To think JK Rowling is a fabulous human being

[TheAdventuresoftheWishingChair]

I just came across her book, 'Very Good Lives' which is all about overcoming adversity. I think it's so important that successful women talk about the times they've failed and how success is about pushing past that. I'm reading it just at a time I need to hear that message. I can definitely recommend buying a copy if you are in need of a boost or have some pennies to spend on something nourishing.

I was also looking into her charity, Lumos, and I had no idea just how much she was trying to help disadvantaged children. I love that she's putting her money and position to good use.

The term 'national treasure' generally makes me want to poke my own eyeballs out with a rusty kitchen utensil but AIBU to say she is an utter treasure and we are lucky to have her. She makes the world a better place.

That's all!

WikkiTikkiWoo Even thought it is obvious that they would be at HUGE risk by using male toilets?

Going back a bit, what is your evidence that transwomen are at a HUGE risk in male toilets?

There have been numerous incidents where transwomen have abused young girls in female toilets, just google Katie Dolatowski and then go to the young victims abused by KD and tell them that they should welcome transwomen into female only spaces because KD is at such a HUGE risk in the male facilities, go on I am sure they would love you to explain why you prioritise the alleged safety of KD above their right to safety, privacy and dignity.

How many victims would you consider acceptable before maybe having a re-think on which class of humans is the one most at risk?

This transparent attempt to get people to unknowingly or knowingly praise someone who has just now openly stated her anti-trans stance is really gross

So you think it's "really gross" to stand up for women, women's rights, and the lived experience of female bodies?

Not everything that women do or say is about transpeople, you know.

We are allowed to have our LEGAL rights and lived experience. "Sex" is a protected characteristic under the 2010 Equalities Act.

What's gross are the abuse and insults and utter misogynistic woman-hating abusive responses Ms Rowling has received. Simply for saying women menstruate and that gay men and lesbians are same sex attracted.

If you want to talk about "gross" consider the worldwide femicide or actual biological women; consider female genital mutilation; consider the millions of female foetuses aborted because they were female.

That's what's gross.

She's handling herself marvellously.
I'm a bit in love.

Well, I would argue that the individual transman is free to identify and consider themselves as man, but others, such as healthcare professionals, may continue to classify them as women/female persons, for example when it comes to deciding whether or not they need a prostate examination.
This isn't to say that we can't be respectful and use transmen's preferred pronouns, first names, allow them to present however they please, wear whatever clothes they wish to wear, thus recognising their desire to be perceived as transmen.
But biologically speaking, they are still of the female sex, and this will have consequences in terms of healthcare, contraception, etc.
I think people should also be free to discuss biological functions such as menstruation in a clear and factual manner.

@LemonadeAndDaisyChains

I know it wasn't addressed to me, but...

Back to the issue: the original point of this thread

and that only women can menstruate

The problem with what was said would be this bit - It is kind of dismissive of trans men, they're allowed to be seen as men so why refuse to recognise them?
In a no you're not, you're a woman way?
It's very black and white, rigid thinking.

We can recognise them as transmen. The fact is, they are still biologically female and always will be, even after they stop menstruating. That may be upsetting for them, but it doesn't mean that other people should be compelled to pretend that 'some men menstruate' or 'not everyone who menstruates is a woman', or stop using the word woman to describe women.

I love her and I love that she's standing up for woman.

*Women

The problem with what was said would be this bit - It is kind of dismissive of trans men, they're allowed to be seen as men so why refuse to recognise them?

Women don't want the word woman to include males. It's not theirs to just take. It's appropriation.

That's it. Why is that so hard for you to understand.

Care to expand on why you feel you have access to both, merrymouse? Or have I misunderstood?

Not both - female facilities and mixed sex facilities like family changing rooms.

I just don't often go to places where there are female loos - I work in an office with one toilet, the cafes and restaurants I visit only have one or two toilets, I hardly ever go clothes shopping and when I go to the gym/pool I use the family facilities.

That doesn't mean that there isn't a need for sex specific toilets and changing rooms.

*The problem with what was said would be this bit - It is kind of dismissive of trans men, they're allowed to be seen as men so why refuse to recognise them?

There is a solution. Why not say women, transmen and non binary? Why take away the word woman and use the dehumanising 'menstruator'? I don't identify as a menstruator or a cervix-haver.

Also, perhaps we can use 'female'? But the whole point is that to use male and female seems to be 'denying existence' of transpeople.

So what is your solution using words that are common parlance that everyone understands?

What I very very strongly believe though is it is possible to keep women safe, and keep trans women safe

The danger to them all, the common denominator, is men.

Ask men to sort it out - without endangering women or trashing their privacy

Thank you @TheAdventuresoftheWishingChair for posting this on the AIBU board. It makes for a lively conversation.

@merrymouse

My point was how does anyone know whether they are sharing what ever

I'm not even sure what you mean by 'butch woman'. If you mean 'woman who looks like a lesbian'... well she clearly looks like a woman.

I meant women who look like a man. I thought that would be quite obvious in the context of this discussion!!!

What do lesbians look like?!

[quote BlueBlazerBlack]@WikkiTikkiWoo I feel that you are trying to derail this discussion now with all this talk of toilets. That really is not the point of this thread.

Back to the issue: the original point of this thread was whether it was transphobic of J.K. to say that biological sex exists, and that only women can menstruate. What are your thoughts on that, please?[/quote]
I believe I did share my thoughts. Many. Many pages ago!!

My thoughts are that JK Rowling is not transphobic. She is anti misogyny. Which is what I think the removal of being able to comfortably use the word women is. Not a trans thing. A Misogyny thing.

If you want to talk about "gross" consider the worldwide femicide or actual biological women; consider female genital mutilation; consider the millions of female foetuses aborted because they were female.

Yes, I only have to think of the mass graves of the female babies that have been found recently to understand that SEX MATTERS. And frankly it sickens me to think that those who are willing to welcome in males to the word woman or to deny that sex actually exists because it might hurt someone's feelings - these babies did not die because someone could change sex or that adopting the gender identity of a male is reality. They died because they were female.

Oh, and for those still saying 'be kind' and inclusive. Why not look at the women standing up for FGM who are hounded because they are also being phobic and excluding males.

Do you also believe they the activists who are taking away the language of FGM victims are righteous and brave?

Or do you just want to pick and choose....

LemonadeAndDaisyChains

It takes nothing away from me to make language more inclusive.

It does not make anything let alone language more inclusive, it is dehumanising and demeaning and I will not ever submit nor consent to dehumanising language relegating me to a biological function based on the sex I was born.

If transmen are so upset and disturbed by the phrase only women menstruate then I assume they are also equally disturbed and upset by only men have a prostate, only men have testicles^, are they demanding that men should be described in dehumanising language related to their biology or biological functions, and if not, why not?

I never paid attention to JK, although, my oldest thought she was amazing. Then he told me that she was being given a hard time on Twitter and he now understood why I was so passionate about protecting women and female spaces. (He used to say I was overreacting about women losing their rights)

I went on twatter to see what the fuss was and ended up being blown away by this strong, intelligent woman, that takes no shit. She opened my oldest’s eyes to the abuse that women suffer, because this wasn’t ‘just‘ his middle aged mum talking, (Easy to dismiss a parent) but one of his favourite writers, so I will be forever grateful to her for that.

She is fucking brilliant and I just laugh at the accusations of transphobia being thrown at her, because she recognises reality and centres actual women.

Also, I'd be interested in knowing if any transwomen are currently activists for female infanticide? Anyone? ....

The problem with what was said would be this bit - It is kind of dismissive of trans men, they're allowed to be seen as men so why refuse to recognise them?
In a no you're not, you're a woman way?
It's very black and white, rigid thinking.

In a civilised society it is generally accepted that we can show polite respect for other people's beliefs and still have the right to voice our disagreement.

I don't spend Sundays at the local Church shouting at the parishioners because I don't believe in God. I am allowed to express the belief that God doesn't exist.

Similarly, I would politely use somebody's preferred pronouns, but reserve the right to use clear language when my rights are threatened by a change in the law that removes sex based rights.

@Winesalot

If you want to talk about "gross" consider the worldwide femicide or actual biological women; consider female genital mutilation; consider the millions of female foetuses aborted because they were female.

Yes, I only have to think of the mass graves of the female babies that have been found recently to understand that SEX MATTERS. And frankly it sickens me to think that those who are willing to welcome in males to the word woman or to deny that sex actually exists because it might hurt someone's feelings - these babies did not die because someone could change sex or that adopting the gender identity of a male is reality. They died because they were female.

Oh, and for those still saying 'be kind' and inclusive. Why not look at the women standing up for FGM who are hounded because they are also being phobic and excluding males.

Do you also believe they the activists who are taking away the language of FGM victims are righteous and brave?

Or do you just want to pick and choose....

You, obviously as this is an anonymous site, don't know me.

But, for some very personal reasons, I am involved in work around FGM.

The two are not mutually exclusive.

Do you, for instance, know that the majority of the time it is women that carry out the act of FGM?

I meant women who look like a man.

Because it's normal for women to wear exactly the same clothes that men wear, it is quite difficult for a woman to look like a man without taking hormones, and even then you can't do much about height and bone structure.

What do lesbians look like?!

I was assuming that because you were using the word 'butch' you were talking about 'butch' lesbians, but they don't look like men.

Do you, for instance, know that the majority of the time it is women that carry out the act of FGM?

And your point is?

She’s a fabulous, principled woman. What a role model.

@merrymouse

Do you, for instance, know that the majority of the time it is women that carry out the act of FGM?

And your point is?

Presumably to bring up the trope that women are baddies too, makes a change from the usual homophobic slur used about lesbians in female spaces.

Always been a huge fan, she most certainly is a national treasure.