Is this Midwife out of line?

[SistineScreamer]

Curious as to what others would think. My daughter just had her first DC yesterday. She had an elective section and is still in hospital. My daughter is young, she’s 24, Not married (and has no intention to) but been with her DP since they were 16. She’s had some MH issues, stemmed from ex husband of mine. This is all noted in her file and is a manageable, she’s had to come off her medication during the pregnancy because of risks to the baby but she was more than willing to do this. She’s in a private room and not on a ward. All this information is important as I assume this is why she was treated the way she was.

She rang me 30 minutes ago in tears. Telling me one of the midwives assigned to her has been horrible to her. We’ll call her Midwife A.

All this is what she says happened - First, DD had baby in a onsie and bib, midwife A came in and commented that the bib was too big for baby, took baby out of DD’s arms and removed the bib. Even if the bib was too big why completely undermine her like that? Next, DD brought wipes for her face, body etc they were baby brand water wipes as her skin is overly sensitive to anything else. Midwife proceeded to lecture DD that these were wrong and cotton buds must be used with water instead, proceeded to bin wipes then leave the room.

Half an hour later Midwife A came back in to ask DD about her feeding choices. DD was sexually assaulted and does not feel comfortable breastfeeding, her choice. Midwife proceeded to give her the breast is best talk, asking why she wouldn’t consider breastfeeding, basically making her feel like shit for picking formula. DD mentioned she’d purchased a perfect prep machine for the formula (you know the ones that give the perfect shot of hot water at night so you don’t have to faff about with the kettle?) this woman nodded, left the room and came back 15 minutes later with a print out of the perfect prep machine....asking DD to confirm if this was what she was talking about. Nodding and tutting. What the fuck? Even if she wanted to know what DD was talking about, why print it out and bring it to her? Why not look it up herself?

Next issue came with the drip that was in DD’s hand, it was ripping the skin, physically pulling up the skin. She asked Midwife A if she could take it out or change it, to be told no nothing could be done. She’d just have to suck it up. An hour after she was told this another midwife came in, Midwife B, she begged midwife B to take it out and showed her what it was doing to her hand. Midwife B promptly took it out stating that there was no problem. Midwife A came back for her checks, asked DD what happened to the drop. DD explained that midwife B took it out, midwife A mumbled something about how that couldn’t be right and she’d have to check that ‘story’ right away.

DD is still vulnerable after birth, can’t move yet because of the catheter and has to be changed by this woman who she feels uncomfortable with and intimidated by. This woman has to handle her naked, change her sheets and I feel from what she’s saying it’s making her MH worse. She says she feels like Midwife A is talking about her with the other midwife (not B) on duty who she seems friendly with, shared looks, little smirks, off comments.

The looks and such could be DD’s dislike for this midwife raring up. But the rest, is this normal! I feel like she’s over stepped the mark and made my child feel low because of her age and choices. Should we ignore this?

I think it all sounds horrific.

Glad you're going to the hospital and good for your daughter sticking up for herself at last.

Yes, there probably is an element of over-reaction emotionally from your DD but who cares, she's just had a bloody baby - she's allowed!

@JellyfishandShells what part of throwing the mum's wipes away is her doing a responsible job?
Or ignoring that mum is in pain and her cannula hurts?

@RedHelenB

I don't think that now is quite the right moment to encourage her daughter to be more assertive. She is vulnerable with MH problems, having just had a baby and being exhausted. You can't just turn things around by giving someone with MH problems a prep talk. If only it was that easy.

The midwife sounds far to harsh. Although she might not have technically been negligent her tone is totally unnecessary. I would definitely have a word with the hospital and request your DD isn't looked after by her

Personally I am upset and angry reading this. Post birth is such an important time in a woman's life, they should be treated like an actual genuine queen in every possible way

I think you should call the hospital and heavily complain, no need to note the individual issues, just say your DD does not feel comfortable with this midwife and can she have a different one instead of her.

Her choice of baby wipes and feeding is NOT the midwife’s decision though, in exactly the same way it isn’t anybody else’s decision. I wouldn’t appreciate my mum, MIL, random women at baby group declaring my baby wipes aren’t good enough and chucking them away in the same way I wouldn’t appreciate a midwife doing it. She doesn’t have that kind of authority or power over another adult.

New mums can be provided with the right information to guide their decisions but staff can’t dictate what they’re ‘allowed’ to do with their own babies

That is awful, your poor DD. I felt so angry for her reading how horrid this MW has been. Glad you are going to the hosp and she has you to stick up for her. Good luck

Omg this is so awful for your DD. If she’s in a private room can someone stay with her? My DH was allowed to stay and sleep on a little camp bed. Try to be with her as much as possible to help her with these midwives.

Unfortunately the natural birth movement has hijacked women’s choice when it comes to feeding. Breast is best now and it’s very very common for women to be made to feel guilty about bottle feeding. It’s not okay at all!! I would complain as until enough women complain nothing will change. The midwives are very firm about any safety issues so the bib was probably that. They are responsible for the safety of the baby to some degree whilst in hospital and they cannot take the risk. I think it’s normal for them to be very firm and refuse to leave the room until something like that it rectified. Bib would be a strangulation or suffocation issue (if it ends up over babys face). The water wipes. I think she shouldn’t have thrown them away but it is meant to be cotton wool and water at that stage. That said it’s not okay that your DD feels unsupported and ganged up on. The midwives should change each shift so hopefully there will be some better ones on soon. In the meantime try to offer as much emotional support as you can.

All these people who think the midwife was reasonable and the new mother is just exhausted and emotional.

Doesn't even the most average or lousy midwife not lnow newly delivered mothers are emotionally vulnerable. The attitude beggars belief!

I’m surprised so many people are defending the midwife to be honest. I get that she obviously feels that the bib and perfect prep are a health risk and that midwives are encouraged to advocate for breastfeeding but a massive part of being a midwife is bedside manner. This midwife sounds sorely lacking in this department. For me, if she can’t make patients feel comfortable and safe then she isn’t very good at her job!

I agree with optimistic six

I just had baby, I’m 41 and a lawyer and also found myself being patronised by certain midwives / staff, so your daughter is not the only one

I was married in my late 20s with my first and had much the same experience. "My" midwife seemed to think her job was to patronise and belittle the women in her care. Lecturing us on breastfeeding without providing any support. She insisted on calling me the wrong name, told women in pain after traumatic births that pain was part of having babies and we had to put up with it.

I though my baby was jaundiced, pointed this out, was completely dismissed in quite a rude way (made me feel like I was being neurotic). It turned out he was jaundiced!

I had exactly the same experience. He wasn't feeding, no help was available, I was in pain. When I mentioned he didn't seem to feed much and slept a lot I was dismissed. He ended up in special care.

The only reason he didn't come out on the bottle was because a lovely student midwife who had actually had a baby and fed it, helped me learn to do it properly.

Libby Purves described midwives as falling into two camps. Midwives with community experience who tended to be realistic, skilled and practical and hospital only midwives. I had the latter but that student went into the community at the first opportunity. I know this because after my hospital experience with the first I had the others at home and she delivered the youngest.

Bib - midwife could have simply said that your dd should be careful to take the bib off after feeding. Wipes - this is a load of crap! I remember being told to use water and cotton wool but of course used wipes as does everyone! Midwife can share her view but it is not essential to use water and cotton wool so it comes under the category of preference. Breast feeding - par for the course. This is typical of most women's experience. The needle in hand thing is outrageous. If it is uncomfortable they should remove it or reposition or at least explain why it cant be removed. Sounds like midwife A is just not very nice. Your dd needs to pull her up or ask for someone else who is less unpleasant.

The fact there are so many women on this thread defending the midwife just shows why pre/postnatal care in this country is so f*d up. The midwives treat women like brainless hysterical creatures with no sign of respect. No other patients of any kind get treated like that.
Given the fact this young lady had such a horrible past and resulting mental health issues she should have been treated with extra care and very gentle.
Do complain

I hope your daughter is feeling supported now she has you fighting her corner OP. The midwife may well feel that the bib was inappropriate, but she went about it entirely the wrong way.
It reminds me of being in hospital after the birth of my first child. The midwife was an absolute tartar, until she realised my husband was her daughter's form tutor! She brought me toast and tea several times during the night and was as nice as pie thereafter.

She will soon be home. Why has she got a private room? Her choice or the hospitals? What about expressing would she feel comfortable expressing, even if it's just for now? When she's home she will have more freedom.

Op are you worried re children's services becoming involved?

If it helps I've three kids and on my second also bought water wipes and got a bollocking. I went to a dotty state school and learnt years back to be awfully apologetic and to put the water wipes away and got out the cotton wool balls.

@Abbazed why should she express just to make the midwife happy! It’s her baby and her body, no woman should be put in that position!

God the bib thing. They’re only used for feeding and burping right? How is the baby going to strangle or suffocate when you’re right there with them, watching and feeding them?

Absolutely ridiculous.

To the people asking why her catheter isn’t out the day after - I had an elective C and mine wasn’t taken out until 2 days after the day of my section.

The breastfeeding: great - I’ll just spend all day trying to feed when he has a tongue tie you’ve missed so he’s hungry and not getting enough. Or I could just switch to formula.

He’s 10 months and still with us.

Definitely complain.

Midwife sounds like an absolute cow!
Definitely get your Daughter to complain.

I know of so many women who have ended up in tears after a midwife has been rude or blunt to them. It's not acceptable.

I was going to say you would be better going down and advocating for dd. She sounds like she needs support and you could be her voice

I do hope your DD is alright @SistineScreamer

So a lot to get through but first and foremost.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I didn’t think MH issues automatically translated to delusional or liar? I know my child and I know her conditions, none of them include delusions or paranoia. After the section she was started back on her medication.

Those of you who are saying two sides, but you weren’t THERE etc no I wasn’t there but DD’s partner was hence why I couldn’t be. He was there for the birth and after, we are only allowed ONE visitor and this is his place as baby’s father and DD’s partner. Unfortunately he’s terribly shy and about as fierce as a kitten, add Aspergers onto that and we haven’t much for confrontation but he can and DOES confirm what she says.
*
Curious to those who think it’s acceptable to keep berating a new mum about BFing until she feels like absolute shit? Is that normal? Ignoring her pain? And throwing her wipes out? THE WIPES WERE NOT FOR THE BABY. Though a quick look on the trust’s site - baby wipes can be used for newborns. AND THE BIBE - Was newborn sizes and used when feeding/burping. Not randomly when baby was asleep. Midwife took baby out of DD’s arms - this is the issue I had. She could have mentioned it to her instead of snatching baby.*

Onto now - when I got to DD’s room ward sister informed me that midwife B was with DD and partner and Midwife A/C (midwife A’s friendly one) were waiting in another room. Ward sister had spoken to both parties and explained the the situation to me, I then went to talk to DD and partner.

Apparently it was the end of Midwife A’s shift and she had taken it upon herself to give DD one last ‘push’ about BFing, even brought midwife C for back up. DD asked her to please leave as she had made her choice. Midwife A told her she was being uncooperative and not doing what was best for baby. DD told her to leave this time, she didn’t just continued about benefits and superiority of BFing and how DD was wrong. DD then snapped and told her to ‘get the fuck out, you’re upsetting me.’ She then decided DD was having an episode and moved to take baby. DD held onto baby and repeated “My baby is safe. You are the problem. Please leave.” Ward sister was called while DD rang me.

DD has calmed down. I have talked to Midwife A, B and C + ward sister. Will write other update now and fill in what I can

Op she's being rude to staff. If your daughter isn't more cooperative then they will involve the social.

Even if she hasn't they will say she has.