What exactly are CAMHs supposed to treat?

[WhiteC0sm05]

Seems to be very little in our area.

He’s lying there in the dark with the curtains closed all day. Can’t get him out and at a loss as to what to do. Honestly what the f**k am I supposed to do? This could have been avoided.

Have you written to the CEO of the MH Trust, the lead GP Partner on the CCG and your MP whitecosmos.

I am sorry you are going through this.

I know its expensive but if your absolutely desperate and genuinely worried he's at risk of serious harm then I'd go private ASAP. Even if it means taking on debt.
Id rather debt than something unthinkable happening.

CAMHS/complaints you can do later. But if your son is at risk then get him seen by a private psychiatrist assp.

It shouldn't have to be this way at all. But your sons wellbeing is vital right now.

I hope your okay op

If my child breaks a leg, the treatment pathway is decided by an appropriately qualified doctor

All medical services have been moving away from the Medical Model for decades for good reason. Care decisions made by a multi-disciplinary team tend to be better.

Crazy really, because if CAMHS were better funded then adult mental health would be better

I think that's the case with a lot of preventative work tbh. Because it's all about measuring outcomes, and the success of prevention can only be counted comparatively and doesn't often show results in time for service reviews, it doesn't get funded. It's easy to quantify cancer survival rates or a surgeon's mortality rates, but counting the number of people with MH issues who didn't go into crisis is a bit more tricky. (Or, as a chief fire officer once said to me about fire safety work "We can't count fires that didn't happen").

I've sat in meetings where we've had to come up with some bollocks of an outcome to justify continued funding. It's all a bloody box-ticking exercise, but this short-termism is the way things are now. And if the value of a service can't be demonstrated, the funding for it won't continue, which is a nonsense for something like CAMHS.

And many other services, too.

Even in CAMHS @stompythedinosaur? Where dd's MH nurse told me she was too old to have ADHD at 17. It's terrifying.

Actually can you answer a question. Why is it that CAMHS nurses think they can address mothers as "mum", "you mum" and write in reports "Olivia and mum". They don't refer to other stakeholders in such a reductive way so why do it to mothers if it isn't designed to disempower? I doubt a CAMHS practitioner would like it if I said "you nursey" or "hey doc". But no rather than write Olivia and her mother, or call a parent by their name they persist in calling them mum. It's awful, especially when it comes on the heels of asking if they may use your first name and then immediately revert to being reductive.

@OhTheRoses You really need to move on from your rage at being referred to as mum. Literally any thread about the NHS and you bang on about it.

We’ve paid for a private clinical psychologist to get advice re treatment which was really useful. First bit of empathy we’ve had. Suggested way forward made perfect sense. Was hoping to avoid medication. Thought if he actually got some proper treatment drugs could be a last resort.

Should it have been a psychiatrist instead? I’m so confused.

Why is it that CAMHS nurses think they can address mothers as "mum", "you mum" and write in reports "Olivia and mum". They don't refer to other stakeholders in such a reductive way so why do it to mothers if it isn't designed to disempower? I doubt a CAMHS practitioner would like it if I said "you nursey" or "hey doc". But no rather than write Olivia and her mother, or call a parent by their name they persist in calling them mum. It's awful, especially when it comes on the heels of asking if they may use your first name and then immediately revert to being reductive.

Oh, they trot out the usual, they're so busy, they have so many patients, they can't possibly. I worked for years as a court clerk. Saw thousands of clients, you could not address them as 'Client', 'Complainer' or 'Accused' (the procurator fiscal can, but she is a judge, fgs). It doesn't take long to see their name on a file.

Plus, with CAMHS patients you'd think using the reductive would cause problems as some children are not living with their biological parents.

That 'Mum' shit used to get on my tits when I had a child who was inpatient for a long time, months. 'What does Mum think?' 'I have no idea, why don't you take out your phone, ping her a message and ask her if she is, God willing (I'd just throw that out even though I don't believe in God), still with us?'

The exclusion of children with autism is an absolute travesty. As if the mental health of children with learning and developmental differences do not matter. Who, exactly, is supposed to help the suicidal child with autism? Makes me mad.

I shall move on from it @gypsywater when hcp's cease the practice. I have a name - it isn't hard to use it or at least to refer to me as "Olivia's mum". It is designed to be exquisitely reductive. Or would you not mind being referred to as nursey, a diminutive of nurse as mum is to mother?

@OhTheRoses I think you need to look at why it injures you so much tbh.

@WhiteC0sm05

We’ve paid for a private clinical psychologist to get advice re treatment which was really useful. First bit of empathy we’ve had. Suggested way forward made perfect sense. Was hoping to avoid medication. Thought if he actually got some proper treatment drugs could be a last resort.

Should it have been a psychiatrist instead? I’m so confused.

We went to a psychiatrist but it was a set of circumstances where 2 doctors and 3 social workers actually WANTED him to see one, but even the emergency appointment was just a month away with CAMHS psychologist due to the pathway.

Our son was nearly 11 before drug treatment but tbh, it's been a real gamechanger. I get why there's a lot of resistance to it but honestly, if the child is already on his knees and you are, too, don't fight it so much.

Sadly I think in a lot of ways the NHS is not fit for purpose anymore and child mental health is one of these .

But he’s had no proper other treatment. Putting him on drugs before we’ve tried seems wrong.

I wonder if Mumsnet HQ would be willing to run some kind of campaign about this, as it's an absolute sham.

And I agree that the screening process just seems like a computer says no exercise where they are actively looking for reasons to say no.

As I said up thread, my son was screened out as he has ASD. His anxiety was terrible so that he wouldnt leave the house. He was 12. I was offered a parenting course I took when he was first diagnosed 10 years ago. I work with adults with Autism and have done for several years. I also cannot afford to take 7 days off to attend the course. When I explained this to the lady who screened him out ( I got to speak to her only ne cause I sobbed on the phone to the receptionist) I was told that these workshops were all they offered, and it wasnt a case of doing the course and then accessing something else, the course was it. When I explained the wnaxiety was around being in school, and that is why school had referred him, and asked her what me taking parenting classes would do to help him at school, with teachers who are highly trained (asd school) she couldnt answer, so we were discharged.

Can I ask those of you who have gone private, who have you gone too? DS's anxiety is through the roof at the moment and I cannot tackle the behaviour on my own. I need some support and will go private if I need to bug I am unsure what type of professional i can turn to.

@gypsywater it doesn't injure me, I just think it's interesting that it's a practice adopted by hcp's and not in any other sphere. Would you call a policeman cop or refer to him or her in a report as the cop? Why is it acceptable to address a mother in such a reductive way. I believe it's a power trip, especially when I ask for my name to be used. I don't mind first names if every stakeholder is addressed by their first name, I do mind it if another stakeholder is referred to by theor title and last name. In which case please also use mine. It's actually about equality and it's interesting the NHS writes so much on the subject and collects so much data but can't put equality into practice by assuming the patient or carer is entitled to be addressed with the same level of respect as every other stakeholder.

It says more about many nurses who happily accept Drs addressing them as subordinate. You may be happy for that to be the case but I 'd appreciate it if nurses didn't assume I was subordinate to another human. If you are a nurse and you call my consultant or my child's consultant Dr or Mr/Ms/Mrs you may call me Mrs Roses. If you address them by their first name you may use mine. It's about basic courtesy and good manners.

I think a MN campaign is exactly what is needed.

@WhiteC0sm05

But he’s had no proper other treatment. Putting him on drugs before we’ve tried seems wrong.

Depends on what his conditions are. For some, it's quite necessary and in addition to other proper treatments. Drug treatment is proper treatment. You wouldn't try other treatments before putting someone with cancer on chemo or a diabetic on insulin first (and then try the weight loss and such if that's a factor) to stabilise things.

@OhTheRoses I'm not a nurse

I can't get worked up about being called Mum.
I'm a paeds nurse and always call parents 'mum' or 'dad'. Some days it's hard enough to remember the names of our patients nevermind their parents.

@TravellingSpoon

I wonder if Mumsnet HQ would be willing to run some kind of campaign about this, as it's an absolute sham.

And I agree that the screening process just seems like a computer says no exercise where they are actively looking for reasons to say no.

As I said up thread, my son was screened out as he has ASD. His anxiety was terrible so that he wouldnt leave the house. He was 12. I was offered a parenting course I took when he was first diagnosed 10 years ago. I work with adults with Autism and have done for several years. I also cannot afford to take 7 days off to attend the course. When I explained this to the lady who screened him out ( I got to speak to her only ne cause I sobbed on the phone to the receptionist) I was told that these workshops were all they offered, and it wasnt a case of doing the course and then accessing something else, the course was it. When I explained the wnaxiety was around being in school, and that is why school had referred him, and asked her what me taking parenting classes would do to help him at school, with teachers who are highly trained (asd school) she couldnt answer, so we were discharged.

Can I ask those of you who have gone private, who have you gone too? DS's anxiety is through the roof at the moment and I cannot tackle the behaviour on my own. I need some support and will go private if I need to bug I am unsure what type of professional i can turn to.

Travelling, we use The Edinburgh Clinic. They will accept you as a patient with an existing diagnosis as long as from a real doctor, IYKWIM. My son's ASD was diagnosed by the NHS but his OCD and ADHD by 2 psychiatrists and 2 psychologists in Canada and they were more than happy to accept those diagnoses and liaise with his team there to continue his medication. We have not had anything to do with CAMHS, who utterly failed him, and never will again.

Not cheap, had to borrow on a credit card and sell a car (have since paid it back, though).

To be honest they could call me anything if they treated him.

Our GP is also fully on board, knows the situation, he tried to help us as best he could.

@fairgame84 Indeed! The use of "mum" or "dad" in paediatric healthcare is also used for the benefit of children to make the situation feel less formal than calling their parent Mrs Jones would be and less odd to the child than calling them Brenda! Most children think of their parents as actually being called Mum or Dad