A few home truths for my adult ds

[Carpathian2]

It's more of a wwyd really.

My eldest son is 35 and single. He is doing OLD and, although he's had a couple of short term relationships, nothing major. His confidence has taken bit of a bashing and he's now wondering if the problem is him.

Thing is, I think it is him. Every conversation I have with him ( we speak a couple of times a week on the phone and I haven't seen him since lockdown) is one sided. He interrupts me, talks over me and as soon as I start talking about me he shuts down, does my head in! I've told him he does this quite a few times but he doesn't take it in. It's quite draining.

Now he's asking me if I think he's doing anything to put people off. I don't want to knock his confidence any more, but he seems to have little self awareness. If I met him and I had a conversation like he has with me I would back off too.

So, my wwyd is: do I gently tell him a few home truths, or leave him to figure it out for himself? I know he's an adult but I just want to see him happy.

It will probably be a good thing for him to hear, because he then has something to work on. He 's already picked up on the fact that it's him, so explaining why should be a positive, it won't be a mystery anymore.

Tell him the trick to getting a girlfriend is too be a good listener, then to ask questions about what the person said.

Lots of people who never stop talking think they are good listeners... Better to be explicit.

Role play - and pull him up every time he does it to you on the phone. You can do it lightly with a small laugh and "you are off again" but if you don't pull him up every time, he won't realise when he's doing it, or as often.

Another vote here for telling him. He’s asked you after all, so he wants to know. It’s best to be honest with him and at least it’s something he can do something about.

I used eat off my mum’s plate, all the nice bits and then off loads my veg on to hers. I was 30.

Wouldn’t have done it to anyone else other than my mum!

I would buy him a copy of ‘how to win friends and influence people’. If he quite rigid it will help him to have a rule based system to follow.

You should tell him but I would also wonder if you had any idea why these relationships had ended?

Although you have noticed this and I'm sure it is unpleasant its something someone would noticed early on, so how have they progressed to being short term relationships? I would also be surprised that if someone had begun a relationship with him and this was their sole reason for dumping, they would have made that quite clear?

There may be something else at play.

But yes, definitely tell him. Maybe he will give you more insight into whats going on as part of this. A phrase my nan always used was something like "love blooms in the sunshine of your attention", this is definitely true.

If you want to be gentle instead of telling him to stop interrupting, tell him to learn to work on his listening skills. Tell him to research how to be a better /good listener. Then he'll be able to pick up the skills he needs from the Internet. This will include not talking over people.

My brother was diagnosed with aspergers in his thirties. His first marriage went down the tubes. His second marriage is to a chinese woman who seems to cope better with his oration.

I would suggest that your DS does have some type of thing like this. It is exhausting. My OH is somewhat on the spectrum but as a family we out vote him. I dread the day when he and I are alone.

My DS has a phrase he uses. Sorry did the middle of my sentence interrupt the beginning of yours. He swears by it.

If you think he won't hear it from you, it can help to get someone else to tell him. My mum used to do this: my teenage self wouldn't hear any advice from her because I'd immediately dismiss it as "nagging", so she got other family members (aunts, grandparents) to talk to me about stuff that really mattered. This strategy worked, I listened then!

Maybe he has said no to marriage and kids and ? What's his views on having a family

You could tell him about the tennis conversation. One person bats a sentence, the other bats an answer. Back and forth.
Remind him to listen without butting in.
He has asked for your advice. This is good. Self aware and all that.

He needs to be told a d I wouldnt be doing it too gently as he could end up missing the point.
I would tell him he us bloody rude for talking over you and if he dies it to his own mum then god knows what he is like with others.
I woukdnt be tip going around this especially as he has asked for advice.

He's 35! Yes, tell him. Get him to google empathetic listening.

It sounds as though he talks 'at' people rather than 'with' them. You can get away with this in a job, especially if you are more senior but definitely not in a relationship.

I'm not sure how you do it but I think it needs to be constructive criticism.

Rather than "You never listen and just talk over me"

Something like "I do sometimes feel that you aren't listening to what I'm saying and that this can lead to the conversation going in the direction you want rather than what I'm trying to discuss with you. When you are getting to know someone, you are more likely to get a positive outcome if you are attentive to what they are actually saying to you."

Have you tried having a conversation and recording it? Tell him first, obviously... the first part will be stilted, but once he forgets the recording is going on and starts talking naturally, he will be normal.

Then you could play it back and point out all the places where he hasn't waited for an answer, or talked over you, or changed the subject back to him... it might bring it home in a practical way just what he's doing.

Although. If he is on the spectrum, it would be good if he pointed this out to prospective dates. It may help them to understand why he behaves this way - ie because he can't help it, not because he just likes the sound of his own voice.

Can you give him the message in terms of "encourage your date to talk, and really listen to what she says. Take an interest in her, without firing a string of questions at her".

Well he has asked.

I'd tell him that one of the most attractive and flattering things anyone can do is listen, really listen, to the other person.

To achieve this, he needs to learn some basic conversational skills. How to ask a question, listen attentively to the answer, then ask follow-up questions that are both relevant and tactful and listen to the answers to those.

Doing that should naturally lead the other person to ask a question back - in due course, once they've taken the opportunity to say their piece. Not immediately and they won't always want a counter-example from his life. Recognising when someone wants to be listened to and when they're engaging in simple back and forth, when they want to vent and when they're seeing advice; this sort of thing is invaluable.

Something I'm trying with my soliloquy-prone 8yo is describing conversation as being a bit like a game of tennis. The ball has to go back and forth at a steady pace. You can't keep it on your side for too long, or the other player will think the game has ended and leave (mentally). There's a natural rythmn.

Another analogy I think has merit is thinking of a conversation as being like a piece of music. There may be fast bits and slow bits but there is a beat and a common style throughout. You need to find a mutually acceptable style and pace; not try to throw a jazz solo into the middle of a pop song, or into a classical concerto.

Ultimately, he has to decide whether he wants to be right (believe himself to be right), or have friends (a girlfriend). Feeling self-righteous while alone is not very rewarding.

To be honest possibly he is just like this with you or maybe his family. You do not really know how he comes across to friends. I think a lot of people have more patience with their friends than their mum's. I wonder how you come across to him? It works both ways.

Instead of being totally negative with him, turn it around and say how he could be more attractive. Ie. Instead of talking about himself, make sure he asks her questions.

I second what a PP said, you should definitely give plus points as well as the (much needed) criticism.

It sounds like he actually wants a relationship and to settle down, and that he's lamenting not having this. So I genuinely feel he would thank you if your advice worked for him. Kind people tend to be able to take things like this on board. And it's better than someone chucking their drink at him on a date and telling him then

Just send him this test

psychcentral.com/quizzes/autism-test/

Omg tell him.

If a first date talk talked over me and didn't listen, there wouldn't be a second one!

Another idea, as he sounds serious about resolving this, is for him to have a few sessions with a relationship counsellor.

They will be able to help him in a number of ways, e.g. unpicking his relationships now and past (any type - not just romantic), thinking about what is different when relationships work well - i.e. are there common features or patterns, helping him gain self awareness - it'll stick better if he works it out for himself. Also, they can 'train' him in listening and conversations skills.