shopping.