MNHQ here - should we support the campaign to end ‘rough sex’ defences?

[JustineMumsnet]

Hello

As lots of you will already know because their campaign originated on Mumsnet, the group We Can’t Consent To This has been running a campaign to end ‘rough sex’ defences - and we’d like to know what you think about MNHQ signing up as a supporter of their
campaign.

Their aim is to end a situation in which defendants can claim that the death of or injury to a woman was caused by ‘consensual sex games gone wrong’.

They say:

‘We’ve now found 60 UK women who’ve been killed by men who claim a sex game gone wrong - and in the last 5 years the defence was successful in 7 of the 17 killings of a woman which reached trial, with the man being found not guilty or receiving a manslaughter conviction. We've found many more women injured in what the accused men claim was consensual sexual violence.
Yet more women tell us it’s now commonplace to be assaulted and abused by men they’re dating, with 38% of UK women under 40 reporting being assaulted - choked, slapped, gagged or spat on - in otherwise consensual sex. That equates to 3.6 million women under 40 in the UK who have experienced unbidden violence in sex - and we know that women over 40 experience this too.
We do not believe that women can consent to their grievous injury or death, and will campaign until claiming this is no longer a useful defence.’
We Can’t Consent To This is currently lobbying to tackle these ‘rough sex defences’ by adding amendements to the Domestic Abuse Bill that is going through Parliament, meaning that now is the time to get writing to MPs to encourage them to support the changes.

We'd love to get behind this campaign but as ever we said we’d ask you what you thought - so please let us know by adding your thoughts here or voting YANBU for ‘Yes please I’d like Mumsnet to support this campaign’ and YABU for ‘No, I don’t think Mumsnet should support this campaign’. (Apologies for using the AIBU metric for this but it’s the best way we have at the moment to get a snapshot survey of people who’ve read the OP.)

Big thanks

Yes. Yes. Yes. A thousand times yes.

As a mainstream defence it's not acceptable, however what about for the minority where an genuine accident had occurred? Lots of people do consensually enter into potentially dangerous sex practices, fully informed of what the potential consequences might be.
At what point do we draw the line in policing what people do in their own homes with their partners?

Yes, yanbu, please support this.

Bravo, Mumsnet - absolutely support you doing this. Just the kind of thing I would love you to throw your significant weight and influence behind.

Yes x 1000000 mumsnet. You absolutely should be standing up for the safety of women.

Of course, why wouldn't you?

Please do.

Yes.

Yes please

Yes

Yes

Raspberryk No-one's policing what people can consent to, or interested in what they get up to in their own homes.

Consenting partners in risky games might want to think through how things might be interpreted if one of them accidentally died. I don't think it would be that hard to create their own evidence trail (i.e. not just one, possibly coercively signed, statement but wider evidence of their lifestyle choices and habits).

Duh, yes! this is something you should be supporting. Surprised you are asking

Yes.

As a mainstream defence it's not acceptable, however what about for the minority where an genuine accident had occurred? Lots of people do consensually enter into potentially dangerous sex practices, fully informed of what the potential consequences might be.

If you want to put the life of your sexual partner at risk and it goes wrong, you will be a murderer and go to prison for a long, long time.

Maybe people should find other, kinder ways of getting their kicks.

raspberryk

As a mainstream defence it's not acceptable, however what about for the minority where an genuine accident had occurred? Lots of people do consensually enter into potentially dangerous sex practices, fully informed of what the potential consequences might be.

I guess it’s just tough luck. If I drink drive and kill someone, I expect to be prosecuted for death by dangerous driving. The fact that I didn’t intend to do it won’t get me off the hook. Participants of very risky violent sex will risk injury/death on one side and prosecution on the other side.

Absolutely Mumsnet should be supporting this.

Yes, please do!

Yes, absolutely

This is the easiest YANBU ever. The normalisation of humiliating, degrading, violent and abusive behaviour will only get worse because of increased access to extreme porn on the internet by children, young people and men. Women and girls should not feel this is what they are expected to endure. Boys and men should not feel this is how they should or can behave. It's time to end the legalised harm and murder of women. I'd like to see Mumsnet throw all its weight behind this campaign.

Yes!

Absolutely

Yes.
There's altogether too much acceptance of violence. As Babdoc said:
"it is beyond shocking that 38% of young women have experienced violent abuse during sex. Porn culture has “normalised” the vile mistreatment of women by men, and although your campaign is a great start, we need to do far more to educate our young people, and empower young women, to stamp out these appalling attitudes."
My DS has told me that a girlfriend at uni was surprised (also relieved) that he didn't expect porn-influenced sex. How normalised is that? she didn't like or want it,but expected to be pressured into it. He was horrified, and so am i.

Yes. Absolutely

100% yes, back this.
YANBU

(How do I vote from my phone?)