To think places of Worship should be closed before pubs.

[StatisticalSense]

If it is found that more restrictions are going to be needed to keep the virus under control people immediately jump to pubs and other hospitality venues which are essential to keeping the economy functioning, employ literally millions of people (and support the jobs of millions more), and are beneficial to the mental health of many of their clientele. Places of worship however provide no economic benefit, and are just as much of a vector of spread as people socialise with many others who they wouldn't otherwise see. This means that it would clearly make sense from an economic and societal stand point to close places of worships if this would allow pubs to stay open.

@PopsicleHustler

Places of worship should be open more than bloody useless pubs They are more beneficial ie the mosques I know, provide charity, a place to rest and even sleep, lessons and classes for beginners of islam, food, islamic books for free. Even donations for the poor and homeless are kept there as one if the pillars of Islam is to do charity. Same with churches, albeit I am an ex Christian and reverted Muslim but churches provide help and support to my Christian family. What do the pubs provide in terms of help and support and getting closer to God etc. Absolutely nothing. They're in there not adhering to the rules, getting bladdered and falling over and hurling in the street, puking everywhere after having a gross kebab. I'm not saying everybody that goes to the pub does that, this is just an example of what I have witnessed on several occasions. No one is wearing face masks. People hugging and dancing. Women falling with their dresses rolled up exposing themselves and I feel so sad for them but they got themselves in that bloody mess. Covid19 will rise because of this.

Mosques should open and it's a place of peace and worship. Bring your own prayer mat and dont be hugging your brothers and sisters in islam , just come to pray to god and go your way home safely and happily. That's what it's all about.

What do the pubs provide in terms of help and support and getting closer to God etc. Absolutely nothing.

What a load of offensive tosh. Not everything is about "getting closer to God". Also, pubs provide companionship, sociability, community to a lot of people. For many older and isolated people, the pub is the place that keeps them sane and happy. Perhaps not the kind of people you approve of but there are plenty of people to whom going to the pub to see friends and relatives is just as important as going to a religious service.

Much easier to social distance In a church. The Catholic Church in particular has really strict infection control procedures in place. And no one gets drunk and forgets all
About social distancing either!

This is hilarious. The posters avoiding all the obvious benefits of places of worship so they can say they're as good as pubs. The fact is that places of worship serve a purpose other than economic.
Yy your local may make you feel happy or part of a community but they will shut up when they're not profitable. Confusing capitalism and individualism with community is partly why the infection rates are rising again.

@mummaries I dont look down on people who go to pubs. I just think theres a better way thank throwing booze down your neck. That's just my way. You're entitled to your opinion as I am with mine. Wasnt offending anybody. Nor was I saying everyone who goes to bars go to get wasted off their heads. But all am saying is places if worship are more important. And whether it's a mosque or church or temple, everyone should be able to go and pray to the one true lord who created us.

www.eauk.org/current-affairs/media/press-releases/voluntary-work-from-scottish-faith-groups-produces-almost-100m-of-economic-impact-each-year.cfm

Places of worship local to us provide food banks, meals for those who need them, social support, free counselling services.

@SoupDragon

Church may offer absolutely nothing to you and your son, but you can't say that it's the same for everyone. Most churches work their absolute backside off for their local communities and have done a lot of good. To be honest, I used to think churches didn't have anything to offer until I walked into one with an open mind.

I agree with other posters though. You can't put pubs on the same pedestal as churches in terms of improving mental health.

Closing them probably wouldn't do enough good to be worth it, but I agree in principle.

Of course you'd expect them to be too embarrassed to be open. The guy who sells you the "wonderful cure all tonic" usually makes himself scarce when customers get sick.

I mean one prayer by one person who truly believes (according to the bible) and covid would be gone. So either there are no true believers in the whole world or.....

Regarding mental health services, my county council has contracted out many of them to the Diocese.

On a purely economical scale, YANBU however, I think it's naive to think there is a higher chance of infection in a church than a pub. Have you seen the state of some of the pubs recently?

Yabu. Churches and places of worship are either not opening if not Covid secure or opening with severe restrictions in place.
I went out for a meal in a chain pub the other day and no way was our table 2 metres from the next. Not even a metre. We were also seated next to the self serve drink machine and people were wondering around trying to get refills despite being told not to. This was in the afternoon. I dread to think what it was like in the evening . No evidence of mask wearing by staff either. Won't be back in a hurry.
People who don't attend places of worship are not going to suddenly go to get out of the house. This is completely ridiculous.
Plus I think if pubs shuts places of worship will too.

as pp have said its a knock against Muslims & Mosques & Eid
The Mosques & Churches supply comfort in time of distress & for people who need support - they have tried to conform to health & safety
Individuals from ALL sections of society are not conforming to H & S regarding corona - some because they don't believe in it, some because "it won't effect me" ie selfish, some because they have given up or believe its over. These (& other) attitudes cross ALL section of society, they are not specific to any one group.
Please stop doing the blame game. Its been really hard for everybody & sometimes people have broken some smaller rules by meeting family or close friends because it has been so hard. What we need is consistent understandable & clear advice & Cummins to be prosecuted. he & our pm have a lot to answer for.

And whether it's a mosque or church or temple, everyone should be able to go and pray to the one true lord who created us

You realise that there are other religions that the Abrahamic ones, right?

And you don't come across like you're not looking down on anyone.

@LastTrainEast

That's not actually how it works, nor is it what the bible says. God gave us choice and free will. And we wouldn't have choice and free will if nothing bad ever happened or if our prayers were answered the second we asked. Neither would we grow as people. We'd have the mentality of spoilt three year olds. God never promised that life would be easy but he has promised to get us through it.

Our church hasn't reopened yet. Not for full Sunday service although you can book a private prayer session in the vicarage.
I don't think any churches really are fully open as yet.
If you mean "why did mosques open for Eid" then I agree. Totally unfair.

@ladyofthemanners
My local church is open but you have to book a slot to go in.
I think it's up to each individual church if they want to open fully yet.
Nothing about being unfair.

I'm with you, makes perfect sense.

I think you'll find that very few places of worship are actually open. The government guidelines are making it virtually impossible to re-open safely for adults, let alone for children.

[quote Cheeseybites]@ladyofthemanners
My local church is open but you have to book a slot to go in.
I think it's up to each individual church if they want to open fully yet.
Nothing about being unfair. [/quote]
But why are they treated differently? It's almost like the government wants to cause the right wing to kick off over it.

Our church hasn't opened yet. The online services and support have worked well and the building has been used as a food bank. If and when we do open it will be cautious with masks, hand gel and no singing or refreshments etc. I think fairly low risk, and im not sure closing would have enough impact to make a difference.
While it has been nice to have pub gardens open over the summer, if it comes to a choice between pubs and schools in the autumn we probably have to choose the schools. Very sad, as some businesses won't survive another lockdown, though some will continue to operate as takeaways and shops.
There are some hard choices ahead.

I think though, kids are far more likely to catch it from this week. With the "eat out" scheme, meaning McDonald's and the likes of are going to be dirt cheap, and parents are running out of ways to amuse the kids when holidays are pretty much impossible, soft play, cinemas and leisure centres closed, and they've been off since March, that will seem like a cheap option. Of course, you have to eat in to claim the discount, but you can already foresee these places being rammed from tomorrow for at least 3 days a week.
That's far more likely than kids in pubs.

@LadyofTheManners

How are they treated differently? Theres a limit of how many people can go in, many people are turned away.
Dont forget that prayers are different, they pray multiple times a day and yet the local mosque isnt open for all those prayers.
I live near it, I'm used to seeing hundreds of people turn up but now they dont they have limited spaces.
Are you deliberately being ignorant??
The churches could easily do it the same way by having people queue then they would turn away people once they reached the limit.
I also haven't seen a single child going into the mosque, you usually hear them playing and laughing but its now silent.

@doubleshotespresso

OP YABVU

Whet an awful world we live in if pubs are more important than churches ?!?

I'm not overly religious but would never have considered pubs to provide the kind of mental, personal and community support churches do.

Mmm. Anyone can go to a pub. You don’t need to drink alcohol. It’s non judgemental and inclusive . Our local pubs do a stirling job of raising money for charities whilst quietly taking care on a practical level of the old and needy of the village. I don’t think that’s the same of Places of Worship.

Freedom to practice religion is a basic human right, enshrined in international law

Going to the pub isn't

Aside from the OP's apparent issue with one particular religion,
the pressure for pubs to stay open comes from the wish for people to spend money, so it keeps swirling round & round

It seems now that activities are rated on how much they help the economy
Buried deep in my now agnostic brain are memories of school RE lessons about Jesus chasing out the money-changers

"I don’t think that’s the same of Places of Worship"

Places of worship will let anyone in

When pp are totally skint, standard MN advice directs them to local churches, temples, mosques for a free meal,
which pubs don't offer

I'm a churchgoer and believe me, they are so strict with their Covid-19 precautions, nobody is likely to catch it in a church. Numbers attending have also dropped enormously. When we attended last night it was three quarters empty. Anyone saying people will go for something to do are being ridiculous. You're either a churchgoer/attend a Synagogue etc or you're not. Churches actually provide great support.