It's not the case that most parents of babies/toddlers 'get no sleep for years'

[Echobelly]

I'm aware I was pretty fortunate in getting two kids who were both pretty good sleepers relatively early on - I was preparing for the worst because all the folklore about having a baby is 'Hahaha, you'll never sleep again' but TBH, I think only about 10% of parents I'm friends with seem to have had really persistent non-sleepers (as in still multiple waking often age 3-4+).

Seems to me that most babies actually sleep with no more than one wake by about six months (and one wake's generally pretty copable) and while it may be true you don't get a lie-in at weekend for years, and may get worken early, it's not years of broken sleep as some people seem to give the impression.

Disclaimer: not implying terrible sleepers don't exist, that that's not awful to live with or that it's anyone's fault if babies/toddlers do or don't sleep

But basically AIBU to suggest that the majority of babies and toddlers don't actually deny their parents restful sleep for years on end?

My mum had 4 and all of us were good sleepers and slept from 7pm to 7am from 3-4 months old. We were all big babies (9lb+) and the advice at the time was not to wake us up for feeds during the night, we would awaken if hungry on our own.

My dd was 5lb 10oz ( dropped to 5lb because my milk was very slow to come in) and I was told she needed to be woken for feeds during the night as her weight gain was slow so yes I had very little sleep for the first year. It has gotten better and she finally sleeps through aged 4. My ds is nearly 3 and he still wakes once a night most nights. So yeah I am one of the parents who has had shitty sleep for the last 4 years. If I have another I intend to put them to sleep whilst awake and attempt to let them self soothe ( think this is sleep training?) to save my sanity. Not sure how this would work in reality.

Lots of people struggle they just aren't always willing to share with others. Quite often because of instead commenting on how difficult that must be some competitive parents will talk smugly about how their angel has slept through since birth as if this is a result of their wonderful parenting and not a stroke of luck. If your baby did sleep through and you think this is as a result of something to you have done, please share!

I never give unsolicited advice to parents because all kids are individuals and what worked for my kids might not work for theirs. My dh's cousin is having a baby and the only advice I had for her when she asked, is that each stage has it's challenges, parents of babies will have their own gripes compared to parents of teenagers who have their own worries.

YABU

Most people have 2 (or more) children. Iften 2-3 years apart. By the time you’re youngest child is sleeping reliably at 1 year (being generous in my and many cases) you will have had 18 months of being pregnant (not always great for sleeping prospects) plus 2 years of broken nights several nights a week.

@pinkblueberry

This is not a post about judging people's parenting decisions. You aren't being unkind but you are being a touch judgemental....
For what it's worth I came to the same conclusion re my child's sleep patterns and gave up in the sleep training ...

The point of this post is whether people with young kids get enough sleep. I do not. I work flexibly and often have work to do in the evenings. I stop early to pick my son up. I struggle to get to sleep because usually o work for an hour or so and then need some time to switch off and have some me time Plus, as I said, I am a bit of a night owl. He is up at 5. We do share the getting ups but live in a flat so I'm generally awake even if I'm not up. So I'm not sure I can train myself to be different..., maybe I should give up work?!

I think the ever so often asked questions "Do they sleep well?" and "Are they good?" can be quite loaded and it's easier to simply reply yes. I think the suggestion of 10% may be an underestimation as people may not want to volunteer their private experiences

Sadly I'm one of the 10% I think... my DS is 2.5 and has NEVER slept through. He's terrible, utterly terrible.

BUT I think you're probably right because when I mention it to people (not often, but to friends and family when they ask) I get blank looks or suggestions which make me think that they are not really clear on how bad his sleep is.

I don't know anyone in this position... it sounds like I'm moaning, but I'm really not... I'm fairly used to it now, just using this as an example to agree with you.

YABU and goady. I haven't slept properly in 7 years. So, yes YABVU.

Somewhere in the middle. Based on people I know, I think night waking is common in toddlers, but not that common in three and four year olds.

DS slept through at two when I night weaned him, he was waking a few times a night until then. I was still getting enough sleep (though broken) before that because we co-slept. When he slept through I mean he slept from about 9pm to 8am, not waking me up at 5am!

A lot of it is a state of mind.

When DS was a newborn we expected him to wake often. I used my phone as a stopwatch between wakings so I could say “oh I’ve had a good 3 hour chunk” etc and felt very good about that. He’s not a great sleeper - always been 30 minute naps and he will sleep 18.30-5am, but with a few wakings usually, and at 3/4am-5am will only sleep latched on having milk. He’s nearly 2.

But then I did just expect that with a child. Sometimes I am more tired, but like with anything, if you accept it happily as just “part of the job” then you can manage it.

If you expect 12 hours a night and a lie in then of course you will be disappointed! 🤷🏻‍♀️😁

Seems to me that most babies actually sleep with no more than one wake by about six months
Not my baby and not most babies I know. They're all still waking up multiple times a night at 18 months plus.

If I think of people I know who bottle fed, YANBU.

If I think of people I know who breastfed, YABU.

Obviously there are outliers in each group.

I have not slept a whole night since before my son was born. He is 14 months and still wakes up every two hours. It makes me so jealous with I hear about super amazing sleepers

Mine slept 12 hours per night from 6 months old. No sleep training - she just sorted herself out. Before that I found it very hard - more than 2 night wakings and I was struggling in the day.
So I have a good sleeper, but I also really need 8 hours myself at night.
Most people I know had babies who carried on waking up in the night for much longer - often until about 2.

@goldopals

I have not slept a whole night since before my son was born. He is 14 months and still wakes up every two hours. It makes me so jealous with I hear about super amazing sleepers

Hugs from a former sufferer. Sometimes no solution really works, it just very slowly gets better.

Yabu and statements like yours were what pushed me further into horrific PND, every time I tried attending baby groups full of mums that had good sleepers and support.

Mine was an excellent sleeper and also a very good eater ... maybe the two are linked? She was breastfed until a year

I sometimes wish I'd bottle fed mine to reduce the level of torture

Most people with good sleepers are polite enough to STFU about it. Because those of us who didn't sleep for three years didn't want to hear your smug solutions, "have you tried..." YES I FUCKING HAVE.

Yessssssss! And a version of this always rears its head on sleep threads: "mine slept through, I think it was because I kept all night wakings dark / did a bath and book bedtime routine / put them down drowsy / got them outside for fresh air", as though those of us with bad sleepers are particularly stupid and kept the big light on all night, played them Hey Duggee as a bedtime routine, and never took them to the bloody park.

And drowsy but awake doesn't fucking exist for bad sleepers. If yours does it, it's because they're innately a good sleeper anyway.

Maybe genetics play a role. I've always been a deep sleeper and have to set an alarm every day otherwise I will wake-up past noon. I was dreading the sleep deprivation that came with a new baby and it was every bit as brutal as I imagined. Exclusive BF meant I didn't get a single night's break for over a year but something muddled through.

I couldn't bring myself to try CIO but thankfully DD gradually went from waking 3 times a night (6-12months), to 2 (12-14months), to 1 (14-16months) and starting from 17 months started sleeping 12 hours without a single waking. Her sleep pattern is basically the same as mine adjusted for being a toddler. She also sleeps in comparatively late (8am).

I know a couple who say their children (both under 8) ruin their evenings as they are forever calling downstairs for stuff, coming downstairs for ‘one more story’ (which they then get on the sofa) need another song to get to sleep etc etc. It’s turned into a game of getting mum and dads attention until 10pm every night. Mum is up and down 15 times a night before she crawls into bed at midnight. She even reads bedtime stories at 4am when they wake up, for half an hour.
Rods and Backs come to mind.

Most babies I know wake loads! But all breastfed if that makes a difference.

burritofan totally agree. The only advice I got from a HV was ‘drowsy but awake’ and my DS never was like that. Then later I was advised to do some sleep training - relatively gentle sleep training but it never felt right, and it didn’t work (but perhaps because my heart wasn’t in it).

Several of my friends had DC about the same time as I did, none slept ‘well.’ One of them was a decent day-napper but in general we were all up several times a night.

I have a non-sleeper. Currently 17 months, but he's been horrendous ever since newborn. We're down to waking 3-4 times a night and being up for the day by 5am currently... which believe it or not feels like heaven compared to what he was like upto a year old. I imagine I'm in the minority, because there's no way so many people would have multiple children if they all suffered the way we did with DS for those twelve months 🙈

the advice at the time was not to wake us up for feeds during the night, we would awaken if hungry on our own

That’s common sense. Who wakes a sleeping baby for a feed? That would be bonkers.

Yes @BabyLlamaZen- Couldn't make breastfeeding work with DD and switched to bottle around 12 weeks and she basically started sleeping through at that point, bar the odd development spurt. Managed to crack it after 3 weeks of agony with DS and he definitely work more, but then getting back to sleep was easier for me afterwards.

alsohuman I used to try a ‘dream feed’ with DS - so if we came to bed at say 10.30pm and he was asleep, I’d lift him and feed him, then put him back in the cot in the hope that he wouldn’t wake up half an hour after we’d gone to sleep.

It didn’t usually work.