To think the more ridiculous and inconsistent these rules get the less likely people will follow them

[FruitLikeAPeach]

Further to the tightening in northern England today...

AIBU to think the more ridiculous and illogical the rules get the less people will follow them. It seems utter madness to me that you can visit a pub, there is about to be an incentive next week to get people to 'eat out, help out', you can go out to a shop to browse for clothes etc... but apparently sitting in your mum's garden for a cup of tea 2m apart is too dangerous.

I feel like this is just going to get people fed up to the point they just won't bother with the latest lockdown, not as strictly anyway and I can't even blame them anymore.

YANBU. But that is capitalism for you. Economy and profit before community and mental health. There has to be another way.

I don't understand? You are allowed sit in your mum's garden 2m apart.

I think the difference is that if I go to the supermarket, or even the pub, I’m unlikely to hug anyone, or to stay particularly close to them for long periods, but if I visit my mum, I’ll stay for longer, sit closer, let the kids hug her, etc.

I’m very unimpressed with the government, but I can see the logic in this.

To clarify, my vote isn't whether you would or wouldn't or whether agree that people should or shouldn't follow the rules. More whether you agree other people are likely not to due to the inconsistency.

I don't understand? You are allowed sit in your mum's garden 2m apart

Not in the places where lockdown has been reintroduced in the North (Greater Manchester etc.)... But you can still go to the pub.

I don't agree about the hugging. I'm sure some people will act appropriately but I wouldn't trust drunk people in a pub to effectively social distance.

Yeah I agree with you. I understand that there are competing concerns. But people just won’t stick to rules that are increasingly contradictory or illogical.

Now in greater Manchester (and all its boroughs) you can't visit another household, even outdoors. But you can go to a pub and get pissed or eat in a restaurant

@RandomTree

I don't understand? You are allowed sit in your mum's garden 2m apart.

The new rules for Northern hotpots is that people from separate households can't mix anywhere, indoor or outdoors. It's totally banned, 2 metres apart is irrelevant.

@RandomTree yes in the area of the north west with tightened restrictions people can no longer met in each other’s gardens, even with social distancing. But they can meet in outdoor public spaces with social distancing. And can go to the pub with members of their household.

It’s so crazy and inconsistent and clearly guided by what business will tolerate rather than actual science. I agree restrictions need to be tightened and I’m glad they were brought in quickly. But if people can’t stand 2m away in their mums garden then they shouldn’t be able to go to the pub and be indoors with strangers!

The new rules for Northern hotpots is that people from separate households can't mix anywhere, indoor or outdoors. It's totally banned, 2 metres apart is irrelevant

Except with a load of strangers in a pub... Obviously

Oh I see, sorry.

Totally agree. I have followed the rules to the letter so far, got no interest in going to a pub or the cinema or whatever. Happy to wear a face mask. But to be honest if I was in the north I wouldn’t change any of the plans that I had and would make my own risk based, sensible decisions.

The people running this country at the moment are absolutely and totally useless (to a point that I actually can’t really believe how pathetic they are) and I back myself to make far more sensible decisions than any of them.

I actually just live outside of a Manchester borough, just outside. However, it got me thinking, if I lived just a few miles up the road and was now in another lockdown, it would seriously piss me off that I can no longer have a cuppa with my parents but people can get hammered down the local just fine. To the point I probably would consider if I was going to bother following it at all.

To suggest it's people doing this that are causing a second wave seems utterly ridiculous to me.

It's so frustrating but I do understand the logic. Every social contact we have increased the risk - so limiting it to certain things still reduces transmission even if in principle it doesn't make sense

If attending a restaurant with your own household you are hopefully not sitting within 2m of someone else (although I know there's some question of airborne transmission) whereas mixing households perhaps presents more risk (although admittedly not outside socially distanced!)

I understand that the social contact that is allowed is that which benefits the economy, I don't think that's wrong, because the damage so far already has huge implications and I worry how we will even pay for the NHS etc in the future. There are so many job losses already

It is parts of West Yorkshire too. In Kirklees, our numbers have been declining (from a high number linked to a couple of workplace outbreaks a couple of weeks ago).

I have really been enjoying being allowed to sit in my friends' houses or gardens - mainly gardens as still being cautious. Now I can't even do that.

Like why didn't they step in and actually take some proper action when people were cramming beaches a matter of weeks ago? Just an absolute joke the whole thing.

Yes. I think it was about 3 weeks ago that pubs, shops and hairdressers reopened. Surely that has seething to do with it?! I know that in some European countries the 20-30 age group has seen the largest increase in New cases. Hmm, I wonder why

I wonder, cynically, if they’re purposefully trying to trip people up so the government can put the blame on the public for not following the rules well enough if there are more spikes etc?

Agree completely OP. If they'd shut non essential shops and pubs Leicester style then maybe they would have some credibility, but the fact that you can go and sit in a pub or restaraunt with the same people you'd have sat with in their house/garden but can't do so in their house/garden tells you all you need to know about this incompetent embarrassment for a government.

I would also be doing my own risk assessment if I was in the affected area.

Two weeks ago some dickhead got drunk in a pub down the road from us and at 1am came and vomited immediately outside our gate. Something tells me his behaviour is a bigger risk to our community’s Covid issues than me having a cuppa in my mum’s garden.

@Shamoo

Two weeks ago some dickhead got drunk in a pub down the road from us and at 1am came and vomited immediately outside our gate. Something tells me his behaviour is a bigger risk to our community’s Covid issues than me having a cuppa in my mum’s garden.

Exactly! I'm pregnant so not stepping foot in a pub however, my friend went when they reopened and said once you got to the later hours and everyone had had a few too many, no one was bothering social distancing at all. And I can imagine it, drunk people aren't known for their brilliant decision making skills let's be honest.

I guess the point is if the pubs and restaurants don’t open their will be job losses and more people will lose their livelihood which isn’t good for anyone’s mental health in the long run.

People sitting in each other’s houses doesn’t help the economy quite as much.

If we don’t help the economy now we are all fucked. We only have so much band with for relaxing rules and the stuff that brings the money in comes first.

But yes I understand why people don’t get it and will just ignore. They can’t grasp it is t just all or nothing.

I understand the point about the economy but I'm still not really seeing why you aren't allowed to meet with members of another family socially distanced, outdoors?

The people who don't follow social distancing rules say in their families garden or whatever will be the same people who'll do it regardless of lockdown.

I would much more happily accept that I can visit my parents garden but have to stay 2m apart, or can meet them for an outdoor walk, distanced, than not meeting at all whilst strangers all gather together in a restaurant or pub down the road.

Quite frankly you lost me at Barnard Castle.

We’ve done everything we’ve been asked, in good spirit, often at personal detriment to ourselves, and apart from the absolute pisstake of announcing something like this on twitter with hours to go before implementation you've given me a day to rearrange summer holiday childcare - ironically the day before Boris told us all to go back to work.

On the economy point I think if they actually honestly said it (“we know it’s frustrating, it seems inconsistent and unfair, but we need to look after the economy now so we need to do it like this, sorry”) I would have more respect for it. But they are so unauthentic with it, just saying it’s sensible and the right thing to do when literally anyone with half a brain can see that it makes no sense other than in the context of balancing economy v health v freedom.