To think this OW has no shame?

[LividLucy]

Dsis’s XH had a 4 year affair which she discovered around 10 years ago. They’d been married over 20 years by then. OW knew he was married with 4DC throughout it all. They even went on regular holidays abroad together passed off as business trips.

Dsis was devastated when she discovered it quite by accident and he immediately left for OW. Dsis was completely shafted by him as he hid quite substantial assets and had already moved their house into his business name so she was left with nothing, had to move into a rundown rented house and work in a minimum wage job while her H and OW have lived a life of luxury with a big house, big cars and lots of holidays. Dsis had been a SAHM but had also helped him get his business off the ground. She had a crap solicitor and refused family help to bring in the big guns as she still loved him and hoped they’d get back together. I think she was still in shock for a long time.

Anyway oldest DC went completely off the rails when the affair came out. Blamed Dsis as she was very passive and wouldn’t hear a bad word against XH so all the DC took it out on her. DN got pregnant within a few months at age 16 and has since had 3DC by 3 different fathers obviously trying to recreate the family her Dad destroyed but picking unsuitable men!

Dsis always encouraged XH to have contact with the DC and he would lavish expensive gifts while not paying child support knowing they were living in a shithole, so the DC are still quite close to him and OW.

OW constantly refers to her ‘grandchildren’ on Facebook and Instagram now which upsets Dsis greatly. Even though 10 years have passed, is this really appropriate? How can Dsis broach this with DN and EX/OW and would she be UR to?

It will be like a switch and suddenly he and his wife won’t be welcome any more

You cannot possibly say that with any certainty.

This will probably be an unpopular opinion but I dont think this has anything to do with you. I have been in a similar position from DNs point of view. My DF had an affair and eventually married the OW and had more children. They had moved everything into OWs name and afterwards all houses and assets were bought in her name. We did not receive a penny.

Before I start I just want to say, In this situation I think the DF & OW are disgusting. Just to make that clear. Nothing makes lying and cheating ok, especially when children are involved.

However this is about your DNs relationship with her dad and stepmum. You dont know what kind of father or stepmum they have been. You mention the lavish gifts but you dont mention the emotional support they may have given. They may massivly regret the way they went about things and have come to a head with the children where they all feel resolution has been achieved.

Your DSis had the choice of how to behave when he left. But from what you wrote she did not fully fight to secure her childrens lifestyle. She shouldnt have to fight, however she was put in that position by them and chose not to. You do not know what environment those children grew up in. From what you have said she put her feelings for ex (and later her biterness towards OW) above her children. Having been in a similar position as them, I imagine thats why they are angry with her. I understand she was in shock but she can still control her actions, just as exH chose his.

Their relationship with OW has clearly been worked on and is ok, or Im assuming she wouldnt be "grandma". That is their choice. Unless you have expressly spoken to the DC about how they feel about their upbringings, you do not know how they feel or where their anger lies. Maybe start there?

If they feel she is grandma, then she is grandma. Thats their right as parents. Its a word and doesnt mean anything. My children dont even call their grandparents "grandma", they use different words (think Gangan). Its a word and a sign of affection that clearly your DN thinks she deserves. If it hurts your sister she should bring it up with them directly, as thats her right to. But at the end of the day if she didnt listen to them and was passive and wouldnt hear a bad word said about DH (when they were grieving and hurting and probably wanting to rant) then I wouldnt blame them for not listening to her now.

For the record since I turned 21 and no longer had to, I dont see DF or SM (my own choice). He is lazy and couldnt care less about me and to be fair I actually quite liked SM. She made a stupid choice 30 years ago to enter into things the way she did but actually grew into a decent person and had a lot of time for me growing up. Never pushed herself on me and never ever said a bad word about anyone. and I dont particularly like DM. Not because of what DF did but because of her behaviour afterwards and how it made me feel. She cared only about herself and I was second best. She still harbours massive resentment towards ExH & OW and their names cant be spoken in front of her without her storming off, 30 years later. It was like this every weekend I returned from their house and she made my life hell. I quickly learnt to put people in compartments and not to let them crossover. DFs house was actually more emotionally calm than "home". I felt I had to hide my "new" clothes and belongings DF bought me and not speak of the lovely holidays in front of DM. Which wasnt my fault at all. He was a shit husband and a shit dad overall. However from what I see of how he treats both my siblings & half siblings children, hes a good grandad. My children have never been introduced to him.

My mum is 30+ years into hating my stepmum. I've no idea if she was an OW, but the bitterness has destroyed the relationship I have with her as she cannot help but bemoan everything about my dad and my stepmum. Every single family event or occasion is marred with spite and venom.

I get it. I do. But it's been 30 years. My parents were married less than half that time. Move on.

@wheretonow123

I think you should write him and her a letter telling them what you think of them and her posing as a granny and how inappropriate it is.

It is then up to them to either take it on board or ignore it.

At least you will have made your position clear and demonstrate that they have not got away with it with some people anyway.

I am sure that you dont care what they think of you so you can write what you feel and sign it.

What an excellent way to cause harm to the niece.

Why on earth would people meddle in grown adults affairs like this? Talk about controlling.

This whole thing feels like an exercise in control

Karma is wonderful, hope they lose the lost in the coming recession.

It's sad for Dsis, but mourning the past isn't doing her any good. She's starting to look like a whiny downer - getting divorced isn't headline news.

She needs to like herself enough to move on.

Tbf, I'd be far more critical of the ex-H and the children (attitudes towards their mother) than the OW.

Your poor sister. And niece.

But a decade on it is possible to no longer give a tiny shit about him or his 2nd wife.

It’s perfectly reasonable for a stepmother to love her stepDC and stepGDC. It’s fine for her to post pictures of her stepGDC with their mother’s permission. Your sister shouldn’t be snooping and maybe she wouldn’t see things she doesn’t like. The other stuff you mentioned is irrelevant to the issue of whether it’s ok for a step-Gran to love her stepGDC.

I’m with you op. I have never understood how a woman can do that to another woman, especially one who has children with the husband. It’s heartbreaking to hear about your sister & I hope she manages to find Some peace & happiness for herself.

Your sister was so passive that that helped put her where she is today.

She should have been stronger for the kids and told them the truth. The kids would be closer to her then and there would be none of the ow grandkids nonsense.

She should have had the money traced and made sure she got her fair share, all so bloody passive. She has left it too late to change anything now and needs to move on.

Are you sure you are not the Dsis OP?
Only there used to be a fairly prolific poster who was full of bitterness about the "OW" living the life she (the OP) felt she should have had, even though the exDH had married the "OW" many years ago.......
If not I am sorry, but it all sounded eerily similar in content and tone.

I have never understood how a woman can do that to another woman

What about one spouse to another. She can’t forgive the ow, but Apparently wanted her ex back? And ten years on she’s still not moved on? And her sister is encouraging her?

If the kids blamed the mother I’m sure there is more to it than “she was passive” and it’s very wrong to say the niece had three kids because she was looking for a father figure. From what I can see she’s had a father figure throughout.

Op stop encouraging your sister. You do her no favours. It’s been ten years. Take heed of the responses, and start to gently tell her that it shouldn’t and doesn’t matter, all that matters is they have a good relationship with the kids and it’s time for her to move on.

Telling her she’s right is just adding to her pain.

Nobody but the children's parents get to choose who does/doesn't get the title Granny. Nobody but the child's parents get to dictate the role a Grandparents spouse plays.

I think it's ridiculous that anyone feels that the name "Granny" would be devalued or undermined in some way if it were used by another person who also loved their grandchild.

My 14 year old sends Ex's DW a Mothers Day card every year and tells me she's like his Mum when I can't be there. I could be shitty and feel pushed out or I can smile and feel thankful that another human being has chosen to love my son to the point he's comfortable saying that to me. I choose the latter and anyone who feels their role is lessened by the addition of another person's love to a child is forgetting that the child should come before everyone else in that situation.

I really feel for your DS but she absolutely needs to rebuild her own life, focus on her own achievements and hobbies and surround herself with good people. She needs to be active and not just bounced around on the crest of somebody else's wave - she needs to be riding her own wave. It is utterly shite that he left her with so little, and much as I sympathise, I doubt there can be anything done about it now.
Women reading this should take heed and never let the husband have all the power in a marriage, no matter how long it is, how many kids, how many sacrifices have been made to raise children etc. Marriages can end and people behave despicably when you never thought it possible.

Diss needs to move on now , seems the OW /Wife is embracing the children, much better than not giving a shit about them.

Unless you absolutely know otherwise, it's likely that she's posting pictures of her "grandchildren" on SM as a natural outgrowth of her relationship with them. She likely does think of them as, treat them as, and refer to them as her grandchildren. They may call her some version of Grandmother. It's not some elaborate performance made up for her followers or to annoy your sister or anyone else. She may have discussed with the mother and grandfather and decided together that she'd be "Grandmother", or whatever. At the very least, it sounds like your niece knows about it and either is happy with it or has decided not to rock the boat.

Even if there were some way your sister could convince her to stop calling herself grandmother or your niece to ask her to stop, the ones who would be hurt (and confused) most by this are the actual children. Anyway, it's quite usual for children to have more than one grandmother - they presumably each have another grandmother through their fathers, as well. There's nothing to stop your sister from trying to build a better relationship with your niece and her children (and the other DC, if necessary) but it has to be based on an acknowledgement of how things are now. I wouldn't expect her to have any sympathy or contact with the ex and his (wife? gf?), but she has to accept that her children have the right to decide on what kind of relationship they want with their dad and his partner.

Karma is wonderful, hope they lose the lost in the coming recession

If you feel this bitterly after a decade, you need help. I don't even mean that as insult, I mean it sincerely.

I think you should write him and her a letter telling them what you think of them and her posing as a granny and how inappropriate it is.

Please don’t. You’ll just look undignified and unhinged. I wasn’t the OW but if my DHs ex sent me anything like this, we’d just laugh.

Of course it's a shit situation, the ex-H is a piece of shit, and the 'OW' is not very nice either. BUT. It has been 10 years since the separation. 'OW' has been with ex-H for 10 years (not including the affair years). Your Dsis and you need to move on - you really should have moved on years ago. Of course it's difficult to do! The pain, the unfairness, the injustice, it's all so infuriating. But such is separation from a shit-head of an ex. You and your Dsis need to ignore everything about ex-H and his new partner. You certainly have no right to control what she calls her stepchildren's children - they are indeed her grandchildren.

You'll all feel better once you totally ignore those two horrible people.

Oh i cant cope with all these abbreviations! My head hurts!

Obviously your dsis has had a shit time and the dc too and yes the ex is a twat .
But you and your dsis are directing the anger for exdh onto ow who is now actually his partner .10 years is a long time it is time to move on and not worry about people like that .
I'm not sure why you think it would occur to ow how she's behaving if she's willing to break up a family and get together with a married man that she would think that calling herself GM and posting pictures would upset your dsis.
As much as it hurts the dc and dgc are part of her family now , but of course your dsis is the dgm but it's not a competition.
Karma will get them when all said and done but please encourage your dsis to move on .

@Purleaseee

Karma is wonderful, hope they lose the lost in the coming recession

If you feel this bitterly after a decade, you need help. I don't even mean that as insult, I mean it sincerely.

Agree 100%

@SporadicNamechange You could be talking about my own mother...exactly the same time period, 30 years...my father has now been married to the OW for 7 years longer than he was married to my mother.

My mother also still complains about her divorce settlement - she got all the equity there was in the house at the time (late 80s, they'd only had the house 4 years so there wasn't much). My father hadn't wanted to buy a house in the first place so she was lucky to get anything - they both used to spend money as soon as it came in so there were no pensions, no savings etc. Also brings up my father in disparaging terms randomly which has also definitely affected both mine and my two brother's relationship with her.

My mother also stalks the OW's social media (my father doesn't use it) just to bitch about everything she posts. My mother is 80 next year and has done NOTHING to 30 years to improve her life....she prefers to be the professional victim and wants everyone to feel sorry for her. This attitude has lost her most of her friendships and family.

That is just so sad @theprincessmittens. What a waste of 30 years.

FIL and his wife have been married longer than MIL and FIL were. MIL chose to move hundreds of miles with the kids when they split (to be closer to family). FIL had to relocate so he could have contact EOW. FIL bought her a house. He wanted to buy a bigger one, but she was being a martyr and refused (and has complained about the tiny, inadequate house she chose as if it were FIL’s fault ever since). It was actually a mesher order in the divorce, and FIL was entitled to some equity when the kids grew up. But he just signed it all over to MIL once the mortgage was finished (which he’d paid). DH found this all out by accident fairly recently; he’d previously only heard his mum’s version of events. His dad didn’t even try to counteract his mum’s rubbish.

She has got spousal and child maintenance in the settlement, but lied to the kids about it and claimed they were being starved of funds. She alienated the two younger kids and tried with DH (but didn’t succeed). Now she’s resentful and quite horrible about the fact he has a relationship with his father.

MIL never wanted to get a decent job, or do anything with her life. So she’s now got no pension or anything an a very low paid PT job. She had childcare available from her parents, and lots of family support (DH’s nana is just the loveliest woman ever, and so kind and helpful). It’s apparently still FIL’s fault that she never made anything if her life, even 30 years later.

Honestly, MIL could have just moved on and stopped playing the martyr and had a brilliant life. She’s actually remarried and divorced during those 30 years but still never moved on (which, as you can imagine, probably contributed to that second divorce). It’s really sad.

Obviously FIL hasn’t behaved brilliantly in his life. An affair, leaving his wife and 3 kids, he’s cheated on his second wife several times as far as DH knows. DH is aware that his father is very seriously flawed. But he manages to have a positive relationship with him, and that’s been important for him.

The OP’s sister does not want to end up like my MIL or your mum. No matter what an example does, you shouldn’t let anger and resentment ruin the rest of your life. Moving on and making yourself happy is the best revenge - not least because it’s not at all about getting revenge, and takes any power away from your ex.