8yo's to be unaccompanied at swimming lessons?

[Xuli]

Our local pool is starting lessons in a week's time but has said all 8+ kids must be dropped at the door to the centre and then collected afterwards. Apparently the changing rooms might be open, might not. The messages online aren't entirely clear. But the jist of it is that 8+ are expected to be unaccompanied, get themselves changed before (not really an issue as they can wear their suit under their clothes) and after, possibly without changing rooms, in a pool that will have 50+ kids for lessons and public swimming at the same time. No mention of any extra staff, only staff around would presumably be actively involved in teaching lessons so couldn't help the kids.

I'm not normally an upright parent but AIBU to think this isn't a good idea? Some 8yos are still very young and won't have done anything like this on their own. Plus everyone's teaching kids about privacy and safety and then expecting them to potentially get changed at the poolside? No one to help if they get stuck or upset, if older kids are being annoying, let alone the safeguarding issues here.

My 8yo is pretty sensible and mature but even I can see issues for her. I don't care not being there for the lesson, but the changing seems hard.

I know I'm not alone amongst other mums here not being keen on this. AIBU, would you be happy with this?

Don't children have school swimming? I'm sure the swim school staff would supervise them. If it is a public session also, you could go in yourself separately.

If you are worried about the changing part, just wrap him in towels , a dressing gown or a set of old clothes, and take him home. You can protect the car seat wirh a plastic cover. I do this after beach swimming. Too difficult to change 3 wet, sandy grandchildren on the beach.

I would be pulling my child out of lessons if this were the case.

My daughter is 7 1/2 and admittedly has ADHD but she could easily get herself in to a dangerous situation or just simply dilly dally for an hour after lessons.

No life guard or staff member has enough eyes to watch all those kids leaving the pool to make sure none of them get back in a pool unsupervised or to make sure all the kids are ok/safe in the change room.

@itsgettingweird

Agree extremely our inter club galas have children as young as 5/6. Some really are that good to start younger squads at the age.

It's surprising how they cope. Just ole they manage to change at school for PE. Or hang their own bag up. Get their own lunch box.

Kids (including my own in this ) have an amazing ability to deskill themselves when a willing parent is around!

Yes to the 6 year olds, we do too. As for deskilling themselves, it's amazing how many children we get in Reception where their parents have said oh they can't do that on their own when they actually can do it really well indeed, it's amazing how being with 20 other children who can all do something means they can all do it, at least with things you'd expect from children that age.

I don't go in with my ds. Haven't since he was 8 because he couldn't use the ladies.

At all our local pools are changing villages with cubicles in one area. So all mixed sex and gender.
Unisex or mixed sex doesn't mean an open room. It means not separate.

Every pool we travel to within an hour for galas are the same. As is every pool I've traveled further afield to for regional or national comps bar 1.

Each pool has a covid liaison. For this reason. Supervision of children. It's 1 person. It limits transmission.

Except there are posters mocking the role and then complaining no adult will be supervising.

People just like to froth.

Children over 8 could and have been swimming independently for years. The pandemic has changed some rules from can to must.

But not actually changed anything that didn't happen before.

And no one has to send their child to swimming lessons.

And yes. A pool can hold 70.

But it's not allowed to hold 70. A standard 6 lane 25m pool can admit max of 30 people under current guidance.

And a good swimming pool has decent cubicles. Ours have doors that go down to an inch from the floor and bars across the top so no one can look over.

@itsgettingweird

I don't go in with my ds. Haven't since he was 8 because he couldn't use the ladies.

At all our local pools are changing villages with cubicles in one area. So all mixed sex and gender.
Unisex or mixed sex doesn't mean an open room. It means not separate.

Every pool we travel to within an hour for galas are the same. As is every pool I've traveled further afield to for regional or national comps bar 1.

Each pool has a covid liaison. For this reason. Supervision of children. It's 1 person. It limits transmission.

Except there are posters mocking the role and then complaining no adult will be supervising.

People just like to froth.

Children over 8 could and have been swimming independently for years. The pandemic has changed some rules from can to must.

But not actually changed anything that didn't happen before.

And no one has to send their child to swimming lessons.

I knew you had a boy because you just can’t show empathy to people with daughters who could be being put in a dangerous situation.

Unisex means there is an open space with communal showers and cubicles. No site I’ve ever worked in had enough cubicles.

Children have been swimming independently for years but they never had to go in a mixed sex changing room unaccompanied if they didn’t want to - ever. The pools have no right saying the parents of these kids cannot watch over them

For your son life will change very little bit for girls who want and need privacy it’s a different matter. Open your mind a bit it’s not all about the boys ..

Not sure why you keep adding gender in either tbh it’s odd make bodies and female bodies are sufficient

Not a chance.

I know my DD will still be in there chatting after half an hour because that's the kind of child she is!

I know kids change on their own for all sorts of clubs, and most can do it (though I think it's very wrong to simply say all 8yos should be able to manage this) and DD does for drama shows, for example. But there's a difference between building up to things and suddenly winging them back somewhere with potentially no adult supervision at all, after so many months of not going there. Let alone so many months of not swimming.

Also, with school swimming, surely there's a teacher keeping a vague eye on who is where? Here we don't know yet who's keeping an eye to make sure a child who's booked in at the front desk makes it to their lesson, or who then books out again at the end - who's looking for them of they get distracted or locked in a toilet cubicle or any of the other baffling things that a young child can manage to do?

There was an issue not that long ago at my local pool where a man was behaving inappropriately towards boys in the men’s changing room - 8 is really really bloody young to be allowing children to be unattended in places where there are men and changing going on.

dont send them then-i dont know what people want theres a pandemic things cant be normal for a while yet

@PineappleUpsideDownCake

Good ones arent for beginners - they have the teacher in with them.

Both my kids were taught to swim from the poolside in classes. Both could swim within 6 weeks without the use of armbands. They were 3.

Solutions:
Kids leave things in the changing rooms.....check before you leave and send the kid back in. Teaches the kid about responsibility.

Kid loses something....they need to replace it out of their own spends. Teaches the child to respect their property.

Kid runs and slips....they get hurt. Teaches the child to take more care.

Kids pissing around....they get told off by staff. They take responsibility for their actions and learn to be more responsible.

Kid can't get changed on their own......get them to learn at home. Teach them yourself how to do it after a bath with a cozzie on. Teaches them independence.

SEN yes need help - different scenario completely and depending on the child, they might manage independently too.

It's the perfect time to let go of the cotton wool and let your child learn to be independent and manage things themselves. We do way too much for kids so much so we are limiting their development.

@GabsAlot

dont send them then-i dont know what people want theres a pandemic things cant be normal for a while yet

What I want is some clear guidance about what is actually happening and a chance to discuss it!

Things are very far from bloody normal here. Doesn't mean I want a club running swimming lessons for 100s of kids a week to just ignore safeguarding completely

@Xuli

I know my DD will still be in there chatting after half an hour because that's the kind of child she is!

I know kids change on their own for all sorts of clubs, and most can do it (though I think it's very wrong to simply say all 8yos should be able to manage this) and DD does for drama shows, for example. But there's a difference between building up to things and suddenly winging them back somewhere with potentially no adult supervision at all, after so many months of not going there. Let alone so many months of not swimming.

Also, with school swimming, surely there's a teacher keeping a vague eye on who is where? Here we don't know yet who's keeping an eye to make sure a child who's booked in at the front desk makes it to their lesson, or who then books out again at the end - who's looking for them of they get distracted or locked in a toilet cubicle or any of the other baffling things that a young child can manage to do?

I'd contact the pool to ask for details if the arrangements, plus a copy of the risk assessment. For the actual lesson, send them in with their swimmers underneath a track suit, when they get out, have a quick rub down, leave swimmers on and throw track suit on poolside. You meet them at the door.

I wouldn't like to be made to throw a toweling poncho on over the top of my wet swimsuit and then spend 15 minutes in the car before getting home where I could towel off properly and change. Why is it acceptable to expect children to do this? Its not like a day at the beach abroad where in the time it takes you to walk from the sea back to your spot on the beach you have pretty much dried off. Its the UK - wind, rain, grey skies, swimming pools and their changing rooms set to arctic temperatures whatever the time of year (or certainly all the ones we seem to end up in!)

Adults are expected to go home like this too...my local pool is saying come in a towelling dressing gown where possible and go home in it and shower at home.

It is the hand we have been dealt, we either manage with it or we don't go. Your choice.

Swimming in council pools is (almost certainly) going to be a very different experience for quite some time. I think Swim England reckoned that fewer than 20% opened on Saturday. There is fairly prescriptive guidance about how the places should operate.

A 6 lane 25m pool is now supposed to be set up with 3 "double width" lanes and the capacity should be capped at 30. I very much doubt that lessons will coincide with public swimming (but maybe some operators have more flexible insurers).

DD trains with a club and they have been told they need to arrive and depart wearing swim costumes and will be allocated a square near poolside to leave their kit (significantly pared down). They are expected to have plenty of water and to have been to the loo (but toilets and first aid are available in emergencies). They are met at a side entrance and will be escorted out through a different entrance. Changing rooms are out of bounds. Parents can not enter the building.

DD will be arriving in nylon sports leggings, a synthetic t shirt, hoodie and UGGs. She'll dry herself with a microfibre towel.

If you are planning to swim with younger children I recommend that you take a few minutes to understand the "new normal" for your pool and brief your DC.

My children are younger than this but I imagine most 8 year olds can manage to get changed no problem. It’s the fact that they are also expected to get themselves through the building to the pool and out again afterwards (normally a parent would be waiting for them outside the changing room, presumably), that no-one is there to help them if they can’t find something or are struggling for any reason (again, usually mum/dad/nanny/whoever would be on hand to sort it out) and that they haven’t had the chance to “practise” this new routine with their parents there first to build up to doing it on their own - they are just flung in at the deep end (pun intended!). At my four year old’s lessons normally parents have to be on the side of the pool in case they need the loo part-way through - not sure how this is going to work for little ones in the brave new world!

@Madcats

Swimming in council pools is (almost certainly) going to be a very different experience for quite some time. I think Swim England reckoned that fewer than 20% opened on Saturday. There is fairly prescriptive guidance about how the places should operate.

A 6 lane 25m pool is now supposed to be set up with 3 "double width" lanes and the capacity should be capped at 30. I very much doubt that lessons will coincide with public swimming (but maybe some operators have more flexible insurers).

DD trains with a club and they have been told they need to arrive and depart wearing swim costumes and will be allocated a square near poolside to leave their kit (significantly pared down). They are expected to have plenty of water and to have been to the loo (but toilets and first aid are available in emergencies). They are met at a side entrance and will be escorted out through a different entrance. Changing rooms are out of bounds. Parents can not enter the building.

DD will be arriving in nylon sports leggings, a synthetic t shirt, hoodie and UGGs. She'll dry herself with a microfibre towel.

If you are planning to swim with younger children I recommend that you take a few minutes to understand the "new normal" for your pool and brief your DC.

See, that all sounds really sensible and very well explained. If they come back and say public swimming is closed then that takes out so much of the risk and it will presumably run like yours.

My 9 year old goes through phases of hating swimming lessons and crying about going then enjoying it once she is in the water. We force her to go because we want her to be able to swim and because we have seen her enjoy herself and improve once she gets over the nerves. I am sure there will be tears about how she doesn't like it and can't do it and the teacher doesn't like her when they restart after she hasn't been for 6 months. She probably just wouldn't get changed and would just sit there in the changing room without me there to persuade her. My 5 year old won't be able to start swimming lessons and reliably get herself ready and be with strangers in deep water (there is a shallow end at that pool) when she hasn't been near a swimming pool since I don't even know when. If I could be there the first time to show her where to go and what to do, she might, but that won't be possible. The going home in swimwear won't work for us either, as it is a long walk (at least half a hour) home, and it will be autumn so cold and rainy. I don't drive, there isn't a bus even if it was appropriate to take wet children dressed in swimsuits and a dressing gown or poncho towel on a bus. Also, more minor point, what am I going to do for 45mins while they swim if no cafes are open and it is cold and raining? They swim at a university pool so nowhere will be open nearby.

I must be a very bad parent. At 8 DD was dropped off at the pool on a saturday afternoon with her friends and I'd come back an hour later to pick them up. They were never ready and I'd have to wait (with a coffee and a book ) for them to come out, fully dressed, with all their belongings. There were never any issues (mixed changing rooms).

I understand that a small minority of children might not be ready for that at this age, but most children will already be getting dressed by themselves, just like after pe at school, and will manage fine.

Children are no more likely to be abused here than in supermarket toilets or MacDonalds..... it shouldn't stop them from having a wee bit independence though.

How is this any different from going out to play?

Yes, dd's club seems to be as described above for other club swimmers. We had lots of emails about how things would work. Some leisure centres made their own video explaining things (facebook was useful for leisure centre information).
I suspect most club swimmers are happy to be back in the pool

Depends on the child surely? At our local pool children could swim alone without parents present at all. So lessons seem ok to me.

I would ask for guidance on whether the pool will be open to the public during lessons.

My DD does swimming classes and now when they are on the pool is closed to the public. The website hasn't been updated so is still showing the old timetable saying the pool is open for label swimming, all they have done is add a bar to the top of the website saying "Timetable changes due to covid restrictions may not be shown, please call to confirm" which is less useful than just having no timetable at all

Even before covid, my DD used to get out of the pool, dry off quickly, put on a dress on summer and onesie in winter and come straight out so we could get the bus home and she could shower properly and then get straight into PJs.

Now the swimming classes have been asked to come in their swimsuits, they are let in 5 minutes before the class through the family changing room entrance, every child is given a space poolside to put their stuff and they have 10 minutes after class to dry off, redress and leave directly through to reception. There is a 5 minute changeover between classes and because each class alternates which side of the pool they put their stuff and use different entrances/exits the children in each class never mix.

The only difference now is that because DD is going to the pool from home and not school she can go with her swimsuit already on. All she has to do is take off her dress/onesie put on her swim cap and goggles and do the opposite in the way out. As some children cant manage caps etc by themselves their parents are asked to put them on their child outside before they come into te building.

For any children who need to use a changing room, eg because of SEN or because they need parental help, the pool alternates the male/female changing areas to each class. Since they are not being used as the pool is closed for general swimming during class times there is no concern about random members of the public being in there and each changing room has enclosed cubicles so no issues of mixed gendered children/parents using the same room. Children from Class A use the cubicles in the Male changing area then Class B use the cubicles in the Female changing room, Class C use the Male area, Class D uses the Female area etcetc so that the staff can go through and wipe down the unused changing area before it is needed again for the next class, and has the added bonus that they also do a sweep of the room for any lost property, which is taken to the front desk so they dont have to worry about people popping in and out because of forgotten items.