To think autistic people arent liserned to

[blueapple123]

I would love to hear autistic peoples point of view on this. I feel that in conversations about autism autistic peoples voices are completely ignored. Autistic adults seem to be on the receiving end of nasty comments, often from some parents of children with autism and are ridiculed for giving their opinion on things.Surly things like weather you use person first language etc aren't up to neurotipical people?

eyes electrical - that was supposed to say extra electrical

Perhaps as science progresses the diagnosis will be subdivided based on biological differences.

No thanks. That way eugenics lies.

In referring to identifying as having autism I mean people or parents that say someone has autism is autistic but doesn't have a clinical dx which I've seen happen numerous times.

There is a difference between Kanner's original group and the wider group as it now is. I have seen groups such as aa refer to those more severe as always having ld or other comorbid conditions to explain their additional needs rather than them being more autistic/ severe/ lf. It seems that this is sometimes (not always) to portray autism as just a difference and anything that is disabling is excused away as it doesn't fit with autism is a difference narrative, which is understandably the preference of hf people who do not want to be classed as disabled. If as said previously autism is a spectrum and people can be more impaired in different areas at different times why is it so unacceptable that someone may be more impaired all of the time?

It is my understanding that people who were previously dx as aspergers fought to be included in the autism bracket so that their needs were taken more seriously (the nazi assosiations also but to a lesser extent). This enabled more support and should have given more understanding however in doing so it did effect the original group.

Aa is a group which in theory I would love and want my son to aspire to also but having read more about them and engaged a few times i realise he will never be able to as it is almost hf elitist and parents seem to be demonized (whether this is through person bad experiences I dontknow). Aa cant include an lf voice as many lf cant articulate to be included and as such aa cant represent those who are non v as they have no idea what that is like or the difficulties faced by that group.

Whether someone with a dx prefers autistic or person with autism, is their call I use person first for my son as I think it's important that people see him as alot more than his dx, it is too easy to put him in a box so to speak (not literally) and not personalise for him. I want what's best for him not what suits most.

If I say to someone my son has autism they now assume he is more like Aspergers not classical and are shocked/ unprepared for my son.

I honestly think the autism dx is no longer fit for purpose due to the huge difference in people with it.

Sorry for the long post and if garbled, it has been a long night for various reasons.

Genetics around autism is already being looked at. We were asked to take part in the 100000 genome project to see if there was a genetic reason for my sons presentation.

I do think that autism is a very complex spectrum of distinct but related conditions and there will eventually be a range of separate diagnoses, which will make both tailored support and talking about very different people with autism without using words like "mild" and "severe" easier.

The ICD-11 has 6 sub categories (which concentrate on whether the individual has autism with or without cognitive impairment and with or without impaired functional language) but they are all still diagnosed as autism.

My son was finally diagnosed when he was 15 years old. Too late for him unfortunately because he’d already been permanently excluded from school. I have emails from his school, going back to Year 7 telling me all of his issues were “behavioural”.

Totally understand some genetic links have been found, but if I do decide to go for dx for my dd the decision will be based on her behaviour and how normative that is perceived to be, not her genes. Probably explained that badly!

I do not have Autism but do have a MH diagnosis and find some people think this makes me stupid. I'm not I have a degree, but some people treat me differently. One gave me short stories to read because they thought I could some with that This is people who don't know me well though.

I hope eugenics doesn't get rid of us. I really like existing.

So do I.

I feel like I need to clarify that I wasn't suggesting DSM is wrong on autism and needs changing just because I personally don't identify with being categorised as disabled. My point was that DSM has been misguided on a whole gamut of conditions through it's various iterations, hence the periodic updates and changes to diagnostic criterion.

I think it's inevitable the DSM description of Autism will morph eventually, but I'm making no claims about how exactly.

The issue I have with constant references to DSM is that it you tend to become defined entirely by the medical model if you do that. It's no different with any of the myriad of mental health conditions DSM lists. If you have involvement with psychiatry you might have an idea of what I'm getting at. The medical model is used to evaluate your entire life, and every aspect of you is viewed through the prism of DSM. I read a psychiatrist report about me once that said that because I always presented wearing black this was a reflection of my mood and personality type. That is absolute nonsense. I wear predominantly black to simplify laundry. It means I can throw everything in the wash together without sorting my clothes. There's no scope for recognising that within the medical model though.

I consider my autism a minuscule part of my life, I really don't want to be viewed as an 'autist' and nothing else, or be considered in a way that means people attribute everything I do, who I am, how I act, and all of my behaviours to my autism. I'm a person just like any other with aspects of my personality that are nothing to do with autism. So I reject being defined by black and white text in a book.

Again, people with diabetes, for example, are often referred to as 'diabetics', but nobody tries to imply their behaviours are shaped purely by their medical condition, or that all people with diabetes are the same just because a book defines diabetes.

The biggest thing for me though is just the stigma that goes hand in hand with having a recognised condition defined by the medical model. People who are not medical or care professionals stigmatise you because of the simple fact you have a diagnosis. They know nothing about what that diagnosis actually means, but it's written down in a medical book, so it must be 'bad', you must be 'ill', and you're probably dangerous to boot, right?

There was a horrible post on here today, not sure if anyone saw it. MN tool it down for being ableist and attacking. people being really nasty to a person for claiming PIP.

Anyway it upset me and I am glad they took it down.

Yes I saw it. Classic case of 'you can't be autistic, because you're nothing like that other autistic person'.

If anyone referred to me as asperger's/aspie because they deem me "high functioning" I would correct them - I wasn't diagnosed with asperger's, I was diagnosed with autism.

I do believe that autism is a disability, but it's complicated. I think the social model of disability is very important. To me it is important to not absolve the NT majority of improving the way they treat autistic people, because it's fucking terrible (have seen some lovely and understanding responses from no -autistic people in this thread though )

*non-autistic people, sorry!

Im autistic but people don’t realise. Even one of the teachers at my sons school made a “he looks like he’s got autism” comment about another child.

should do I do a little “I’m autistic” dance? I probably do. I often hand flap but people just think I’m being a bit Phoebe and cute.

Another woman said I couldn’t be autistic because I wear normal clothes 😂

I'm finding this thread really enlightening, I'm grateful for opportunity to have this discussion and seeing other experiences and views even if we don't agree.

I've never viewed autism as a mh condition although I understand that like other conditions can exist together. Would you prefer autism to go under the mh banner? I personally dont think my childs autism is a mental illness.

I ment as opposed to a medical condition.

I know this is at a tangent, but what does the neuro refer to in neurotypical.

@Grasspigeons

I know this is at a tangent, but what does the neuro refer to in neurotypical.

Neuro means 'brain', as in a typically developed brain.

Neurological, I think. Ie the brain is "normal", "standard", "conventional" or "vanilla". I don't like it but prefer it to normal.

Neurosurgeon, neurotoxin, neurotypical, neurodiverse, neurobiology - neuro just means of the brain and/or nervous system.

Autism is still classed as a neurodevelopmental disorder. Some people would argue with disorder - that's back to the debate about whether autism is a disability/ disabling or whether society disables neurodiverse people who are simply different but not intrinsically disabled.

That does somewhat highlight the difference between different presentations of autism though - some people with autism are averagely or above averagely able cognitively and linguistically but disabled by society because of being expected to behave like people without autism. However other people have severe functional language and cognitive impairment as aspects of their autism - there's still a philosphical argument that society disables them rather than the individuals having a disability but this is then a deneral ableism argument about whether people have disabilities at all (or whether society is the problem) not a question of wwhether autism is a disability.