Masks - GET A GRIP.

[Changednamesorry]

Ok.

So. Lots of whinging about masks at the moment as BoJo finally hauls his arse into gear and says that you have to wear them in the shops and on public transport.

In Catalunya where I live masks are obligatory. Every time you are in public. Including in the street. Inside and out. The exceptions are

Medical conditions (you need a paper justifying this)
When playing sport
Children under the age of 6
If eating or drinking

If you don't comply - 100 euro fine. No arguments.

Most people here were already wearing masks anyway (because we saw the horror at the beginning of the pandemic here and we know what a real lockdown is like - not allowed out at all, children locked inside for nearly 3 months, etc)

People arent whining and complaining nor imagining how they can invent aome excuse to mean that the rules don't apply to them and the overwhelming majority of people are wearing them all the time.

Tourists not so much but they getting fined. Good.

So England. PLEASE. Stop with the selfishness. Literally dozens of countries have mandatory mask wearing and citizens comply because they care about each other and don't spend their time acting entitled and "I'm all right Jack"

There are articles in the European press about this. Literally "English people are selfish - is it any wonder they are so resistant to wear masks". It's embarrassing. As a nation, as a society, it's time to grow up and just put the mask on like everyone else.

English people. You aren't special. You are starting to look like the kid who gets thw whole class detention because they just keep on breaking the rules.

Wear the mask. Please. It's for the safety of everyone.

And if you ABSOLUTELY MUST come to Spain on holiday, even more so.

@Teateaandmoretea

I'm living in Cantabria, where the locals don't seem to have grasped the reason for wearing masks. They stroll around in the open air, wearing masks, then do into bars, approach the counter, take off the masks and stand chatting (loudly) to their mates.

Absolutely. It is ridiculous (I am spanish living in the UK).
I think the lockdown there was so so strict that they see anything they are required to do as normal (like in some areas where you need to wear a maks on the beach, come on!), it is like if common sense doesn’t exist anymore. Masks on a beach but then sitting in a bar terrace in a group without? Makes sense to me, yeah....

So come on, please explain this

Why is an ex-pat, living in Spain only going by sensationalist stories in the press (which are bollocks to sell papers) allowed to come to MN, slag us all off as a country, say when called out it's because she has the new excuse to get you out of all goady behaviour "NHS workers in family/friendship/next doors uncles postmans dog" and we all have to put up with her judgey pants despite the frankly questionable and pointless behaviour of her countries police and their actually not far off our rates covid tallies

BUT

If anyone who lives in the UK moans, some would say understandably, about the injustice of how a certain nation behaved to hide the aforementioned reason we all have our usual freedoms revoked, they are admonished or banned by HQ because certain posters cannot wait to finger point and shout racism

Why is it OK to slag the English en masse, but anyone else mentions a singular government, it's immediately treated with contempt?

Hmmmm

Why is it OK to slag the English en masse?

Because they make it so easy with their ridiculous behaviour? (A vocal minority I'm sure)

@ladyofnomanners

Yes, the OP was referring to English people - because the mandatory mask wearing in shops has just been announced for, um, England.

Anyone with an ounce of sense could understand that she is making a plea to English people who just don't want to wear masks - not cannot, just don't want to - and pointing out that in Spain this just isn't an option unless you want to pay a 100 euro fine every time you go shopping.

If you are one of the people who will happily comply with the mask rule then this thread isn't about you. If you are one of the people who has a legitimate reason for not being able to wear a mask then this thread isn't about you.

Still, I have been told in no uncertain terms by a pp that as I don't live or pay taxes in the UK I have no right to an opinion, although I am pretty sure that MN won't be contacting me to confirm this.

From midnight masks will be obligatory in public regardless of interpersonal distance in my part of Spain tomorrow. So in theory I could be fined if a guardia found me alone on a mountain top miles from civilization without one. This is too much and I'm frustrated about it. There is no logic to it.

In shops etc, fair enough. It's about protecting yourself and other people.

From midnight masks will be obligatory in public regardless of interpersonal distance in my part of Spain tomorrow

Wow. That's a rarity. Someone complaining about having to wear a mask, and I actually agree with them! That is definitely overkill.

@LadyofTheManners

Sigh.

I am not getting my information from the "sensationalist press". I am in Barcelona seeing English tourists flouting local mask laws and putting us at risk.

Regarding the UK my family lives there and as I have said several times I have relatives working in the NHS. My information comes from them saying hardly anyone is wearing masks and how this is concerning. This is further bolstered by many posters on here either outright saying they won't wear a mask, doubting their efficacy despite repeated studies showing the opposite and /or trying to find a loophole to "get them out of it".

I'm not an expat. Expats leave their country of birth for a period of time with the intention of returning to live there one day. I am an immigrant. I have no intention of returning to the UK to live.

However as others have stated g this doesn't remove any interest in UK Covid-19 responses due to my family who live there and also the influx of people coming from there, to here, and bringing their anti mask attitudes with them, defying local laws and putting our community at risk.

On zero occasions have I stated that there should not be exceptions for people with a genuine medical condition making masks impossible. I have said the precise opposite - that they must be protected by the wearing of masks by others.

If you are referring to China with your comment about single government and "hiding information" the opposite is true. China alerted the WHO and locked down quickly masks were worn, hospitals built etc etc. Also people were being racist about China. I'm not being racist about English people, I'm pointing out, as @doyounothavegoogle said, that there is a group of English people who are being puerile about making a small sacrifice to protect their fellow citizens.

If you are not one of those people, then its not directed at you. There is no denying that opposition to masks amongst English people is a running theme on Mumsnet and I have witnessed it first hand here seeing rhe tourists. Arw German tourists resisting mask wearing too? Maybe - I haven't seeb it - but if I was appealing to German people I'd have made the post on a German forum. As it goes - daily in my own neighborhood I see multiple groups of English tourists flouting the rules. I also saw a French family maskless and I explained the rules and they said they didn't know and put their masks on.

And yes. Its an issue that affects me directly. I'm immuno compromised, live in a flat with no garden or outside space with my 2 young sons and my street is narrow to the extent that social distancing of 2m ks only possible if 2 single file lines stuck against each side of the street happens. Its a very narrow pedestrian street.

Unfortunately OP your first post was directed at the whole of England, as you made clear when writing: "English people. You are not special." This has, understandably, irritated and possibly hurt lot of people, even if they may agree with you that we should all wear masks regardless of where we happen to live or to be born, as it is a sweeping generalisation of an entire nation. Instead of shooting people down who have been offended by this and patronisingly sigh at their viewpoint it may be best to simply apologise that you came across in such a manner.

The unnecessarily silliness regarding geography, who lives where and who contribute to their local society or not is infantile and does not reflect most internationally open minded Brits. When discussing Covid protection and mitigation matters we Brits all know Covid is a global pandemic that only discriminate on those that take most relaxed highest risk attitude. You will find that on the whole us Brits living in Britain (and unfortunately as mentioned by others overseas when even on holiday internationally) have to be mandated with fines to protect ourselves and our fellow close proximity public because we don’t tend to recognise dangers or turn a blind eye to them. It is arguably wrong to suggest all Brits need to understand the basics of how this disease entered the UK and rapidly spread because of our British (this won’t happen to me) attitude. NOT all Brits need punishment and a lecture on Covid safety mitigation measures including use of face coverings but many do and some are even looking for excuses to break the rules. Ideally we Brits should have common sense to do all normal civilised standard Covid mitigation behaviour norms without being fined. In addition the UK guidelines are a complete joke as apparently shoppers need face protection but not shop keepers and not those in other key sector indoor settings with many people in close proximity such as schools. I am also amazed why children don’t need face protection as Covid fatalities have included new borns and children too but obviously not many but it has and can happen as nobody knows who is spreading this disease because many have no symptoms and recover without even noticing anything. In the UK we have an incompetent political leadership one of whom nearly died from Covid and they are evidently making things up as you go along and then either u turn or as proven hypocritically break their own rules. Most Brits on the street In the UK apart from Scotland (but only recently because no choice) UK wide shared public transportation and medical facilities are totally unmasked and exposed. This is a conscious personal choice as possibly a bit like the Swedes most Brits rather do their thing but not anti mask wearing for others. Brits don’t mind others being masked but just can’t be bothered to use one themselves. Lots of schools have children making masks but obviously the message or reason is lost on the way home. One possible ideological explanation is possibly Brits are very sensitive as to human rights and any perceived interference with that including ironically following safety rules for their own safety and human rights to be safer! Possibly better to take a life chance and go unmasked unprotected and not social distance (as the case inside many supermarkets anyway). As a slight digression but in terms of other British personal safety issues I see on a constant basis includes cyclists and electric scooter motorists who never stop at red traffic lights even in relatively busy and dangerous traffic and hence along with inner city knife crime (ironically many hooded to avoid facial recognition CCTV) and Covid stats we are global champions in the race to the bottom! However at long last Covid global mitigation normality will soon be “introduced” in England following Scottish lead as after 50k Covid fatalities the government has decided face covering needs to be enforced and punishable for non compliance. This as the world outside England knows being common sense for your own protection and those you care about as hence why the world understands but not most Brits! However as with the soft lockdown we will soon see if general British public takes this seriously. This does not apply to those who are medically exempt as they will be following their own special rules. However maybe they will either be more likely to become infected or indeed unknowingly spread Covid. With the general British public forced to be masked they should be safer. Some of us long term PPE wearers will of course avoid the unmasked and not potentially bring infected and burden the “free“ public healthcare system. My child is always masked and protected as per global pandemic norms as we don’t need to be told! Look at the UK Covid stats and see the difference! As now you may know why the numbers are so high with unfortunate excess fatalities. The numbers don’t lie as even the super cool Swedes are regretting their Covid risk attitude.

Stay safe and don’t wait to be told how to be Covid smart!

@hardtimeuphere

Unfortunately OP your first post was directed at the whole of England, as you made clear when writing: "English people. You are not special." This has, understandably, irritated and possibly hurt lot of people, even if they may agree with you that we should all wear masks regardless of where we happen to live or to be born, as it is a sweeping generalisation of an entire nation. Instead of shooting people down who have been offended by this and patronisingly sigh at their viewpoint it may be best to simply apologise that you came across in such a manner.

100% - this. For me it's not so much the content but the tone. It was unnecessarily aggressive and patronising. No one wins favour with people coming across like that.

@ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia genuine question, do you not give yourself a headache when writing your posts? They give me a headache just looking at them. The last one is a wall of text, and it just looks like gobbledegook.

@ Cadent

Genuine answer - yes.

This is because I just quickly banged it out of my phone while trying to multi task being a busy stay at home and wfh mum!

Frankly did not proof read or cut into shorter more presentable style.

Message is genuine as let's keep wearing a face covering and get out of this mess faster and also show the world post Brexit that we are open minded and friendly!

I genuinely feel bad for all those innocent lost Covid souls so we all need to understand and stop the rot. It could happen to any of us. It's only a face covering as better than being ill or worst!

@DibDibDibduh

I'm English and I haven't heard anyone moaning , or are you just looking for an argument?

MN is full of people moaning about masks, just wear one!

Why is it OK to slag the English en masse?
It's not, it's bigoted behaviour and bigots will be slagging off other entire nations and races/religions unfortunately, they won't just stick with one. Prejudice and stereotyping people is how their brains operate. They are not usually very intelligent people.

FFS read the whole bloody thread! I have said three times, I was referring to RL not the batshit I read on here
Jesus........ and who said I'm not?
I despair sometimes
I'll await your apology

@Plannersareus

You saw a French family OP who didn’t know the rules, and once you chastised them they popped their masks on they just happened to have in their pockets!! So funny .

Yeah, I'm laughing at the French family who had the gear just in case some random told them a rule that they hadn't anticipated was now in place! I wonder what other kit they are carrying around.

I agree with you OP. It is so embarrassing seeing adults (at least they're supposed to be) throw their toys out of the pram over this.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jul/14/boris-johnson-face-coverings-mask-gove-cummings

Johnson has seen the light on 'face coverings'. Just not on toxic mask-ulinity

@TheChiefJo @ThroughThickAndThin01

Well yes. They thought they only had to wear them in the shops and on public transport. They were walking down rhw street and had them on their arms. What's weird about that? In Spain most people have a mask to hand as you are refused entry to the shops/all public transport /anywhere public without one..... But in Catalunya, and the Balearics (and soon Andalucía) it is a requirement even if you are walking around the street.

You are showing your ignorance of how other countries are operating if you are surprised that they had masks available.

@Changednamesorry

Could you advise as to what young children in Spain do with regards to Covid PPE? Mine usually wear (if it's sunny in the UK) sun glasses and a standard clinical face mask or if cloudy mixed UK summer weather just a clinical face mask and maybe a face shield or hat with face shield if we know there may be social distancing issues. We carry alcohol hand sanitiser spray and surgical spirt spray for outer clothing and shoes etc. Always safe than sorry.

I am hoping to plan a lockdown detox in Gibraltar and may return there and visit Marbella and the Golden Mile. It will be nice to go somewhere knowing that Covid is more seriously and systematically tackled. Do most Spanish local authorities decontaminate the streets and public transport with industrial scale surgical spirit deep clean and UV light etc. This is normal for instance in East Asia etc but would never happen in the UK.

Thanks.

@ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia

Sure. My kids (9 and 3) wear masks all the time when out of the flat except when playing sport (and even then of they are playing "one on one" basketball with others.) and we carry hand sanitizer everywhere which we use st intervals as well as when obvious. The streets are cleaned twice a day.

I also carry an alcohol surface spray because my kids play a lot of street basketball and if the ball hits a stray piece of fresh chewing gum on the floor or similar!

Shops all have mandatory hand sanitizer before entering.

Not sure about public transport as we have walked everywhere since this all began.

UV light I am almost sure is not usead on the streets

Although masks are only required from age 6 upwards many people use them on 3 and 4 year olds.... Under 2s no.

Social distancing can be difficult as the streets where I live are narrow but we do our best.

We don't wear eye coverings nor shields and I have only seen one child in a face shield however they are readily available to buy in a shop a bit like Flying Tiger calles "Ale-Hop" and there is one of these on every corner.

@Changednamesorry

Thank you as that offers reassurance. If we are allowed to safely travel soon obviously destination choice will be based on Covid performance and prevention awareness culture! Plus a decent back up medical infrastructure with experience, expertise and capacity.