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Original poster

Confederate Flag Flying

215 replies

PineapplePrincess · 26/05/2020 21:19

Neighbour has started flying a Confederate flag today.

We are a mixed raced family, and I’m feeling a little unsettled by this. They are generally nice people, although we don’t tend to spend much time in their company. They perhaps don’t understand the impact flying the flag would have.

Don’t think I would say anything (altho’ DH May feel differently). But is it unreasonable to feel slightly offended?

OP posts:
atilathehut · 29/05/2020 18:43

Anyway back to the post - she is being unreasonable not taking it down now you have told her - and if it's frosty so what? If someone told me what the issue was with the flag and I didn't know I would take it down immediately. She is being extremely unreasonable

WhoWants2Know · 29/05/2020 18:44

I'd struggle not to lose it and set fire to the thing. As an American, that's a hugely inflammatory thing to display. They might as well run a noose up the flagpole.

Winterlife · 29/05/2020 18:45

@user1473878824, virtually every member of the Ukrainian government (and most FSU governments, excluding some of the Baltic republics), is a former member of the CPSU. The mindset is Bolshevik. I could provide hundreds of examples to prove this, but this isn’t the thread for this. You did prove my point, though, about ignorance on the issue, which is why I don’t get upset about people using Soviet symbols.

WhoWants2Know · 29/05/2020 18:47

And for those who say they have them for other reasons- would a nice white hood be ok for other reasons too?

If you fly the same flag as the Klan, you've placed yourself under their umbrella, metal head or not.

NearlyGranny · 29/05/2020 18:48

I would be sorely tempted to set fire to it, and I'm white. There's something seriously wrong here. It's racism or ignorance or a toxic combination of both, I reckon.

SenecaFallsRedux · 29/05/2020 18:55

I looked this up after this post - less than 50 percent of Americans think it has negative connotations so it's quite reasonable that Brits don't know.

Sorry, but this is a bit of logical sleight of hand. There are very few Americans who do not know its connotations. There are very few Americans who do not know that African Americans find it deeply offensive. There are however, sadly, quite a few who do not find racist connotations negative.

NearlyGranny · 29/05/2020 18:57

When the Aumaud Arbery video came out, the only thing I thought was missing was the confederate flag flying from the back of the truck.

FrippEnos · 29/05/2020 19:05

NearlyGranny
I would be sorely tempted to set fire to it,

The the person breaking the law would be you.

Kokapetl · 29/05/2020 19:16

Unless they have planning permission to fly it, this is also illegal.

Not RTFT so sorry if this has been said (wouldn't be surprised).

FrippEnos · 29/05/2020 19:21

Kokapetl

Only if the flag pole is over 4.6 mtrs height.

Lordfrontpaw · 29/05/2020 19:23

What if it’s on the roof or above the door? (Curious).

FrippEnos · 29/05/2020 19:31

Flying a flag on a flagpole projecting from any part of a building other than
the roof (eg projecting from the side of the building)
• Only one flag on a projecting flagpole on a building is permitted
• The flag may not exceed 2 square metres in size
• No restrictions on the size of characters
• Consent is required if the flagpole is in a controlled area
• It is permitted to fly one flag on a vertical flagpole on the roof of a building and one
flag within the grounds of the building without consent (subject to restrictions
below). However it is not permitted to fly a flag on a vertical flagpole on the roof and
a projecting flagpole without consent.

atilathehut · 29/05/2020 19:33

Ok Seneca point taken but we are not American. We don't have the same history and don't necessarily understand the issues with the flag - so it's not unreasonable that a Brit doesn't understand but it is unreasonable that once it's been pointed out she doesn't take it down. I would hope she was just a bit embarrassed and she will remove it after it has been pointed out

Glowcat · 29/05/2020 19:39

It’s very odd to be flying a flag at home outside unless there’s an international football tournament on in England.

user1471565182 · 29/05/2020 20:53

My dissertation was on the soviet union Winterlife

Most politicians are ex communist in that part of the world because that was the only way they could get into politics. doesnt stop them being right wing, capitalist or whatever else very much not communist There is no continuity with the bolsheviks. Bolshevism was a very specific niche of marxism and they changed the name to 'The Communist Party' in 1952

Ukraine is already on its 4th different government since the 2014 revolution, current prime minster never a communist, Zelensky-never a communist. Simply isnt comparable.

Winterlife · 29/05/2020 21:08

I did an MA on Soviet studies, and lived there. I would say that unless you speak the languages fluently and lived in the USSR, you don't truly understand it.

The current PM graduated from L'viv Polytechnic. He enrolled before the collapse. That was impossible, particularly in Western Ukraine, before the collapse, unless one was a member of the CPSU.

Zelensky comes from a family of nomenklatura.

Being a member of the CPSU was the only way to serve in government in Soviet times. Not so after the collapse. My point is, virtually everyone now in power is from that same power structure, and still doing many of the same things - silencing opponents by force, killing (for money now, rather than power), imposing language laws contrary to the will of the majority of the population. I could go on.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2020 21:14

Winterlife

Will they be dragged to a grisly death behind a car by a racist gang?

Will their young child be shot dead by cops for playing with a toy gun in a park in the middle of the day?

Will they be pulled over by cops then shot dead in front of family just for twitching in visceral fear?

Will their young teen daughter in a swimsuit be laid on top of by a middle aged cop as she cries for her mummy - her only crime being that her and her young friends legally used a pool in a white neighbourhood?

No?

Then it's not the fucking same.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2020 21:15

I could go on.

Don't

donquixotedelamancha · 29/05/2020 21:34

Now you make a complaint to the police. I absolutely would do that. Fuck her.

Oh please don't do that. The recent trend for the police to investigate thought crime is a far greater threat to you than this flag.

We need to defend the rights of the ignorant to be wrong because doing so protects us.

FWIW I think flying a flag like this is terrible. It's supporting slavery the same as using Nazi or Communist symbols supports genocide and I don't think the fact that is not the intent mitigates it.

Winterlife · 29/05/2020 21:47

Will they be dragged to a grisly death behind a car by a racist gang?

No. Instead, they'll be shot in broad daylight on a street, or blown up in a stadium, or poisoned, or beaten to death on the stairs to their apartment.

Will their young child be shot dead by cops for playing with a toy gun in a park in the middle of the day?

No, they'll be sold into prostitution in the West. Or forced to make pedophile pornography. All while the police ignore it, as they usually receive kickbacks.

Will they be pulled over by cops then shot dead in front of family just for twitching in visceral fear?

That does happen in Ukraine, so yes.

Will their young teen daughter in a swimsuit be laid on top of by a middle aged cop as she cries for her mummy - her only crime being that her and her young friends legally used a pool in a white neighbourhood?

No?

This has also occurred in Ukraine, although not in pools, and not for being white.

Then it's not the fucking sam

See above. Yes it is the same. Your ignorance is on display.

While there is systemic racism, your examples are not the daily experience of every person of colour, or even of the majority persons of colour, in the United States.

Winterlife · 29/05/2020 21:49

same as using . . . Communist symbols supports genocide and I don't think the fact that is not the intent mitigates it.

We have posters above who dispute this.

I think it's ignorance, rather than a support of genocide, though.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2020 21:50

Winterlife

Stop appropriating this as your victimhood.
Start a new thread on the New Bolshiviks and begin your own movement rather than attempting to derail this one.

donquixotedelamancha · 29/05/2020 21:53

I think it's ignorance, rather than a support of genocide, though.

As I said, I'm sure that's not the intent but those flags mean something specific, their meaning isn't changed by the owners foolishness.

donquixotedelamancha · 29/05/2020 21:57

Start a new thread on the New Bolshiviks and begin your own movement rather than attempting to derail this one.

Of FFS. Communism has murdered more people than any other political movement or belief system in history.

It's not unreasonable to say the neighbours flying this flag near a black couple is comparable to flying a swastika near Jews or a hammer and sickle near gypsys, Russians, Chinese or eastern Europeans.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2020 22:00

Oh please don't do that. The recent trend for the police to investigate thought crime is a far greater threat to you than this flag.

It's not a "thought crime".
It's the very deliberate and overt act of erecting a visual expression of ongoing racial hate, violence and murder. It's a willful hate act which an reasonable person would know will cause fear in minority populations. It will cause damage in the community. Not just a "thought crime."

It very much is a matter for the police.