To think soon it won’t be socially acceptable to fly

[Pigletspal]

I’m sad because I’ve been saving up for 6 years to go on holiday. I want to go to South America and Southeast Asia next year. I’ve also just got a job with a decent wage and I have been looking forward to much to making holidays a regular thing.

But they’re about to get more expensive aren’t they?

And suddenly I feel guilty about wanting to fly. One of my friends has already said that she will be going on “one last” foreign holiday and then stopping due to climate change.

And I really want to save the planet too. I’m just sad that it’s all going this way.
Am I overreacting or shall I get used to the idea my travelling days are numbered?

We have to fly less. YANBU
Do we? Who says? Why?

@Lockheart you realise commercial flying has been around for 106 years..?

@zscaler you might want to revisit your your numbers. They are still producing meat. Not as many flights. Not so much industry production but we are all still eating. Turns out farming is not the problem. If you are vegan for the planet then you should not fly! If you fly; don’t bother being vegan! Meat is not the problem.

Travel may become more expensive to start with then the offers will start. People alike to travel.
I live abroad. Of course I will travel.
What nonsense. Of course we will be able to fly again and it will be fine.

@SeaSandandSun do you realise the difference between commercial charters and mass travel on huge scales? Passenger aircraft have been around for a while. Mass tourism has not and is only 40-50 years old. Before then the proportion of people travelling by air was vanishingly small.

@Lockheart it’s now 2020. It was 70 years ago. Plus, sea travel is not that environmentally friendly either. Neither is rail from the past.

Op you are talking about your trip of a lifetime. Good for you, I hope that it happens. Don't put yourself into the same group of people who think nothing of flying to Newquay from London for the weekend or jet away every school holiday. Yes, we all know the type..it's those people that I hope change their ways after all of this - it must be hell for them right now.

There’s plenty of vegan sources of dietary iron - legumes, tahini, dried fruit, green leafy veg, chickpeas, seeds. Same with Omega 3 (nori, edamame beans, chia hemp and flax seeds, soybean oil and kidney beans). Zinc is in beans, chickpeas, lentils, tofu, walnuts, cashew nuts, chia seeds, ground linseed, hemp seeds, pumpkin seeds, wholemeal bread and quinoa

To me all im seeing is a heap of ewww.
I eat, out of that list SOME green leafy veg and dried fruit. Not really a great base for a diet
My birds eat seeds, not me

According to a survey i did last night, there a major airline looking at some great deals to get people in the air again. Flying isnt going anywhere, it will build back to pre corona levels

It’s been bliss without flights overhead in holding pattern. Birds will agree I’m sure. I like their songs. Sorry for your loss of holiday. 😟 Building work on super sized flats has restarted. Bad.

Yes, the air is cleaner, the rivers too. Without aircraft and so much traffic.

We humans are arrogant and selfish. With very short term memories.

"Bliss" for some, not for others..

www.bbc.com/news/business-52723107

"Bliss" for some, not for others

I live under the flight path and I’m also enjoying the respite whilst it lasts. If it was a choice between people keeping their jobs and no plans I would choose people’s jobs but I don’t feel bad about enjoying the lack of planes flying overhead every 90 seconds.

Other form of travel like trains and ferries should be subsidised and flying should be more expensive. With more investment in high speed trains travel throughout Europe could be done without flying, but flights have been so cheap few people would choose a slower alternative. Even within the UK it is often cheaper to fly than take a train.

I hope not as I live in another country to my family.

Other form of travel like trains and ferries should be subsidised and flying should be more expensive. With more investment in high speed trains travel throughout Europe could be done without flying, but flights have been so cheap few people would choose a slower alternative. Even within the UK it is often cheaper to fly than take a train.

Yet people are opposed to HS2?

Yet people are opposed to HS2?

I guess especially those who are going to live near it or have lives disrupted because of it....

I hope they find an economically better fuel so it's not so bad... bf and I r 2000 miles apart so, yea, we fly around 3 times a year

I hope not. I love my travel. I'll be off on my travels as soon as i feel its safe to do so.

If it was a choice between people losing jobs and no planes I would choose ...their jobs

Over many years people have lost jobs and found or created new ones, whole industries like the mines and steel have been closed down and are being done more cheaply in China. There has to be investment in new, green forms of industry. We have the ingenuity, but successive governments are so short termist.

@SeaSandandSun do you realise the difference between commercial charters and mass travel on huge scales? Passenger aircraft have been around for a while. Mass tourism has not and is only 40-50 years old. Before then the proportion of people travelling by air was vanishingly small.

This. We went to Rome in the early 90s and again last year. The first time the tourist bits were nothing like as crowded and my photos bear this out.

whole industries like the mines and steel have been closed down and are being done more cheaply in China.

Which shows is there's still a demand for the product, and in many cases (such as steel) the end product is now being shipped half way around the world rather than being mined/produced locally.

you might want to revisit your your numbers. They are still producing meat. Not as many flights. Not so much industry production but we are all still eating. Turns out farming is not the problem. If you are vegan for the planet then you should not fly! If you fly; don’t bother being vegan! Meat is not the problem

This is just manifestly untrue (although it’s hard to make sense of the word salad).

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/2018/may/31/avoiding-meat-and-dairy-is-single-biggest-way-to-reduce-your-impact-on-earth

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/api.nationalgeographic.com/distribution/public/amp/environment/2019/01/commission-report-great-food-transformation-plant-diet-climate-change

www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2019/11/15/how-much-would-giving-up-meat-help-the-environment

Yes notimagain China SAYS that it's greening it's industries. There is so much we all have to do to keep the carbon levels down to 'safe'. Our culture has to change almost completely.

Coviid has helped a little but for how long?

Yes notimagain China SAYS that it's greening it's industries.

TBH that's not really the point I was trying to make, my bad..the point is I see no reason to (for example) applaud the end of steel production in, say, the UK, if the UK still has a need for the material.

What we seem to have done is lost UK jobs, got somebody else to do the polluting for us at the point of production and and then probably increasing the overall amount of pollution produced/energy used by then shipping the stuff to the UK....maybe it would have been more environmentally friendly to keep production in the UK where we would have had control over emissions standards?

In my more conspiracy theory minded moments (and I don't have many) I start wondering if there are some more extreme politicians who may have a similar cunning plan for UK aviation - they would hope to see the end of the large UK based airlines, (and that means jobs), that would reduce the amount of emissions produced by "G" registered aircraft, hence get those emission off the UK's "books"....Paris Accord etc.

However in order to avoid the political suicide that would result by reducing Brits opportunities to fly off on holiday those same politicians would be quite happy to let foreign operators have unfettered access to UK airports...as long as the emissions for those flights go on the foreign operators books.

Daft I know but I'm old enough to have seen politicians do dafter.

I live in the middle of Europe. All other family are in UK except brother who is in Canada.
It’s going to be harder to see my Uk family for some time. Maybe I will take the train but not until the two week quarantine requirement is lifted.
Brother who knows - could be years.
It’s really sad. Those on lower incomes in similar situations - and there are many thousands of people in this situation may not see their family for a very long time.