AIBU - 'Karen' is about class, why are people so class-blind?

[Beancounter1]

AIBU to hate the way people confuse racism and sexism with class prejudice? To my mind, the use of the insult 'Karen', especially popular in the USA, doesn't just mean a middle-aged white woman who is arrogant, self-righteous, self absorbed, complaining, trouble-making, full-of-herself, etc. etc.
It means a middle or upper class woman with these characteristics. You won't see a working class 'Karen'. The stereotypical 'Karen' behaves as she does because she is on a power trip. Her social class advantage has gone to her head. That is why she complains in restaurants and is rude to shop assistants.
Why are people so blind to class prejudice? Why is the world so often seen only through the lens of race or sex? Is it because the powers-that-be (the 'elite') have a vested interest in deflecting and forestalling any class-based collective action or class consciousness? We are not encouraged to talk or think about class, but it is as significant as ever.

@Beancounter1
it means a middle or upper class woman with these characteristics. You won't see a working class 'Karen'.
It means the complete opposite. Karen is a chavy slag with many children by many different fathers
This comment by you demonstrates that you don't have a clue about the British class system.
Just find a middle or upper class female with the name Karen.

I mean, if you can’t just have a chuckle to yourself over a pertinent meme, especially in these shitty, dark tones, then dear god you need to relax and lighten up.

Why do we need to dissect every single thing and hunt for the offence - or better, multi level offence - to be taken from the merest thing.

It’s a picture with words on it that someone on the internet created 20 years ago.

Thanks to posters who mentioned ageism - I was missing that. I don't think there are any hot-looking 20-something 'Karens'. But then in today's world it is a rare 20-something that has any of the kind of social status or power we have been talking about.

I just thought it meant an unreasonable customer. I've only ever seen it used for those women who demand to speak to the manager because they're not getting the answer they want to hear. Perhaps it's evolving.

'Karen from Facebook who runs an amazing herbal therapy business from her home and therefore must be as medically well informed as any world renowned virologist said...' was the first time I picked up on the anti Karen theme in the current pandemic situation.

In the UK Karen is in with Sharon and Tracy as lower middle class or working class girls names.

if the term is not mostly about race or class, it must be mostly sexism?

Or, it's about a particular kind of entitled attitude that isn't actually to do with race, class or sex?

It is, though. It's the entitlement of a particular kind of white woman, especially in the face of any kind of perceived black threat. And I'm afraid that can happen whatever class the woman comes from.

I don't really understand, OP, why you're so determined to translate this American meme into UK culture?

It's my name but I'm not personally offended by it. I'm offended on behalf of all middle aged women, because that's what Karen means. It means female and born in the 60s or 70s. Pamela, Debbie, Sarah, Louise, Amanda, Jennifer, step on up. Its all of us. We've reached an age where our people pleasing days are over. So instead of accepting crap service we say no, that's not what the menu says or whatever. But what could be even worse than a woman who is no longer deemed fuckable?
A woman deemed unfuckable who talks too much. Insert the usual words - pushy, assertive, bossy. Ask when you last heard those words to describe a man.

It's a sexist piece of crap, whichever way you cut it. And of course you prove what a Karen you are if you object to it, because (lol! This is so funny!) that's what Karen's do! So you can't win.

I've been called worse than Karen. Cunt, for instance. But sexist, woman blaming language always gets a hard no from me.

Wait, you think this is about actual people with the name Karen?

Oooooo kay.

Have you never seen Scumbag Steve

I have literally never heard this before

@Beancounter1 you are trolling now.

Plenty of hot young Karens in the world. Both literally and figuratively. Plenty of young women with status and influence.

phoebesphalange

It's offensive if it's your name.

MorrisZapp has nailed it.

@MagicKingdomDizzy is it though?

Does the USA even have a class system?

In the 1950s in the UK Karen was a fairly middle class name. It declassified and in its 1960s and 70s heyday it was lower middle class/ working class. I do think the memes are predominantly ageist. First it was Susan, now Karen, next it will be Emma and eventually someone will be taking the piss out of Ava and Olivia. Older women tend to get too big for their boots and need to be put in their place ( both by men and younger women from what I can see).

I've lost what you're after here, OP . You cant dilute racism with karenism. There's enough real racism without looking to make karenism into an upper class racism issue when it's not. Fight karenism. Fight racism. But this is getting a bit silly now.

I wish the people on here who get up in arms about the term Karen (which I don't personally use but is invariably punching up, not down) would take half the energy they expend bemoaning it and use it to fight some actual oppression.

MorrisZapp

Good point, well made.

Although Brian is the non attractive equivalent. Possibly creepy or pervy. Women don’t really have those labels.

MorrisZapp

You're so much more articulate than me. Both on here and the thread where it was thrown as an insult (which is STILL standing thanks a lot Mumsnet HQ).

Thanks for saying what I was trying to and failing to.

phoebesphalange

It is my name yes.

Does the USA even have a class system?

From what I can tell, the USA is split into three categories.
The Poor - 40%
The Wealthy (who think The Poor are poor because they've not tried hard enough) - 40%
The Others - 20%

I agree with MorrisZapp - it's not my name, but as a 70s child, it's a name of my era. There were plenty of Karens at my school. Like many things on the internet, Karen memes are irritating crap.

My favourite Karen

Institutkarite - I know all about the UK class system. I am English lower middle class, from a family that has been downwardly mobile over several generations in the female line, and with a working class husband, and upwardly mobile father. I am also very interested in Marxist-Leninist economic theory.
I think you misunderstand that the US meme has nothing to do with the demographics of the actual name Karen in the UK.

bridgetreilly - I'm not primarily concerned with translating the term, but it has to be done if the conversation includes people on both sides of the Atlantic, as we have seen it has very different meanings.
I am mainly interested in how class intersects with other 'isms' and is so often overlooked or not discussed.

Yeah, I’m a 70s child too with a 70s name.

I’m not going to get offended by a character name.