To not want contact?

[SilverStripeyTabby]

So NC for this one and bear with me cos this sounds like the plot of a crap novel....

My mum has three children from a previous marriage - he was a highly respected professional man but massive issues with DV, raped her within their marriage, many, many dreadful things happened to her. She met my dad and they fell in love.
His parents (he was still living at home) loved her, but didn't want and didn't have the room for, three children who weren't their grandchildren in their little rented terrace with outside toiler. This being the suburban 1960s, what the neighbours thought was very much a thing. When the divorce came through mum and ex were offered 50/50 custody and mum considered it best and least disruptive for her children to leave them with their father in the family home full time.

So fast forward 60 years, and her first family would like to be be in contact with her. Mum is in her 80s, frail, early stages of dementia, and in sheltered accomodation, and she doesn't think she could cope with the emotional upheaval that it would cause her to resume contact - not to mention the possible disappointment for all parties after so long.

Seems they also want to have contact with me. Obviously we have the same mother but other than that we were brought up in different worlds, different backgrounds, different lifestyles. I'm not curious about them: I've grown up knowing about them but I don't feel that I'm missing a piece of my life. From what I hear of them we have nothing in common more than a shared biology. (That sounds snobby but that's not what I mean - let's say from what mum has been told they would not approve of my lifestyle.)

AIBU to want to leave sleeping dogs lie and to decline contact?

I know the world was a different place 60 years ago, but there were women fleeing abusive relationships who got help. My aunt left her abusive husband In the early 60’s and took her three children with her. But she basically left the house with the clothes she was wearing and that was it. She went to a woman’s refuge and rebuilt her life, I know there isn’t a refuge on every street corner, but what I am trying to say is that it did happen.

A number of posts read like people think they're addressing your mother as much as you. Wrongly trying to attribute responsibility and duty to you because of her decisions. I'd worry at least one of the siblings is likely to have this same attitude, especially as there's not going to be any closure from your mother.

I just have to say that I can't think of one single possible reason that is good enough to my mind to excuse your mother abandoning her 3 children. I'm very sorry for what happened to her but nothing excuses that.

However, when it comes to you, this isn't your responsibility. If you don't want to meet them that is up to you.

I have to agree with Curly. All those posters who are defending the mother's actions, can you please give me one reason that you think justifies her leaving her 3 children with a known abusive man? Just one?

When were you born after the marriage ended? Did your parents move to a house of their own or did they forever live with your grandparents? I just cannot like pp imagine in your entire childhood there was never any space for your half siblings to even visit.

I think the levity in your most recent post, with all the smiling emojis etc, is very inappropriate. I feel desperately sorry for these three children who were abandoned.

A couple of random quotes in random PPs:

Either your mother has lied to you about being in a violent relationship to justify the fact that she walked out on three Young children, or she left three young children with a violent man.

Or perhaps another scenario exists to which OP and certainly strangers online are not privy, but just maybe, after a gargantuan interim of six decades, the OP has decided she would rather accept her own relationship with her own mother on its own merits. Enough harm has already been done in the past. Why should OP now have her lifetime’s relationship with her mum coloured by a 60-year-old mistake which has nothing whatsoever to do with her? Share it out evenly, that kind of thing? It would just be cruel, and of no discernible benefit to anyone.

No one’s suggesting leaving 3 children isn’t unconscionable, albeit we don’t know the circumstances, Doubtless no one on this thread, safe in our own historical context, could consider doing such a thing.
This woman made a life-altering decision which had serious ramifications. Sixty. Bloody. Years. ago. She also now has dementia. Whatever stage this disease is at, this means she’s non compos mentis. The ‘truth’, however subjective it might be, is not going to be forthcoming. Better to make amends with that uncomfortable fact right now, rather than continue to live with false hope.

And finally:

Because we are nice people the majority of us think it would be a kind thing to do, but that doesn't mean she owes them anything.

The old protestation, that’s almost overwhelmingly applied to women only: ‘be nice’. ‘Be kind’. To whom? And does this maxim still apply if being kind comes at the cost of our own peace of mind? You bet it does – if you’re female. Likewise, this thread is unfortunately ample proof that if a woman says ‘no’, people (and that includes other women) hear something entirely different.

These siblings likely don’t to have anything to say that the OP cares to hear. That is absolutely fine. These people have made it to mature adulthood without each other up until this point. OP is absolutely at liberty to decline to see them on that basis. In her shoes, I’d likely respond the same way. And if that makes me not ‘nice’ or ‘unkind’ by someone else’s reckoning of desirable female attributes, well. Too bad.

OP, hope you're okay and have derived at least some help from this not particularly helpful thread.

It's very sad and I can't imagine what they must think/feel having had their mum walk out on them regardless of what she went through. She didn't even keep in contact or visit them. If there was no room for them where she was going it didn't mean she wld never see them again. I don't know how any mother could do that. It's hard for you to see anything but the mum you know and grew up with and as such you are making excuses for her. I wld too in your shoes.

I would want to meet them for sure. I would feel obliged to at least meet and see what it is they want. Your mum doesn't want to meet them as she knows what she did was wrong and she will feel such terrible guilt and can't face it.

This is a tough one. I'm so glad your mum got away from that abusive arsehole and found happiness with your dad.

But the fact that there is no mention in your post about the lives your half-siblings must have had with an man who was abusive seems quite callous. Aren't you even curious enough to find out about their lives so you can assure your mum they (hopefully) had good lives?

he was a highly respected professional man but massive issues with DV, raped her within their marriage, many, many dreadful things happened to her. She met my dad and they fell in love.

Your choice of words seems a bit strange, although I may be overreacting. HE didn't have 'issues with DV' - HE was the violent abuser. And the things didn't 'happen' to her, HE did them to her. And it's likely he abused his children in other (perhaps more subtle) ways. Your language suggests to me you're shying away from confronting that.

However, HE was the cause of all this, not your mum or you (of course).

Oh stop with the smileys, it's just horrible.

I can appreciate that your mum may have felt that it really was her only option to leave them. You hint at there being much more to the story and it's easy to see that there would be if her first husband was so abusive.

But can you really not see why they would want some form of closure before she dies, and feel sympathy for them? Jesus. I'm glad your mum got out but when she escaped her life sentence she passed it on to them. They've lived their lives with the torture of not knowing what their mum thought of them, how she felt, why she never got in touch. And who knows what they then went through, left with a man who sounds as if he wouldn't exactly have been an amazing parent.

She has every right not to meet them, as do you - but if I were in your position I don't think I could ignore them - I think that if it were in my power to even meet them the once and let them ask the questions they want to, even if I didn't have the answers - I couldn't just say no and blank them. And who gives a fuck about your 'lifestyle'? - one meeting, hear what they have to say - nothing to do with any lifestyle of yours because (as is absolutely your right) you wouldn't then intend to carry on being in touch?

Honestly? I think you are afraid to hear what they have to say. One thing that stands out to me is that your justification - that it's better they don't know 'the truth' - then just spins off into a story about some unrelated person. I think you are afraid to hear from them and what they went through. It's such a huge thing to abandon your children, especially leaving them with an abuser. Most mothers couldn't. The fact that she did will have affected you hugely too. We don't want to think about our mothers being capable of walking away. Yours did: your insistence in your first post that they mean nothing, they're not relevant to your life - they are, that's absolutely plain.

I'd meet them for yourself too, but mainly for them.

@FizzyGreenWater do you mean OP's grin emoji? It struck a weird note for me too.

Her children deserve an explanation. They’ve been treated cruelly. Whatever the motivation/reason/rationale/situation, the impact on the children is the same.

OP have some empathy, engage with these people and do the right thing in building a bridge between them.

If you’re happy to play gatekeeper between them and their Mother, you should be equally as happy to play facilitator.

@Cadent - yes. Horrible, but also I think speaks a thousand words about how hard OP is trying to be offhand about something that is absolutely huge for her.

I agree that the OP's use of emojis and lack of compassion for these kids is very callous. Says a lot about her and I'm sure the apple doesn't fall far from the tree....

OP is very obviously not coming back to this thread. Which is hardly any wonder, considering the nit-picky, personal comments being thrown her way. Such as this ... OP's grin emoji? It struck a weird note for me too.

Really, how petty. And then you accuse her of having no empathy? Some people on this thread should take a good look at yourselves. Hope you're proud.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks a bit strange to blame OP not returning to the thread on me, given she last posted yesterday at 3pm and I posted today.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

OP is very obviously not coming back to this thread. Which is hardly any wonder, considering the nit-picky, personal comments being thrown her way. Such as this ... OP's grin emoji? It struck a weird note for me too.

Really, how petty. And then you accuse her of having no empathy? Some people on this thread should take a good look at yourselves. Hope you're proud.

Well we aren't the one making a devastating situation like child abuse lightheaded with grin emojis. The fact that you think that attitude towards this situation is OK means maybe you should take a good looks at yourself.

I am not ashamed to say I judge anyone who seems so blasé about domestic violence and rape, specially when it comes to children. I'd be questioning your morals if you think that making light of such actions is justified.

My friend was raised by very catholic parents who thought it was a great idea to adopt and raise the child she had at fifteen as their own, claiming that he was a lovely “gift from God in their late life”, etc.... Never mind that this baby was a permanent souvenir of a violent gang rape on her way to school one morning - that she was severely punished for (because she obviously asked for it, of course...) and then she had no legal rights to refuse to keep the baby, or how he was raised. Those fuckers got the son they always wanted (oh, and wasn’t that quote wheeled out at parties?!?!) and this sweet, smart, talented girl completely ceased to exist for them entirely. She left home on her 18th birthday and I doubt they noticed.

This was in the 1980’s. Morals are flexible. People justify what they want to suit their agenda.

Well we aren't the one making a devastating situation like child abuse lightheaded with grin emojis. The fact that you think that attitude towards this situation is OK means maybe you should take a good looks at yourself.

I am not ashamed to say I judge anyone who seems so blasé about domestic violence and rape, specially when it comes to children. I'd be questioning your morals if you think that making light of such actions is justified.

Just listen to yourself. You have no idea whatsoever as to whether child abuse took place in this situation. A man can be abusive to one person and not others. I took the brunt of my father's abuse: he never once touched either of his wives or my sisters. You are making an enormous over-reach about someone's entire life given a few short lines of typeface on the internet. Some reading comprehension and a liberal dose of criticality - rather than some form of twisted creative -writing exercise to appease your own overactive imagination - would be in order here.

I am not ashamed to say I judge anyone who seems so blasé about domestic violence and rape, specially when it comes to children.

1. That's a beautiful case of DARVO if ever I saw one. The people displaying blasé attitudes about domestic violence and rape are to be the people casting aspersions on a mother whose situation they know nothing about - 6 entire decades in the past - and a daughter they are seeing fit to blame for her mother's long-ago actions even though she wasn't alive at the time.

Quote the precise sentences in which the OP, or I (incidentally a victim of gang rape and child abuse) have made blasé comments about domestic violence and rape, especially when it comes to children. Word for word, please. Oh, wait. You can't, can you?

I'd be questioning your morals if you think that making light of such actions is justified.

Question away. It's of zero consequence to me.

Careful of that straw man, PP. It could be blowing a gale out there ...

This odd tone and use of emojis is why my gut feeling is that these 3 individuals aren't going to get what they need from a meeting with the OP or her mother. I just hope they find emotional support and closure somewhere else.

Well @MarieIVanArkleStinks I'd rather be on the side that reacts badly to the possibility of child abuse then the side that justifies why it likly didn't happen. Says a lot about the type of person who'd rather turn a blind eye and play ignorant then the ones who recognise how awful the situation truly is. But hey, if you think the woman leaving her 3 kids with a known violent man is justifiable then you do you. But you really don't have a right to tell those of us who actually think that action is horrible that we should look at ourselves.

The old protestation, that’s almost overwhelmingly applied to women only: ‘be nice’. ‘Be kind’. To whom? And does this maxim still apply if being kind comes at the cost of our own peace of mind? You bet it does – if you’re female. Likewise, this thread is unfortunately ample proof that if a woman says ‘no’, people (and that includes other women) hear something entirely different.The old protestation, that’s almost overwhelmingly applied to women only: ‘be nice’. ‘Be kind’. To whom? And does this maxim still apply if being kind comes at the cost of our own peace of mind? You bet it does – if you’re female. Likewise, this thread is unfortunately ample proof that if a woman says ‘no’, people (and that includes other women) hear something entirely different.

Pretty much. See also, the way in which some posters have dismissed a lesbian's desire not to voluntarily expose herself to what sounds like homophobia, as though that's some grossly unreasonable boundary. One can disagree with OPs use of smileys, and I do, whilst also recognising this.

And there seems no reason at all to assume the meeting would be to the ultimate benefit of the siblings anyway. If this thread is anything to go by, there's a very real risk at least one of them will try to hold OP in some way responsible for her mother's behaviour and her refusal to have contact now. There'll be no closure available. The meeting could very easily do more harm than good for those requesting it. Anyone who thinks OP ought to agree for the sake of the siblings needs to give this possibility some very real thought.

@GreytExpectations

Well *@MarieIVanArkleStinks* I'd rather be on the side that reacts badly to the possibility of child abuse then the side that justifies why it likly didn't happen. Says a lot about the type of person who'd rather turn a blind eye and play ignorant then the ones who recognise how awful the situation truly is. But hey, if you think the woman leaving her 3 kids with a known violent man is justifiable then you do you. But you really don't have a right to tell those of us who actually think that action is horrible that we should look at ourselves.

that justifies why it likly didn't happen.

Quote. Please. Where did I justify why rape and domestic abuse, especially as it relates to children, likely didn't happen? I merely pointed out that it was by no means certain that it had, and you were making an over-reach on the basis of what the OP's post did not say. Qualify that statement. Please.

NB. I'm still waiting for the quote for the last false claim you made about something I'd said. You haven't posted that one yet. Quelle Surprise! But I'll wait ...

Says a lot about the type of person who'd rather turn a blind eye and play ignorant

Do you struggle with reading comprehension this badly in other contexts, PP? Were this a case where suspected abuse of minors was taking place I'd be onto Social Services like a rat up a drainpipe. I've fought vocal, active advocacy for rape victims who have not received justice. Have you forgotten that the events which took place in this post happened SIXTY. YEARS. AGO? Typed in nice big letters, just in case that especially pertinent fact has eluded you.

But hey, if you think the woman leaving her 3 kids with a known violent man is justifiable.

Quotation? Where have I said this? I.e. a quote directly from me, rather than you making things up off the top of your head?

you really don't have a right to tell those of us who actually think that action is horrible that we should look at ourselves.

You can look at yourself in another vein too, if you like. Quite the fantasist, aren't you?

I'd rather be on the side that reacts badly to the possibility of child abuse then the side that justifies why it likly didn't happen. Says a lot about the type of person who'd rather turn a blind eye and play ignorant then the ones who recognise how awful the situation truly is. But hey, if you think the woman leaving her 3 kids with a known violent man is justifiable then you do you. But you really don't have a right to tell those of us who actually think that action is horrible that we should look at ourselves.

Completely agree GreytExpectations

I'm not saying the half-siblings were abused, but I agree the blasé lack of desire to know sits uneasily.

YOU have no obligation to meet them and shouldn't if you don't want to. I know I wouldn't.

I think you're mum should meet them, but that's up to her as you say.