Parents wfh and the furloughed for childcare

[baskininjoe]

I am childless, currently by choice because I am in my twenties but do plan to have a child in the future at some point.

AIBU to be getting annoyed with the short end of the stick that the childless are getting right now with everything regarding childcare and lockdown.

I have so many colleges who are currently wfh whilst looking after children. I completely sympathise and understand this is hard but I am really starting to get annoyed with them being less productive, and logging less hours for the same pay (no reduction), whilst the rest of us are expected to pick up the slack, and work more hours to make sure tasks still get completed, whilst not being paid anymore for our extra time and effort. I know there is no perfect solution but it really grates on me that they aren't being paid for what they complete which could therefore compensate the rest of us for the extra we are having to do because they are not fully fulfilling their role.

On top of this with the idea of school provisionally going back in June some of these parents have said they will not be sending their DC to school, despite a place being open and available to them, and therefore expect the rest of us to continue to pick up their slack because they can't work as productively whilst looking after their children.

My housemate (shared house) works in a place where many parents have been furloughed for childcare reasons, despite their being lots of work to do, just because they've asked to be. This means that my housemate has been incredibly stressed as the workload is still high but the team is now smaller, whilst many of their colleges are receiving 80% on the taxpayer, despite their actually being work for them to do, all because they complained to their employer that it was too hard working with children and thus asking to be furloughed. This is especially grating as it is taxpayer money that is being used to pay them, despite their actually being a job they could do and be payed for.

I am not at all against the furlough scheme, another of my housemates work in a restaurant and is also on furlough and this is absolutely the right thing as they can not work, despite wanting to, as their place of work is not allowed to open.

However I think:

1. Some employers and employees are taking the piss by allowing staff to be furloughed/asking to be furloughed despite their actually being a job to do. Which then negatively affects the rest of the teams as the work level remains the same but there are less people to do the work so the remaining people have to work harder with no extra pay.

1. Employers need to be understanding but also firm with parents that although some productively will be affected by having DC at home, a certain level still needs to be consistently met or they are not doing their job properly and that negatively affects the business and the rest of the team.

1. Employers need to be especially understanding and grateful to employees still working, who are picking up the slack for those not being as productive because of DC at home/furloughed for childcare reasons despite their still being work. And actually need to consider financially compensating them for the high level of extra work and overtime and/or promise to look at these people first for upcoming promotions as as they have shown serious dedication to the business.

1. Employers should not be allowing parents to choose not to send DC to school when they can if it continues to affect the parents productivity level.

I understand this is a hard time for everyone, and parents do have it hard with few childcare options for DC, however that is not the problem of their colleagues and they should not be negatively affected by being expected to work far far more for no extra gain. My housemate and I are stressed beyond belief both having to work 10-12 hours every day for what would be a 9-5 office job in order to pick up the slack for colleagues whilst not being paid anymore whilst these colleagues are only completely 4-6 hours a day yet continuing to be paid the same as us. And on top of this are expecting it to continue despite their child being able to go to school soon because they are choosing not to send them.

@guinnessguzzler

Seriously? 'Just be kind'

Have you seen some of the venom, verbal abuse, condescension, and actually wishing bad fortune on be that has come on this thread.

I am expressing frustration with the situation, the situation is caused by other people yet I am still frustrated with the situation not the people, because I understand they have their own situation.

I am really not the one you need to tell to be kind

To anyone taking out their frustration on me thinking it's ok because your more stressed so I can be your punching bag take a look at yourself and ask why you think it's ok to verbally abuse anyone.

Do I deserve to moan now? Now I've given you the background Is my life shit enough that by MN standards I am finally allowed to complain? Or should I still put up and shit up and just be grateful I don't have a 3 year old right now!

I said this before:
The thread is summed up by the OP saying
I completely sympathise and understand this is hard

And posting it on MN. And being surprised at the reaction

It displays a massive lack of self awareness and a massive immaturity and lack of sympathy and understanding.

On MN posters ARE allowed to disagree and say stop talking out of your arse.

Whilst you are sat at home thinking about your family worrying, do you think that its ONLY you who is sat at home worrying about their family and how they can't see them and how they might be having panic attacks, worrying about how if they don't keep working their kids won't have food and a roof over their heads too? Only with children.

And its ONLY you who is allowed to have a rant at the insensitive nature of posts because you are stressed?

Just wow.

No, OP you don't get to go 'wah the responses on this thread are unfair, why won't you all think of me' without getting pulled up on it.

The situation is no fault of anyone here and you are pitching to an audience who aren't exactly going to be impressed.

What exactly did you expect everyone here to say? Pat you on the head and say 'oh you poor thing, you couldn't be more right. I'm slacking and you have it so bloody hard'?

Thats pretty spectactular if you did.

@baskininjoe

You need to explain all that to your employer. If they don't listen and carry on expecting you to pick up all the slack then they are truly shit. If you are suffering with anxiety to the point of having panic attacks I would suggest a visit to the GP. I did, and got some citalopram which took the edge right off. It's like night and day.

If you'd included all of that in your OP then the reception would have been entirely different.

Don't make yourself poorly with work. Just do your contracted hours and switch off, it's tough shit. When they ask why, you explain what you did in that paragraph above.

Seriously OP. You really do not understand what 'stressed beyond belief' is.

Do you think us parents are just sat here not giving 2 fucks about the shortfall in their work? Or do you think they might be busting a gut knowing that they are doing their best and that their twatty colleagues might still be judging them for not doing more.

Life is relentless right now if you are a parent with small children. They need constant supervision and near constant interaction. DH and I are utterly utterly exhausted trying to work and care for our small children. The guilt is awful. I am very grateful to my employer for having some understanding for my situation. They have my gratitude and more loyalty as a result.

If you have a problem with your employer putting more work on you, then speak to your employer.

If you're going to hold this against individuals, I hope they know and don't have your back in the future.

@LaurieMarlow actually lots of parents asked for schools to be closed so you are wrong there. Some even took them out of school before they closed.

OP I do empathise with your work situation, no one wants to work 50% extra hours for free. Hopefully your efforts will be recognised by your employer when they are in a position to do so, and if not when the job market picks up again it might be time to vote with your feet.

And to everyone suggesting the OP simply stops work at 5pm, maybe they have too strong a work ethic to leave so much work unfinished. Maybe they give a shit about the clients, customers or colleagues that would be let down and want to make sure there is a viable business for everyone to work at when this is over.

To all those saying the OP should suck it up, would you be willing to work back the hours you’ve had to miss whilst looking after your children for free when this is all over?

OP, you’re having a tough time, like many are, in this shit situation.

Do yourself a favour, and take this up with your boss, rather than lashing out at parents who did not ask to be put in an impossible situation.

Also, I am using every spare minute I’m not tending to my child to do work to make sure I’m not seem to be slacking. Meanwhile, a good few of my childless friends are posting snaps of their 11am yoga workout or mid-afternoon bike ride (as for the endless Houseparty notifications pinging up on my phone at e.g. 2.30pm...). These things are encouraged by our employers for health and wellbeing; I can’t do them between 8am and 8pm because of my lifestyle choice to have a child. Honestly OP, wise up

You suggested that parents, who if they are anything like me had childcare plus 2 backups that are ALL suddenly inaccessible, should go to the bottom of the list for promotions. I worked for my previous company for eleven years before I had a baby but sure, chuck me on the employment scrapheap. And you are surprised to be met with a hostile response?

To all those saying the OP should suck it up, would you be willing to work back the hours you’ve had to miss whilst looking after your children for free when this is all over?

When should they do this? And how do they cover their childcare.

Oh wait. Maybe thats part of the point...

I imagine that, once schools are open, a lot of companies will actually become less lenient and parents who choose not to send children into school when the option is there will land in the firing line - be it for redundancy or suddenly loosing pay, being made to take unpaid leave instead.

@baskininjoe I’m so sorry about your miscarriage, I’ve been through it and it’s awful.
I think you need time off more than anything! The issue is with your employer. Your WFH situation is supposed to be desk assessed isn’t it? Can they give you a new chair? Different lamp?
I’m sorry you’re going through it but we all are. I have a 14 month old and my husband and I are expected to work 35 hours a week each and look after him. Ain’t gonna happen but I am managing 29 hours and I am stressed to fuck, have upped my sertraline and drinking more than ever. My day starts at 7.30 and ends at 8.30 when he’s in bed. In that time I’m either looking after him or working.
We are ALL in the same shitty boat, and unfortunately work targets are not the most important thing in the world right now.
Speak to your employers as they should be looking after you better.

@RedToothBrush

Seriously go away. You are insulting me, calling me immature, attacking me and you think that's ok? Even without knowing anything else that's going on in my life, you seriously think it's ok to treat any human being like that?

Yes MNetters are allowed to disagree with me but they're not allowed to go in on me, take all their frustrations out on me. There's a kind way to disagree and a cruel one.

No I don't think it's only me at all. But every poster on here seemed to think that everything other than work was happy as Larry in my life so I'm letting them know that actually it's not and I'm allowed to be stressed AS WELL. Not instead of them, aswell as them. We're all allowed to be stressed.

I'm having a rant about posters actually bullying me, not being insensitive, actually directly hurtful things towards me. @MNHQ I'm pretty sure that goes against the spirit of mumsnet, right?

I don't expect a pat on the head but maybe a little sympathy, maybe a few comment of 'my life is hard too, it's hard for all of us, think of everyone'. But definitely not, 'your life is easy, be grateful for everything, you have nothing to ever complain about ' and most definitely not threat, verbal abuse, bullying, and actually wishing of bad things to happen to me.

OP I hope you are ok. We are all worried about our family that we can’t see, there are lots of us working in our bedrooms (me included), we are all under pressure. I don’t think it is helpful though to look at people in a different situation to you and blame them.

I’m looking after a toddler and two older kids, homeschooling them, and trying to work. It is hell. No sign of schools opening here. I’m worried about my productivity, worried about my kids mental health, worried about their education, worried about my mum recovering from cancer, worried about my dad in his nursing home. It’s not a competition and I really think we are all doing the best we can in the situations we find ourselves in. Despite all that I’m incredibly thankful I still have a job that is currently secure, and we are healthy right now. Focus on the good bits and not other people.

actually lots of parents asked for schools to be closed so you are wrong there. Some even took them out of school before they closed

In the context of a global pandemic where they felt their children were in danger. No one actively wanted to work with no childcare, for the shits and giggles.

To all those saying the OP should suck it up, would you be willing to work back the hours you’ve had to miss whilst looking after your children for free when this is all over?

Well, if my nursery will make up their extra hours that they didn’t deliver, I’ll think about it. Oh wait. This tit for tat bollocks won’t get us anywhere. Let’s act like grown ups.

Maybe they give a shit about the clients, customers or colleagues that would be let down and want to make sure there is a viable business for everyone to work at when this is over.

And maybe all those parents out there give a shit about all that too. But they’re having to balance those shits with not actively neglecting their children. Or dropping from exhaustion.

While we're at it, sending kids back to school is not that easy

Health risks to your children and your family unit aside, sending children back to a scary environment would be terrible for the mental health of a developing child. I'm not sending them anywhere that has social rules that they cannot stick to.

You also have no idea of the judgement I'll get when I send my children to their settings. Parents, teachers, family, randoms off the street.

I hope you return to re read your post one day when you have dc and can imagine how impossible parents find this situation. Why not knock out a 10-12 hour day for the time being. What else you doing? Going out tonight?

and most definitely not threat, verbal abuse, bullying, and actually wishing of bad things to happen to me.

OP, I get that you’re having a tough time, but you need to reflect on your own actions on this thread, in particular the not so veiled threats about redundancies. Was that nice?

I agree people have been hateful to you on this thread OP and I hope you can get something sorted with work.

Comments like this are awful as well, inferring you can’t know stress cos you haven’t had kids! FFS.

“ Seriously OP. You really do not understand what 'stressed beyond belief' is.”

Ugh, do one,

OP I don't think a majority of posters have bullied you in any way. They have got annoyed by a particularly goady OP in which you suggested that parents aren't productive and should be in the back of the queue for promotions. You also intimated in later posts that they were in the firing line for redundancy. I'm sorry you are having a hard time but you can't write an inflammatory post and when you get called out claim bullying.

Seriously do you think starting a thread bitching about parents who are struggling is in the spirit of the site?

No. Everyone is struggling, but you want a thread where you are the centre of attention with everyone giving you nothing but sympathy after youve just displayed a monumental lack of empathy and complete misjudgment of the audience here.

You know people DO have sympathy for others struggling but you came out firing against them in a way which is personal to them. Thats not how you endeer yourself to others. Nor is it how you express how you are finding it hard in your own right, by slagging off others.

The fact you can't see this and are still going on about how you have it just as bad yadda yadda yadda isn't helping.

I just see a tantruming child who isn't getting enough attention. Anyone who had plenty of that lately really isn't going to have much time for it from an adult.

As many have said on this thread: if you have a problem take it up with your employer or consider how the audience here might react a little more...

@Hohofortherobbers

Seriously? You think I have nothing better to do with my time than work for 12 hours a day. I have family too you know! Just because I don't have kids doesn't mean I don't have family. I want to call my parents, grandparents, boyfriend, friends, I need to sleep, eat, shop (for 3 households). Actually get out the house rather than spend 24/7 in one tiny bedroom. And that before we get to anything actually for me like yoga, or a run, or a film, or half an hour with a glass of wine. You know all those things that when parents complain they never get they get full sympathy for.

@lauriemarlow

I didn't threaten anyone. I said there were threats of redundancies, that I have no say in making the decision over. However I am compiling data on productivity, that's it, the same as a clock in machine compiles data on people who are repeatedly late. I said myself I don't know who would get made redundant the person working more hours at less productivity or vice versus, and I'm glad I don't have to make this decision. I was simply giving examples to support other things I said.

What do you say to people who say having children is a lifestyle choice, and ask what the impact is on those who choose not to/cannot have children?

Not saying what my views are, but I’m interested in the thoughts of both parents, and childless posters.... (just stirring up more arguments?! :) )

OP.

Lets rephrase this:

Just because I DO have kids doesn't mean I don't have family. I want to call my parents, grandparents, friends, I need to sleep, eat, shop (for 3 households). Actually get out the house rather than spend 24/7 in one tiny bedroom away from the kids, a mountain full of washing, a sea of toys and a kitchen which looks like a bomb has gone off in it. And that before we get to anything actually for me like yoga, or a run, or a film, or half an hour with a glass of wine. You know all those things that parents never get at the best of times

Now if you'd like a spade to keep digging, do carry on.

Really, honestly. All these things PLUS a lack of sleep and a child nagging "MUUUUUUMMMMMMMYYYYY".

So you aren't going to acknowledge how deeply shitty your comment about parents being promoted last was?