AIBU in agreeing with the NASUWT that masks should be worn in schools by over 11s?

[DomDoesWotHeWants]

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/28/unions-call-for-teachers-in-england-to-be-able-to-wear-face-masks

Given that they have to be worn almost everywhere else indoors by over 11s it would be the right thing to do. Adults working in schools have as much right to be protected as bus drivers and shop workers.

So AIBU in agreeing with the NASUWT that masks should be worn in schools by over 11s?

At my son's special all the staff work closely with students and they don't wear masks. The young people need to see their faces ( many are non verbal and at sensory level of development) and they would pull them off. They have tried visors and they get hit and pulled off. Each TA works closely with a limited number of children though.

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion

Actually I am interested to know what it has come to? Considering everything I said to you was just me copying what you said to me. Still not clear what the current situation on MN is though. Can you not explain it?

I think they're referring to the complete demonization of teachers on MN since the pandemic started.

We're lazy, gin-swilling, garden dwelling parasites who haven't done any work at all since March.

We get paid far too much (which is why schools don't have any money), hate all kids and are overly melodramatic when asking for simple safety measures (like extra money for cleaning supplies).

We're also all only one square away on the political compass from Stalin or Putin.

It's our fault that people were gathering on the beaches, that teenagers are gathering in parks and that county lines drug running is thriving.

It's also our fault that everyone's fat and therefore at increased risk of covid.

And of course, we don't have a 'can-do' attitude and don't live in the real world.

We also don't understand the problems working parents face, despite lots of us being exactly that.

And unless we've been zooming our pupils we've failed them utterly and provided zero educational benefit.

We should all be sacked and parents should be given the equivalent of our wages.

We're simultaneously dementors who are disinfecting our shopping and hiding away from the entire world and hypocrites who are at the pub/cinema/beach every spare second (especially during school hours).

I've probably missed a few....

But what about clear visors?
No thanks! Just good old human face to face interaction.
Have always been assiduous about hand washing and hand sanitiser long before this situation -we just need to remind the school population of basic hygiene -none of the other nonsense.

Bea, most people do not think those things of teachers.
However I think the state made a big mistake with lockdown and school closures. I would not have done any of that.

Have always been assiduous about hand washing and hand sanitiser long before this situation -we just need to remind the school population of basic hygiene -none of the other nonsense.
Have you ever BEEN in a school?

Surface transmission is not the only way to catch the virus..

@lifeafter50 what happens if they cough in your face?

I think they're referring to the complete demonization of teachers on MN since the pandemic started.

I am generally always one to stick up for teachers, I'm not demonizing, or teacher bashing. I just don't think making children wear masks all day is a good idea. Unfortunately they are all going back full time now, and in feel really sorry for teachers who have spent weeks preparing for half classes and blended learning. I have also said that if someone wants to wear any sort of face covering, they absolutely should be allowed, but to force people to do it for hours on end is not ok.

Beawillalwaysbetopdog I also haven't seen any of what you describe in real life, or on MN, so perhaps that was a bit melodramatic.

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion you obviously have missed a good few threads then, because teachers have really had it hard on here in the last few months. Many threads have had to be deleted because of it.

I am not a teacher but I am a school governor so I am aware of what schools are going through and the endless unhelpful guidance that has been published, and the concerns of teachers and parents. And I have seen first hand how hard the teachers in my schools I am involved with have been working and how they want to be back in school with their pupils. But I am also very mindful of their wellbeing and safety. I am very grateful for everything they have done and are doing.

But I have to say I am not surprised that there have been some teachers on here who are leaving the profession rather than going back in September.

Beawillalwaysbetopdog I also haven't seen any of what you describe in real life, or on MN, so perhaps that was a bit melodramatic.

I've seen pretty much all of it on MN.

I see Dr Fauci just stated that children over 9 spread Coronavirus as well as adults.

I'm sure Trump will be along to disagree soon.

CBA to read all of the bunfight that's going on.

I work in a secondary school in one of the country's hotspots. A friend at a neighbouring school spent 3 weeks in ITU and is now on permanent oxygen. Another friend/near neighbour died. I dealt with every sick child (and there were tons of them) in the place in November, when there was influenza, Norovirus and tonsillitis hitting them like a ton of bricks. I was fine, albeit a little nauseous by mid December when I'd had to deal with multiple teenagers puking profusely all over the place for weeks, despite the deep cleans that went on every evening to try and contain it.

I worked dealing with the large numbers of sick kids in February and March.

I then became very unwell with difficulty breathing two days before school closure. I'm now waiting for the results of my lung x-ray to see whether I have permanent lung damage, as I'm still wheezing like mad. If there is any, I'm then going to be sent for extensive cardiac tests to see whether this infection has affected my heart.

Does anybody really think that I caught whatever I had (and the consultant thinks, just as NHS 111 and my GP do, that I had a Covid infection) from

people without any symptoms on the almost empty 6.45am bus,
DP, who had no symptoms

• or from the many 11-18 year olds I had to look after when they were ill until their parents got around to picking them up 2-5 hours after I phoned home to say they had a fever?

@MitziK I am sorry you are still feeling ill. This is also one of the issues, most people are fixated on how many/few people die of COVID but not much is said about people who have long term effects of contracting the virus.

What happens if schools/businesses have a large number of staff going on long term sick, not just concern about the actual person being ill but the actual impact on how the organisation will run. Most schools have a small if non existent supply budget and there are a limit of specialist teachers out there anyway.

@MitziK I am so sorry. People don't seem to understand what this virus can do. Of course you caught it from school, but I'm sure someone will say well no you can't because some random report says it doesn't happen. But it does. Did in my school too.
And if plans go ahead it will start to happen again very shortly. And then parents will moan that I'm not doing live lessons (because I'm ill). Or moan school is closed but their child is ok so it should be open. How dare teachers get sick when they want full time school. Im sure they think we can someone control the virus 🦠

MitziK

The long term implications of this virus seems to be being deliberately overlooked.

I had coronavirus in March, just before schools closed. Luckily it wasn't too severe but, four months later, I'm still suffering from breathing difficulties. My father wasn't quite as lucky. He thankfully survived the coronavirus but the effect on his health has been horrific, heart problems, vascular dementia. He is now in nursing care and will,never come home. Two other members of staff had coronavirus, both ok but one parent died. Who knows where it started, who gave it to who but the impact is long lasting and widespread.

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion

Beawillalwaysbetopdog I also haven't seen any of what you describe in real life, or on MN, so perhaps that was a bit melodramatic.

Everything I said has been seen on multiple MN threads since March. It's why I've pretty much given up on reading MN, it's been very demoralising. It's also been plastered all over my facebook feed so I'm pretty much ignoring that too.

In RL I've not seen/heard any of it, but as an introvert I have a small social circle so that's not particularly surprising.

Xenia - Yes I know most don't think that, but it has all been said.

[quote ineedaholidaynow]@MitziK I am sorry you are still feeling ill. This is also one of the issues, most people are fixated on how many/few people die of COVID but not much is said about people who have long term effects of contracting the virus.

What happens if schools/businesses have a large number of staff going on long term sick, not just concern about the actual person being ill but the actual impact on how the organisation will run. Most schools have a small if non existent supply budget and there are a limit of specialist teachers out there anyway.[/quote]
And how many supply teachers will want to go into an unfamiliar school where teachers are sick with Covid-19?

Thanks. It's a bit shit, really, as I thought I'd be better fairly quickly, what with not actually going blue and knowing to lay down with a pillow under my chest to elevate me at night - so on the night that a gallon of fluid suddenly poured down the back of my throat into my lungs for no apparent reason, I was able to clear it quickly by curling over the side of the bed, pulling the pillow into my diaphragm and forcing it back out again (and stay awake for the rest of the night in case it happened again - which it did, twice).

And how many supply teachers will want to go into an unfamiliar school where teachers are sick with Covid-19?

Also, would you trust somebody whose ability to pay their mortgage depends entirely upon travelling around multiple schools to cover for sickness to not be keeping any symptoms to themselves? I know when I was a temp having to keep a roof over my children's heads back in the day, I never, ever called in sick because a) I wouldn't have been paid and b) the agency might not give me another booking because I'd been unreliable. I probably spread around a few coughs, colds and flu infections in that period. But I needed to work. As would those vectors of transmission supply teachers.

I'm just sorry to read of those with long term symptoms. You don't have to of course, but I think it helps that you post as your stories are very important for countering the two big comforting myths - it's only like flu, and if you don't have underlying conditions it's a mild illness.

to you both

Those of you who have been badly affected (and it sounds horrendous), how long do you think it would have been before you would have been able to return to teaching, which is, let’s face it, quite a physical job?

labyrinthloafer
That’s true - I always feel like drama queen when I post about ds’s symptoms but i always hope it helps.

I think I posted on this thread or a similar one, in response to a poster who wrote “(coronavirus) poses no risk to children” that ds caught a bad virus in March - vomiting, coughing, fever and was ill for a month. As in couldn’t walk further than his bed to the sofa. Couldn’t eat more than a mouthful of food at a meal - for a month. Also came out in a chicken pox type rash, had other inflammatory symptoms and is now mostly back to full health, but a couple of hours at the park wipes him out completely and he needs to rest the next day.

I’m sure there are a few on here who would say I was a hypochondriac or it was just flu, but both his gp and a pediatrician at a&e both said “it’s covid” and I know who I trust more.

He’s only 10. You know, that age group that is apparently “at no risk”.

That lovely poster never even came back to say “sorry, that must have been hard for you son/scary for you/seems I was incorrect.”

Denial is not just a river in Mumsnet.

@TaxTheRatFarms

Sorry you and your ds had to go through that, he must have been very scared.

I'll be honest - I'm scared of the people I love catching it.

I wish him a full recovery

noblegiraffe
Ds is thankfully not a teacher, but he wasn’t able to do a full day at school in May/early June. Possibly July, but it would have worn him out.

It makes me worry about kids’ absence from September, as I imagine heads will be sympathetic when/if children are actually ill (fever and cough stage), but not so sympathetic when it’s a month later and your kids still can’t cope with a full day at school.