12 year old arrested

[Pixxie7]

Do you think the police acted appropriately given that they had a tip off that a boy was waving a gun around.

Nickynacky

I'm happy to answer that once you have addressed my posts on the met.

ShinyFootball No problem, I will answer. I have no idea about the points you raised.

So why were the women clearly not a threat?

In a pp someone said that the father was known by the police because of firearms offences. I notice the father has not commented at all. I appreciate he may not live there but most people would want to support their children.

I'd probably go further and say that I'm not sure I really care either

If they're upset they can sort it out with their brother or their mother

Was there a father mentioned in the news? By the mum or boy? Just asking genuinely because I obviously missed it, if so.

That's nice.

We must maintain one side of an argument/debate/speculation and never see different perspectives to different points. One side, ride or die. Deliberately blind to anything else.

You have no idea about the points I've raised?

Seriously?

You are or were a police officer. Not with the met IIRC.

The double rate of black men dying in interactions with police, the lying after shooting people dead, the corruption, the shutting down of sapphire after multiple really serious failings...

The failure of police to attend a violent incident?

I mean come on.

If you don't know about this stuff Google is your friend.

ShinyFootball I am a police officer, I’ve never worked for the Met though. Ok, so I answered your question but not to your satisfaction so I assume you won’t answer mine.

That’s typical of a small minded person.

A lot of this was headline news. I'm surprised you missed it. All of it. Ian Tomlinson. Jean Charles menezes. Sapphire. John warboys.

I hope you've at least heard of Stephen Lawrence.

This is your area. Saying oh I don't know about that is just not good enough.

Xposts.

This incident was the met.

@Fijibikini
Christ they walked past the window not stood there slack jawed gorping through the window.

The police have not been brought in to disrepute

So somebody walked past a window, didn't stop to examine what was going on, phoned the police and said they glimpsed something as they walked past, the police were still sure they saw what they saw, and on that basis they leapt into action with guns, dogs, etc, and you are asserting that the response to this glimpse in passing doesn't bring the police into disrepute?

@Andthewinnerislucky

That's nice.

We must maintain one side of an argument/debate/speculation and never see different perspectives to different points. One side, ride or die. Deliberately blind to anything else.

Yeah that lovely

I'm not interested in "sides" or maintaining any argument

It's all too DM sad face for me

The boy and his mother sought the attention

He was "playing" with a replica gun, late at night

My sympathy and empathy is solely with the police officers who had to deal with him and his family

ShinyFootball Oh wow, do I have to give comment on all those cases?

That might be a long post in that case.

Tbf @ShinyFootball You're quite naive if you seriously expect that question answered by someone who says they're a police officer.

What do you expect - a confession, if they know about it? Or a "I'll check and let you know but I agree the police is a mess"?

'No idea' is the standard response.

(Personally, I know there are rotten eggs in the police and everywhere but don't think they are to be written off as you say).

I had a window shot in my old flat.

Perfect round hole in the window.

Police not interested.

I've also been on the wrong end of an armed robbery, years ago.

Police were a bit odd about that too.

I asked ShinyFootball a perfectly reasonable question repeatedly and got no answer until she childishly said “I will answer of you answer this first”.

Of course “No idea” is my answer. I’m not going to be blackmailed.

The daughters were 17 and I think 23 so neither really as one is an adult and one nearly

Well in that case they should easily be able to shake off the experience. They probably get woken from sleep and told to put their hands in the air and get out of their house with guns trained on their heads frequently.

If they're unable to bounce back then it's clearly their mother's fault.

Nickynacky yes.

Because. Context.

I am a white middle class woman. I do not trust the my met. I do not trust the police. Does that not bother you?

This is a black family who had a boy out in a police van and sisters with aimed kill shots at their heads.

Not good.

Nickynacky seriously?

You see a woman's posts about the problems with the met as 'blackmail'? Including both widely reported stuff and personal experience.

Well ok. That's the police for you.

I'm not interested in "sides" ...
My sympathy and empathy is solely with the police officers who had to deal with him and his family

Oh but you are. That's the point of my post. If you weren't, you'd be able to see/admit to other things that wouldn't keep you so rooted on one side. You could move from one "I see this point" to another easily without thinking (I assume) it will take your "I'm on the police side" stance away from you.

You'd be able to empathise even a tiny bit from the pov of the family who must have gotten a bit or a lot of shock while maintaining your stance or you would have admitted that you did.

But nothing can swerve you from 'your side', can it? You're quite rooted and planted, not even sparing a thought for a young adult, near-adult and older child (or are you in their age group?) who didn't didn't even have a real gun.

Hate to see how you'd feel if they did. Perhaps leading the lynch mob.

@chrislilleyswig

ShinyFootball
I have 2 girls.
You honestly think having red dots on their heads for kill shot is just, ok whatever?
I wouldn't be in that position

You seem to think you would be safe from having a kill shot trained on your forehead, and I wonder what it is that makes you so certain that it will never happen.

There is in that evasion the unspoken smug certainty that victims of police brutality bring these things on themselves.

You have judged them and found them guilty. Welcome to the 51st state.

mathanxiety@ you taken this completely out of context a pp ask the age and I replied. No they were probably terrified, I would be, but it’s a lot different than If they were young children. I am sure the police would have reacted differently if they had been.

We're all posting on MN.

Let's not forget that mra types got a swat team sent to Justine's house.

How were the police brutal, they responded to a call in the line of duty. I think what ShinyFootball is saying is that she wouldn’t have any reason for the police to come round.

There was reports of a fire arm at the house.

@Fijibikini

There was a report from someone who glimpsed what they thought was a gun while they were walking past, by your own admission. This was not a solid report. But they decided to act anyway and to bring maximum force to bear.

They didn't know there wasn't an 'armed man in the bed'. Equally they didn't know if someone in the house was autistic or deaf or blind or for some reason unpredictable in their actions. But those weapons were trained on the foreheads regardless. Everyone involved that night was lucky nobody was shot and killed.

I have a cousin in the Met and my mother had an uncle in a police force in Australia way back in the 1920s and 30s. I am not in the business of dehumanising the police. I am criticising what they did and the basis for their decision. Their protocols need to be examined thoroughly.

Criticising the police doesn't mean I am applauding the murder of police. It's not an either/or choice. They are not above reproach in all situations. I do not have to accept every single decision made by the police. The implication in your post that people who criticise the police cheer for the murder of any police officer is disgusting.

The police are their own worst enemies sometimes, and the people who refuse to accept that any criticism of police protocols or attitudes might be valid are not helping them. Nobody is above the law.