A little more understanding to those not wearing masks THREAD TWO

[Fuckinellitsme]

Following on from the first thread here

Thank you to all the lovely posters who have shared their experiences on the first thread. It's been incredibly useful in understanding why some people are exempt from wearing a mask on transport, in shops and so on. Particularly in terms of learning about health conditions that aren't widely known, and also the psychological reasons for exemption. Some incredibly brave posters on that thread for whom I am full of admiration.

For those who need them exemption lanyards are available here

Sunflower lanyards can also be picked up for free at several large supermarkets, including Sainsbury's and Asda.

If anyone feels they want/are able to share their reasons for exemption, please do - it may help others to understand why many people can't wear masks, and also (if the last thread is anything to go by) is useful for educating the rest of us on conditions we're not familiar with.

Stay safe all 💐

Thanks @Fuckinellitsme, that's really helpful!

Incidentally I received my 'mask exempt' lanyard this morning - it looks quite official and the print is very large so can be read easily. Hopefully it will stop the judgy looks and comments 🤞

Something I've noticed popping up for sale, the daisy lanyard with an exemption card for around a fiver.

Who will take genuine people serious when they've just seen them for sale on ebay, amazon facebook etc?

It's ridiculous that people are feeling they need one of these because of the mindset of others.

Check your stores locally/use often about their policy. Most of the ones I've been in contact with will not be challenging people. Other's unsure.

General theme is staff aren't required to wear one and if they start challenging for anything other than age related stuff customers will take their custom elsewhere. They have no powers to enforce it and don't want to risk the backlash to their staff. But this is just where I shop.

Comments on my local fb group

"shops have every right to deny service to anyone"

"At some point i will be on the door and refusing entry"

All this angst and judgement over something that doesn't even fucking do anything.
I hate this fucking country and what it's become.

@ACrashInTheNines

All this angst and judgement over something that doesn't even fucking do anything. I hate this fucking country and what it's become.

That's exactly how I feel.

@HeIenaDove

Comments on my local fb group

"shops have every right to deny service to anyone"

"At some point i will be on the door and refusing entry"

Someone really, really needs to look into how all this is so discriminatory towards so many people. Barring people with health/psych issues and disabled people from shops? Demanding we wear badges or tokens displaying our 'otherness'? Being on the receiving end of filthy looks and abuse? Why has this suddenly become ok?

Shops do not have the right to deny service to people on the grounds of disability etc. Which is what this amounts to.

www.hertfordshiremercury.co.uk/news/hertfordshire-news/face-masks-doctors-warning-people-4335855?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar

BamboozledandBefuddled
I reckon we've not moved on intellectually as a nation from those who participated in medieval witch hunts.

I just stupidly thought that modern society was protected from batshittery like this. But no, the batshit are very much still here amongst us (a majority even) wanting to burn the mask-free!

*"Someone really, really needs to look into how all this is so discriminatory towards so many people. Barring people with health/psych issues and disabled people from shops? Demanding we wear badges or tokens displaying our 'otherness'? Being on the receiving end of filthy looks and abuse? Why has this suddenly become ok?

Shops do not have the right to deny service to people on the grounds of disability etc. Which is what this amounts to."*

Agree, this is very worrying. I am genuinely worried enough about this to not want to travel on public transport or go into a shop. Fortunately I don't have to do either of these things at the moment, but that could change. And many exempt people will need to get public transport to work, or to access urgent healthcare, and others will need to go into shops as well.

@ACrashInTheNines That's exactly what it's like! What really worries me is that some idiot challenges a person who isn't wearing a mask, the mob mentality kicks in and things get out of control. It's very hard to avoid making comparisons to certain periods in history.

#BamboozledandBefuddled
Sadly I think it will happen. Just like the angry mob who mistakenly attacked a paediatrican back in the 90s during the paedophile outrage.

We don't change as a species, only the ones who are being demonised change.
Those attacking people not wearing masks will think themselves utterly justified too. They think themselves the morally virtuous protectors of the realm.

Sorry OP, and all others not able to wear a mask. You're in for it. It won't be your fault, just like all the innocent women drowned for being witches.

But, the new demons are those without masks, and you fit the bill.

Here are two posts of mine from last year.

HelenaDove Mon 01-Apr-19 18:32:16
Ive just finished reading Witchfinders A Seventeenth Century English Tragedy.

The "witches" tried and hanged were not all women. Some were men.

One accused was an eight year old boy.

What most of them had in common was that they were poor. Yes poor. A lot of them were widows who needed what was known then as parish money to live. Elizabeth Clarke was an 84 year old one legged widow who was hanged. Many more were elderly. Neighbour turned against neighbour. Many resented their rates and parish money going to help these "wretches"

See any parallels? Because i do.

At the end of the book (although he does allude to it throughout) the author mentions how lack of liberty and welfare and political and economic uncertainty leads to this kind of climate.

We wouldnt get people persecuted for practising witchcraft now (although this still goes on in parts of the developing world) but we still get people persecuted for being poor/disabled etc.
Matthew Hopkins John Stearne and Sir Harbottle Grimston etc are long dead But some of their ideals are still very much alive.

There are parallels and its chilling

Despite the repeal of the Witchcraft Act in 1736, lynchings of English witches continued well into the 20th century, with the last recorded incident in 1945. Nor, in Gaskill's opinion, are we safe from a fresh outbreak. Witch-lynchings are endemic in the developing world (particularly in sub-Saharan Africa) where "poor and fearful people still associate misfortune with ill-will, and take remedial action". And without "peace and prosperity, liberty and welfare" there is, he thinks, every chance that the next generation in the West "might swerve off in an altogether more mystical and malevolent direction

From this article.

www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/3640908/Copulating-with-the-devil.html

Many resented their rates and parish money going to help these "wretches

On another thread yesterday someone was insisting it was all about saving lives.
I pointed out that in Italy they were being handed out free outside pharmacies.

The reply was "You think ppl should get them for free"

The mask slipped!

And yet its about saving lives. If there are objections from mask wearers about ppl on a low income getting them for free how can they then insist its about saving lives!

Wow @HelenaDove
The parallels are pretty chilling, aren't they?

And without "peace and prosperity, liberty and welfare" there is, he thinks, every chance that the next generation in the West "might swerve off in an altogether more mystical and malevolent direction

We've been denied liberty gor months now (and it's still constantly under threat), prosperity and as a result welfare will be significantly lessened due to the econonomic crisis unfolding.
Mask wearers are devout to their cause, despite the government pages detailing the mandates saying that 'the evidence is weak' right next to the details of the fines for not wearing them.

I've also noticed that the masked want to hear the 'excuses' of the non-masked. Surely asking them to talk sprays more saliva than just leaving them be? It really ISN'T about everyone's safety. It's about promoting the new morality.

Of course the elephant in the room that no one wants to mention is..................pubs.

Italy..............hands out free masks outside pharmacies.

Japan................cooled face masks for hot weather.

UK Make your own mask out of an old sock.

China or Japan (forgot which one) handed out 2 free masks to all houses.

Wonder if there will be a u-turn.
Various countries that have masks are seeing their second/third wave.

NS was saying how there have been no fines since masks became forced. Today’s news they are having an increase in numbers.

Maybe the socks are supposed to be dirty ones. The crusty cheesy effect has an added layer for protection 🤣

Do you have a link @canigooutyet

It was Japan - 'Abenomasks'. They were a bit shit apparently.

www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/04/23/national/abenomask-mold-bugs/

Rape survivors shouldn't have to disclose their trauma to strangers.

UK Make your own mask out of an old sock.

To be fair they have updated their guidance a bit. This was the first guidance they put out:

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20200518235040/www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-wear-and-make-a-cloth-face-covering/how-to-wear-and-make-a-cloth-face-covering" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20200518235040/www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-wear-and-make-a-cloth-face-covering/how-to-wear-and-make-a-cloth-face-covering

At some point they ditched the instructions for making one from a single layer of old t shirt.

Still, the public transport regs say:

“face covering” means a covering of any type which covers a person’s nose and mouth;

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/592/regulation/2/made

And the explananatory memorandum says:

12.2 The Department has considered the fact that some people may be deterred from traveling due to them being required to wear a face covering either because they cannot source a suitable face covering or they have protected characteristics (e.g. a disability) which makes it difficult to wear a face covering. The definition of face covering used is broad and includes using a scarf or bandana. As such, the Department considers that it will not be prohibitively costly or difficult for people to obtain a suitable face covering. The Department has also included a range of exemptions to ensure that this policy does not unfairly discriminate against those with protected characteristics.

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/592/memorandum/contents

The message is 'If at all possible can you at least look like you're making an effort?'

They are behaving like a cargo cult - creating visual replicas of other countries' successful strategies without any comprehension of how they work.

We've seen this type of thinking a few times during this pandemic -

Nightingale hospitals
ventilators
raw numbers of tests
the app

It's bullshit isn't it? They've gone from 'masks make it worse and distract from hand washing' to 'probably a good idea but any old shit strapped to your face will do', and then straight to 'mandatory - criminal offence - fines (but any old shit strapped to your face will still do if you are stopped)' - without ever passing go.

We all deserve better than this. We deserve decent, evidence based, public health advice.

@LangClegsInSpace Excellent post.