Can we now finally get rid of 'Do they know it's Christmas'?

[Tokenminority]

This song drives me absolutely up the wall. It's patronising, reductive, and it completely harms efforts towards equality.

I understand the focus on equal opportunities and stopping police brutality, but other narratives, such as the pictures painted in the 'Do they know it's Christmas' song, can be just as harmful.

'Africa' is not a country. You did not go on holiday to 'Africa', similarly to how you wouldn't have sent that you went on holiday to 'Europe' when you in fact went to France.

Of course there are major problems surrounding poverty on the African continent, just as there are in other places, but African countries are not only filled with begging, malnourished children who have never seen a Christmas present.

The picture attached is a photograph of Lagos. If I went on the street and asked random people on which continent that photo was taken, would anyone even consider the possibility that it may have been Africa?

This song has never sat right with me, the line "thank god its them, instead of us" has always made me feel sick!!

Dyrne what is your point? Do you think that the poverty that still very much exists in many parts of Africa should be hidden from the rest of the world? You may have noticed the wealth inequality and poverty in the UK, believe me that inequality is on a much larger scale in much of Africa. Yes there are beautiful glossy places but they mostly tell a very small part of the story in those areas.

It raises lots of money for charity which is the only reason I tolerate it and the other versions that came out afterwards.
It is a crass boring Christmas song and I also remember the live aid concert in 1985 receiving a lot of criticism at the time as well.

YANNU.. Christmas is a time of joy in the birth of Jesus. God became one of us. He gave Himself for us and loves more than we can imagine. The celebrities who sang this dirge are famous for their lives of excess yet want to preach a dampner on the holy and happy celebration of Christmas. Dear to Africans and billions more worldwide.

I think you have too much time on your hands! It was a song of its time, like someone else has said, and it has done way more good than bed. But yes, I bloody hate that line 'Thank God Its them instead of you'. x

TabbyMumz ah I see your perspective now. I interpreted that post differently; more as an example of how Africa isn’t just slums and mud huts, and it was a view that was rarely seen in media. I get it’d be frustrating if your experiences got you seeing it more as trying to say there isn’t a problem any more.

I completely agree that we shouldn’t declare “job done!” and deny there’s issues with poverty, inequality and violence in various African countries. As I’ve said, charity and foreign aid still has an important part to play, my point is more about ensuring we don’t deny people their dignity and agency while we help out. (Not suggesting you’ve said this btw, more clarifying my intent on this thread).

@Carriecakes80

I think you have too much time on your hands! It was a song of its time, like someone else has said, and it has done way more good than bed. But yes, I bloody hate that line 'Thank God Its them instead of you'. x

But it wasn't a song of its time. It is being played, updated and used as the background to charity appeals time and time again, as recently as 2014. How does that make it 'a song of its time'?

@The80sweregreat Would it really be that difficult to make a new song or update this version to something less toxic and full of racial stereotypes?

Genuinely confused so asking-what are white People meant to do?
If they don’t understand or say the wrong thing it is ‘white privilege’
If they try to help it’s being a ‘white saviour’ and that is seen as ?patronising
If they say the wrong thing intentionally or unintentionally but it is perceived that way they are racist. It’s actually really really
Confusing.

I think in 1984 even if misguided the people who did this song wanted to help.
What should white people do right now ? What is the right thing to do ?

I like your viewpoint here @tokenminority. It’s a fresh take on it for me. The lyrics are crass and ignorant but highlighted the cause well back in the day. The UK wasn’t as diverse in the early 80’s so I guess we were unintentionally clumsy with how we expressed certain things. Fortunately I think the majority of U.K. citizens have moved forward in our way of thinking!!

Can we also ban “Pretty Woman” for its clear sexist over tones and “when a man loves a women” for excluding all other genders and non- male/female relationships.

Fucking bastards Geldof and Ure trying to help millions of starving kids.

Maybe they should make an updated song!
I don't know. At the time it did raise a lot of money and that must be a good thing but maybe it's time it was pulled and something new in its place to raise more money.
I still believe the idea behind was full of good intentions at the time.

I couldn’t ever understand how Christmas was relevant to the message. Like helping to feed impoverished/less fortunate people is a priority for only one month of the year?

As some people said, the song had good intentions and raised a lot of money. But we need to be more aware of what we say as well as what we do. This song is offensive and it’s not ok.

We just laugh at it really! I’m from an African country. It’s played over Christmas in the stores too! Yeah it patronising but it did allot of good for the continent 🤷🏼‍♀️

Christmas was only relevant because it just happened to be Christmas time when they wrote and recorded it.

NarcissisticUpbringing

What are white people meant to do?

In this instance, I think a very basic requirement for “white charities” is “please do not hand cash directly to the dictator who is contributing to the famine, enabling him to continue perpetuating atrocities on his own people”.

Other than that, it’s not really a big ask to get people thinking about harmful stereotypes; listen to studies and affected people who are directly telling you that what you’re doing is harmful and don’t just dismiss their experiences as “PC gone mad” or thinking they’re only offended because they’ve got nothing better to do.

Look at charities that support and empower locals and focus on grassroots initiatives and sustainable change.

Even the Band Aid Trust nowadays has changed its focus - rather than barrelling in acting as the saviour of all, they now concentrate on funding and grants to boots-on-the-ground charities who have much more knowledge and experience.

I know, why don’t all the “privileged white people” stop sending money, making donations, supporting charities and all the other things they do, when they’re “saving” people in the African nations and the African nations actually look after and care for their own people. ???
You just can’t win as a “privileged white person” who actually does care about people, regardless of their race or colour, and is certainly not racist.
Perhaps we should only care and support our own? Would that make people of colour happy?

To be honest Greeneyedmimx that’s what I do now. I donate to local (our food bank/homeless shelter /hospice) or national charities such as Shelter or specific health charities.

The pictures attached are not from 1984, they are from June 2020. The message is still exactly the same. All children in Africa are starving and Africa is a barren, lost-cause continent which is only being kept afloat by the generosity of Western donations.

Not at all; but given what advertising costs, saying Africa as opposed to listing the 50+ countries in Africa, gets the geographical area in which the money will be spent across. I'm happy to give money to help bring clean water to places without it, if the respective governments don't see that as a priority.

Apart from any moral arguments, (past its sell by date even if it was a way to assist people starving at the time ) it is a bloody awful song in terms of music alone.

I would send it to room 101 happily, along with Slade and all the rest.

And I bloody love Christmas. Before anyone says I am Scrooge in disguise.

We do need more and better black history all year round, as part of our knowledge of the world and the past - and how these things create present scenarios of inequality and instability - for example refugees fleeing war/violence or being recruited as soldiers/deep economic crisis in their homelands.

Also the virtue signalling tea companies can shut it. They have been paying Indian Tea workers a bloody pittance for a long time. Really anti-racist that. Do a quick Google on Radio 4/File On 4.

@Greeneyedminx

I know, why don’t all the “privileged white people” stop sending money, making donations, supporting charities and all the other things they do, when they’re “saving” people in the African nations and the African nations actually look after and care for their own people. ??? You just can’t win as a “privileged white person” who actually does care about people, regardless of their race or colour, and is certainly not racist. Perhaps we should only care and support our own? Would that make people of colour happy?

Well said. I'm certainly never giving to an 'African' charity again. It's all a con.

We also need more positive white history. We can be very glad Columbus arrived in the Ameeicas and not Muslim or Chinese builders of empire. Black conservative speakers need to be heard too. They are informed and giving the lie to the "victim" rhetoric. Thomas Sowell is one example. There are more.

Did you cringe at all the money it made for them?

I though Joss Stone was English?

America we say when we mean the US, America is the whole continent, South and Canada I think too.

“Fucking bastards Geldof and Ure trying to help millions of starving kids.”

ArgumentativeAardvaark, you are right - Bob was and is very much aware of the Ethiopian Coptic Christian churches.