To return my rescue dog?

[Brunomarsbars]

Firstly let me say I don't ta ke this lightly. I never thought I'd be considering returning a dog.

I adopted a young dog at the weekend from a national dog charity. Specifically said on my application that I needed a dog-friendly dog. The dog I was matched with was described as "indifferent" to dogs which sounded fine. Didn't need him to be best friends with every dog he meets, but just not aggressive. He's the loveliest, most adorable dog with humans but I noticed from the word go he was grumpy with dogs. He'd strain at the leash and bark, even when the dogs were some distance away.

Then, he attacked a dog on a walk. He was on his leash but a dog came running up behind him and took him by surprise - he whipped round and bit it, and wouldn't let go. Fortunately the other dog didn't fight back and didn't appear to be too hurt, but mine was desperately fighting to get out of his harness to chase the dog down. It was really shocking.

I finally got a chat with the dog charity behaviourist today who advised it was worrying and concerning as the dog had given no warning signs, just launched straight into a bite. She advised not introducing the dog to my partner's dog yet (fair enough) and that they can do a 'consultation' with him but she can't make any guarantees that he'll improve or ever be ready to be introduced to the other dog.

I could muzzle him out and about, but wouldn't solve the issue of when my boyfriend's dog comes to visit (once a month as we are in a LDR).

I'm gutted as he's just adorable with people but as a first-time dog owner, I feel out of my depth. The charity is 1.5 hours drive away so not like I can pop there regularly.

AIBU to give him back on the basis of the fight/general dog grumpiness?

the dog was clearly ill, a real slopoy shitting machine that made our garden unusable, he was ravenously hungry all the time - we took him to the vets at great expense but they couldn't suggest anything.

I absolutely don't believe a vet could not suggest anything in those circumstances, or charged you "great expense" for no treatment.

I'm sorry but this is ridiculous. Of course it is possible that OP and dog have just hadn't been matched well. I would have the session and see what the behaviourist recommends because he is a lovely boy and deserves that, but calling the OP a time waster because she has been given a dog who is behaving completely differently to the way he has been described in a way

... that is potentially completely incompatible with her existing life and relationship is not fair.

Also, every dog I have had as an adult has been an adult rescue. They have all been anxious for the first few days/weeks but none of them has behaved that way towards other dogs, on lead or off. I feel like this is more than just anxiety caused by settling in, but I would still give him a bit more time because that doesn't mean he won't improve with the right approach.

I am surprised that the rescue didn't insist on the dog meeting your partner's dog before rehoming to you, since they were going to be together one weekend per month minimum and potentially living together long term. A good rescue would do that. If dog unfriendly is a deal breaker for you then it is better for the dog to go back as soon as possible. If it was just a case of needing to work on dog issues outside the home then it would be a different matter but potentially not being able to spend time in your home's with each other without one of you finding a dog-sitter, never moving in together is a huge deal. I would suggest that next time you need to be sure that the dog gets on with your partner's dog before you take him home.

Oh dear.
My cousin runs a rescue they do a thorough home check, ask many questions, set out scenarios and still people return the dog after a week.
Adopting a rescue is a big commitment it takes time money and the emotional wellbeing of the animal is at stake.

Really surprising the rescue didn’t insist on your dog meeting up with your partner’s dog. Hopefully they are not two females. I have a rescue and this happened to me, however there was no chance I would return her. I adore every inch of her. She does have issues around dogs who growl at her so I put her on lead around other dogs and off lead when not. Its not easy when your dog has issues around other dogs but she is amazing with people and children. Could you get the help of a dog trainer?

Please don’t allow her off lead until you are sure she will be ok. If she attacks again you could be forced to put her to sleep.

I will be honest - It sounds like my dog. I have spent a fortune on her with extra training and behaviouralists. My vet suspects her anxiety levels are just a result of breed failure. (She is not a purebred, nor is she pitbull-type of dog. She just seems to have inherited the worst-case scenario gene possible with temperament.) She is aggressive towards other dogs, and anxious with small kids and strangers. She feels safe with my DH and only he can walk her. It is such a pity, but that’s how it is. I am a very experienced dog person, but this is the first time I have come across this. I have been tempted to give up on her many times. She is fine with us (teenager children) but I discourage people with young kids from visiting and I don’t trust her with strangers. I have vicious dog signs up to warn people just in case. (She has snapped once, and I will not risk it again. If she does, she will be PTS - she is 50kgs, and too large to take chances with.) I am very nervous about getting another dog again after this one. She is so high-maintenance.

Oh for goodness sake, calling OP a time waster is such hyperbole. Should OP or anyone else with no experience of dogs keep one for 15 years or so just to avoid being someone who gave a rescue back because there is stigma. Obviously not. It won't help the dog to be with an owner that can't manage it's behavioural issues. That doesn't make OP a bad owner, the dog doesn't need a 'better' owner, it simply needs a more experienced and confident one and a better measure of its behaviour assessed by the rescue before it is doled out again, ideally. Why be so evangelical about it.

OP I would be contacting the rescue again to ask for better guidance on this and an action plan for meaningful support, it could be a settling issue, it might not. Have they told you whether the dog was socialised with other dogs in kennels, of all sizes and temperaments etc?

If the dog is lovely I personally would try to look at ways to get this to work, when you take on a rescue I do think you have to accept there is likely to be extra work and expense to be done. You can't risk it around partners dog without professional assistance though. Or off lead. If this is too much for you or you are unable or unwilling to commit then I think the dog should go back and await an owner who can. These things do not always work out, and it just be stressful for all involved.

I would think that your new dog could be trained to be better behaved with other dogs. You see this problem on TV programmes about dog behaviour.. Will you have time to patiently train the dog, and not be leaving the dog if you go out to work etc. It is worth a try to train your dog,if you have time and patience, especially if he is a good dog at home with you.

See, with that level of biting, I don't know that this always possible to train out...you always worry about the dog and that makes life really hard.

Yes you can work on reducing stress, building a bond and confidence in you as an owner and you can do positive training to improve attitude and response. But there are some scenarios you can't always predict and control.

And the OP bite scenario was one of these. She was doing everything right, the dog was on-lead, but another one came up behind them, so neither could see or anticipate to take preventative action. And then the launch straight to bite. And the bite was locked down by the sounds of it. That is really serious. The only good thing sounds like a degree of bite inhibition to not injure the other dog.

But that same level of bite on a human could be much worse due to our thinner skin. (Hopefully this is a complete non-issue though as dog appears human friendly)

It's so hard. When a dog has bitten you always know in the back of your mind they could resort to that again. It's a very stressful life to live and it's often a question of management rather than certainty that you have trained the possibility of a reoccurence away.

I'm glad the crazy mn dog people settled down and you got some sensible advice. I'm really sorry that they didn't do a more thorough home check /behavioural assessment of the dog. I would send it back with a clear conscience - unless you are one of the afore mentioned mn dog people, most people in the real world do not have the time or inclination to spend £££ on dog behaviouralists trying to get into a difficult dog's head. I'm delighted for these reactive, tricky dogs that some do but the reality is that most people get a dog to have a fun, loveable pet. This doesnt sound like the right dog for you.

Had our rescue three YEARS and we are still working on certain issues with him. All dogs, even puppies you take home at 8 weeks, but especially an adult rescue with a largely unknown history, can have behavioural issues. They require time energy patience from committed loving selfless owners.

@Dougalthesyrianhamster - the dog has been through several homes including the rescue place, possibly mistreated - quite traumatic.
No one I know that's adopted a rescue dog has any expectation of it being perfectly settled and well behaved from day 1 - it can take months or even years for a dog to settle,

Definitely the other dog owners fault, but I would be worried that the incident you described will be lodged in your dogs brain now as something the worked, leading to more of the same and dog becoming reactive on the lead. In my experience that's very hard to resolve.

I’m all for trying to work on the dog’s behaviour - however - a friend of mine had a rescue dog from a well known dog charity. She needed a friendly dog and they knew this. The dog attacked her quite badly - when she spoke to them about it they said ‘oh yes, that dog had been returned before for attacking someone’.
Maybe the dog had been attacked itself in the past hence the aggressiveness, but I would definitely ring them and have a chat.

@EveryDayIsADuvetDay oh bore off. If anything it’s the op who’s had her time wasted, going through the application process, home checks, buying all the paraphernalia, getting matched with dog, paying the adoption fee and then being given an unsuitable dog. And she’s immediately contacted professional help when a problem has immediately arose. She admits to being an inexperienced dog owner, and has only asked for a dog that was safe around other dogs, which this is clearly not. Sometimes rescues get it wrong, and if it’s a bad fit then both the owner and dog deserve another chance of them getting it right. You don’t have to keep an unsuitable dog

I have a dog aggressive dog, who has a whole plethora of medical conditions. It can be at times, draining, frustrating, time consuming and very expensive. His now dementia can make the aggressiveness more extreme.
Despite all of this, I have always been committed to him and was/is prepared to do what I needed to. He's 12 soon, so we've made it this far.

Your dog a rescue, you have no idea what he's been through, he may just need time with expert behavioural training. He needs commitment and you can either do that or you can't. It won't be easy and you need to give it your all if you do.

It sounds very much like our rescue dog, he started biting other dogs on walks straight away. We took advice from the rescue, behaviourists and the vet who all advised he would stop when he settled in. I think with hindsight it was the wrong advice and the behaviour became ingrained. 10 years later, lots of training classes, muzzles and leads later he is too old to care. I think the advice that he is not a easy or beginners dog is right and there is no shame in returning him to be reassessed and found a home with experienced owners.

@Itsjustabitofbanter
try reading the thread - my first post started with the comment that op should return the dog.
and Its not just a bit of banter- it's an animals life

You haven't given it much time to settle in at all. 3 - 4 days? Good grief.

It's likely that the pther dog gave it a fright, and on the lead it felt trapped. What kind of dog is it? Have you had a dog before? If you haven't owned a dog before, you could both probably benefit from some sessions with a dog trainer/behaviourist.

@TanginaBarrons

By crazy mn dog people, do you mean the mumsnet people who are dog lovers? Who are experienced and actually know what they are talking about? Who understand that dogs are not just accessories, who do need a lot of time and committment and in some cases do need a lot of money spent on them? And I know a lot of difficult dogs that have become fun loveable pets. And that's only because someone was willing to put the effort in.

You adopted the dog at the weekend, you don’t think it’s going to be stressed? Also just because you don’t recognise the warning signs doesn’t mean they aren’t there.

The dog needs time and training. You have to put the work in. They didn’t ‘lie to you’ if they were aware. If you aren’t willing to give that to the dog then you don’t deserve it. Rescue dogs take work and care.

Sorry, but I really dislike people who give up dogs, especially when they have out in zero effort with them. Dogs are for life, they are a commitment, you wouldn’t return a child, you don’t get to treat a Dog the same way.

@dontgobaconmyheart

Oh for goodness sake, calling OP a time waster is such hyperbole. Should OP or anyone else with no experience of dogs keep one for 15 years or so just to avoid being someone who gave a rescue back because there is stigma. Obviously not. It won't help the dog to be with an owner that can't manage it's behavioural issues. That doesn't make OP a bad owner, the dog doesn't need a 'better' owner, it simply needs a more experienced and confident one and a better measure of its behaviour assessed by the rescue before it is doled out again, ideally. Why be so evangelical about it.

OP I would be contacting the rescue again to ask for better guidance on this and an action plan for meaningful support, it could be a settling issue, it might not. Have they told you whether the dog was socialised with other dogs in kennels, of all sizes and temperaments etc?

If the dog is lovely I personally would try to look at ways to get this to work, when you take on a rescue I do think you have to accept there is likely to be extra work and expense to be done. You can't risk it around partners dog without professional assistance though. Or off lead. If this is too much for you or you are unable or unwilling to commit then I think the dog should go back and await an owner who can. These things do not always work out, and it just be stressful for all involved.

That.

I'd rather see the dog returned and reassessed if this isn't going to work, there's no point keeping the dog if both end up miserable.