To ask why my colleague has been off sick for weeks and is on the beach?

[waitandseee]

My colleague has had nearly a month off sick leave, yet on facebook, there are photos of her on the beach, and on days out at cafe's. She is paddling in the sea, looking happy and very healthy. Am I being unreasonable to ask why this being allowed by management?

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• * Edited by MNHQ ** Hi all, and thanks to all those who have replied so far. It looks like the OP has left the site and won't be back to update the thread. We'll let the thread run as it's an interesting discussion. ===========================

I have pictures of myself laughing and smiling that were taken on days where I had plans to end my life. Sometimes people post on social media pretending to be having a great time because its like the saying fake it till you make it. Your colleagues medical history has got nothing to do with you, if you are covering their work and struggling then your employer should be helping you with that but it isn't your colleagues fault. Nobody is immune to illness.

It is her business, as it could be anything but she’s daft posting it all over fb

*Depending on the supermarket she may have had no say in that.

Plus the guidance for people shielding includes going for walks*

I can assure you, the supermarket didn’t tell her to take the time off. It was her decision and she fought along with union assistance to get paid. Her card is marked.

As for the walks, it’s not just that it’s all the trivial posts every day when she has several colleagues on her social media having to cover her getting pissed off.

Fruit: it doesn’t sound like the law is for you. You need to be robust, prepared to work long hours and not be off sick all the time. Other jobs might be better suited to the idiosyncrasies of your health/disposition.

I deal with genuinely sick employees with due consideration and care. They are rare. I’d say 80 per cent of sickness absence is bullshit which me, their colleagues and the businesses I work for are more Than happy to weedle out And replace with people who both want to work and are robust enough to meet the challenges of the job.

Waves: if you’re nerve problem is mild enough to accommodate going out for an ice cream you can come to bloody work! I’ll give you alternative duties if your own tasks are too tricky fir your poor trapped nerve.

Honestly, this is revealing. The attitudes towards work are appalling. People hace paper thin skin and a bad attitude.

Anyone seen the OP since their opening post? No, thought not.

Op is being well supported I think, by like minded people tho are fed up of the rot.

Well, three out of four MN’ers who expressed a preference by voting don’t support them. Though I’m sure there have been some responses that will have cheered them greatly.

I think what all of this thread shows is just how difficult it is to get the right employees for your organisation. In my DH's company there have been mercifully few issues with staff taking time off sick that's not fully justified. They have generous policies for all sorts of things and staff are valued. They are also a major expense. Their people ARE the company. It would ridicuous not to manage this aspect of company spending because it is vital to the company to be profitable and to the employees who value their jobs. The idea that successful companies are successful because they allow huge amounts of sick leave is just not sustainable and no company making losses will employ anyone in the end. Millions of people will be noticing this quite soon - now estimated at 4 million. Only people who are actually worth employing will be retained. Those in employment will be hammered regarding taxation so although grateful for jobs they will feel agrieved when taxes rise.

Making a profit is what companies are set up to do. If employees are not on board with that then obviously a government/state paid role would suit them better.

However, it has been a worrying trait in one of Dh's offices that "taking sickies" has crept in. Only two members of staff but it slowed work up and infuriated the existing staff who needed to get the work out on time and accurate. This type of action by employees must be investigated and challenged because it drags the whole company down.Unfortunately it was discovered that one member of staff had previous form for this in his former company. His work was poor and despite a number attempts at training and coaching, nothing was making the situation better. When ongoing coaching and help was mentioned in his return to work interview, following on from annual review where such asisstance had been put into action, he went sick yet again. He then threatened to take the company to an industrial tribunal for constructive dismissal. He then presumably got legal advice and backed down and the company made his job redundant with no repercussions . The stark truth is, no one wants colleagues like this. He cost a lot regarding coaching, suopervison, training and not completing work on time. Companises simply cannot afford this with numerous employees who do not really want to work and do not respond to support and coaching. The overall feeling was that he wanted a payout for being incompetent thus robbingother people of their profit sharing bonuses. Yes, companies do share profits!

Everyone is sympathetic for a miscarriage. My hairdresser took 6 months off after hers. They were brilliantly understanding. Some issues empolyees have are, I'm afraid, the more minor ups and downs of life. However, not really being interested in your job when everyone else is happy, (productive, very reasonable hours, every chance for promotion and further qualifications, and very well paid) is a problem for employers. It is inevitable that employees who cannot buy into the ethos will have to go.

Posting on facebook is really silly if you are on sick leave. Yes, generous sick leave and full pay for 6 months does change the outlook of some employees. Most see it as a huge benefit and want to work and pull their weight though.

Hi all, and thanks to all those who have replied so far.
It looks like the OP has left the site and won't be back to update the thread.

[edited to add] We'll leave this one up as it looks like an interesting discussion.

Seems HR people are also shirking by being on here a lot of the time

Working part time maybe?

I didnt say me. I said my friend. As in legitimately my friend and not hypothetically my friend when i actually mean me. If it was actually about me, i would have said me. Get off your high horse.

I had 3 months off following a hysterectomy. Towards the end I went to Belfast from London for my fil’s funeral. I also went to Cornwall for a few days

A colleague had several months off last year with cancer. During that period she went to visit her dying father in Turkey.

Unless you know why she’s Hoffa’s, none of your business.

Hoffa’s? Off sick

@Goingprivate2020

Oh are you my ex employer? It's people like you why you couldn't pay me to return to the legal profession. I was assaulted outside my home, spent all night in A&E to discover i had a broken bone, and when i called my manager in the morning all she had to say was a blunt "so are you coming in tomorrow?"

I then had a cervical smear result which i needed treatment for, the stress of that plus the ongoing police investigation meant i was late a few times. On valentines day, the day i was due to give evidence in court, which i had to come in early to make up the time lost, she hands me a letter saying "this is for you". Disciplinary for being late.

She was a callous cold horrible bitch and i would never work anywhere like that again.

I have never once called in sick at my current work and have no plans to unless i genuinely was.

The whole "drag yourself in unless you are dying" nearly killed me when i was younger. Going in the day after losing a pregnancy amongst others. So fuck off with your 'robust' attitude about things you know fuck all about.

It's quite another to post those lovely things all over social media for your colleagues to see and I think it would annoy me too.

Employers need to do more, IMO, to raise awareness and understanding of workplace-related health issues so that colleagues don't judge and make assumptions about each other like this.

Someone I know was signed off work with anxiety and depression. Went on a day out to the beach and put pics on SM. A colleague bitched about it and my friend's manager told him to be careful about what he puts on SM.

Totally the wrong way round IMO; the manager should have been having a word with the colleague about their attitude, and thinking more widely about how the team and the organisation as a whole could educate staff about mental health issues.

Goingprivate2020
Fruit: it doesn’t sound like the law is for you. You need to be robust, prepared to work long hours and not be off sick all the time. Other jobs might be better suited to the idiosyncrasies of your health/disposition.
That is SO breathtakingly patronising and offensive. Fruit still works in law and now has supportive and sensible managers and HR (which, as she points out, is in the longer term better for the company anyway as staff who are motivated and secure are more likely to work harder and do better for the company).

And why do you think you're informed or qualified to say she is NOT 'robust' or 'prepared to work long hours'? IS she 'off sick all the time'? Really?

The 'idiosyncrasies' you talk about are deep depression and suicidal fucking thoughts. How dare you?

Maybe I take a different approach, but I can't fathom how some seem to feel that just because they have had a nice experience, it must be shared on Facebook for all to see and comment/ like.

Some posts here seem to equate the two, and I disagree. Do the thing. Take the pictures. Enjoy yourself. Twenty years ago you wouldn't have posted the photos into your workplace to be stuck up in the noticeboard. It just seems a bit crass when your colleagues may well be finding things harder than usual because you are not there.

I don’t think people who are clinically depressed, who are unable to do the job with reasonable business adjustments, are suitable for the law. Just like someone with a fear of heights shouldn’t work up a telegraph pole and people with an animal allergy shouldn’t be vets. The job simply isn’t suited.

I have been through many of the quoted tragedies including losing babies. I didn’t take loads of time off work. Thinking a about it now, I didn’t take any. Some people might medically Need more time off than I took, for sure, but miscarriage is unbelievably common. If every woman who miscarried took a month or two off businesses couldn’t function.

People forget that business is there to make money, not supplement lazy lifestyles.

I don’t think people who are clinically depressed, who are unable to do the job with reasonable business adjustments, are suitable for the law. And you know this better than Fruit's actual employers in a law environment, do you? That's quite a skill.

'lazy lifestyles.'
'If every woman who miscarried took a month or two off businesses couldn’t function'

The thing is, for me, you won't know what is wrong with a work colleague when they're off sick or needing time off. My MH issues and now physical issues too have impacted on my DH and he's needed special leave at times and dependant leave. (Mostly he uses flexitime but occasionally it hasn't been possible.) We also have 2 adopted DDs (now 11 and 8), and DD1 also has SEN, and has needed a lot of medical appointments, which can't always be during school hours so one of us has to pick DD2 up whilst the other one takes DD1 to her appointment.

The last thing my DH wants to do is broadcast his private business with all his colleagues, as he's always been very private. So at times he has had ribbing about being 'part-time'. But he always makes up the hours and it's completely legitimate. (He's a manager himself so he has to approve leave for team members as well.)

So sometimes the time off might not be connected to the colleague's own health but a family member's. You really don't know what it's about. I really wouldn't want my DH's work colleagues to know that I have PTSD after having been sexually abused as a child. It's made it easier having CFS now and having had long-term COVID symptoms.

@goingprivate2020

I agree with you to a certain extent. Yes, fear of heights, dont work at heights.
Want to spend every waking moment in work & likely die early of a coronary? Bingo! Law, or some of the other corporate professions. I had a manager who literally didnt leave his desk from 8am to 6pm at least, ate nothing all day just lived off sugary coffee. 6pm the usual call from the wife "will you be coming home soon?". Wonder how that marriage pans out long term...

Too many businesses have literally no fallback whatsoever to cover for sickness, and i 100% agree people shouldnt take the piss, but there are legitimate emergencies that can occur & too many companies have zero contingency in place, bar already overworked colleagues taking on even more work that they havent been trained to do because their colleague had an emergency.

People forget that business is there to make money, not supplement lazy lifestyles.

DFOD. Ive worked in companies with a multi million turnover. They arent exactly going to go bust when an overworked colleague is off briefly for a legitimate reason. Didnt know working through lunch was lazy but hey whatever you say!!!

Fruit: it doesn’t sound like the law is for you. You need to be robust, prepared to work long hours and not be off sick all the time. Other jobs might be better suited to the idiosyncrasies of your health/disposition

You know nothing about me other than what I've shared here. I'm very good at my job thank you.

I do believe it's common practice in law firms for staff to pick up the shit from poor management, that shouldn't be encouraged imo.

Do you work in law? Because I can assure you there are plenty of solicitors and staff working in law firms who are brilliant at their jobs but struggle with the stresses over overworking and too high case loads. It's an industry wide problem in my opinion, not just of a few people who aren't 'cut out for it'.

And as I've said, I now work for a brilliant firm who actually care about their staff as human beings, who listen to them and take their thoughts into consideration. They are a successful law firm and they have the most highly motivated and hardworking staff I've come across in my working life along with the best reviews from clients of any firm I have worked for before. I strongly believe it's because they do things properly and don't use the excuse of 'that's just the legal profession' to avoid actually having to manage their company, which imo is a cop out for poor management and terrible employee care.

I don’t think people who are clinically depressed, who are unable to do the job with reasonable business adjustments, are suitable for the law

I also think you'd be very surprised how common it is in law for people to be off with stress/depression/work related MH problems.

Why do you think that way of working is something to be encouraged? I think it's quite scary that you work in HR tbh.

And in actual fact, I've never once taken a day off due to stress because of work, even when I've worked in really horrid firms where it was a regular occurrence for multiple staff to be off with work related stress. Because that doesn't affect me the same way, I am able to deal with that in ways some people can't.

It's only ever been my personal circumstances that have caused me to be off. Nothing to do with not being robust enough to deal with long hours or the stress of a law environment, I've been doing that for bloody years before I ever had time off!