To be pissed off at people who constantly say we need to fly less?

[lockdowncockdown]

I'm probably going to get flamed for this but here goes. Am I being unreasonable to be annoyed by the people who constantly say 'well, we need to fly less anyway'. Well, yes that's ok for you to say at 40/50 years old after you've spent the last 20 years flying all over the world and brandishing yourself as ' well travelled' and cultured. What about those of us in our early twenties like me who has been abroad four times in my whole life, not even to anywhere particularly exciting and I'm just about to finish university and was hoping to finally be able to travel a bit? It's ok to spout nonsense about flying less when you've been lucky and already had your experiences but I find it very hypocritical to want to deny others the same experiences that you were lucky enough to have.

fuzzyduck I am assuming you don't have children.

YANBU - it can be true that all we need to fly less, and still galling to hear people (like many of my friends) who spent their 20s travelling around Goa and Thailand, going to Burning Man, and taking 3-4 long haul flights a year, who have now moved to Brighton or Wiltshire, drive a dirty polluting campervan down to Cornwall to go surfing every single weekend, installed a wood-burning stove and had four children, and are now lecturing everybody about air pollution and climate change, whilst doing nothing to combat it themselves, just sneering about people taking package holidays.

Ok that is just three couples I know, but they are plenty annoying enough to provoke an AIBU!

If you want to travel then just travel. Be considerate of where you visit, maybe don't go nuts with long haul all the time. We all need to do our bit but we all make choices and draw our own lines at how to do so. I fly abroad a few times a year but I'm also vegetarian and don't drive, buy secondhand etc. You should make your choices based on your priorities and just try to be mindful elsewhere. Fly a bit less doesn't mean the world is closed.

I'm flying as often as I want, for the rest of my life.

Same goes for eating meat. They'll have to bam it before I cut back.

The baby boomer bashing needs to stop btw. My father never travelled by air in his seventh odd years on this earth. The only holidays he had were the odd ones in this country. My mother who is 77 has been abroad but not often. Perhaps five or so times. So away with your nonsense about the older generation. Yes there would have been some who went away twice a year but there were masses who lived very quiet lives comparatively.

I flew lots in my teens and early twenties. I stopped when I started to understand the damage it was doing.

I'm almost 40. I don't really tell other people not to fly, but I do think it's pretty selfish to fly lots for holidays. I now don't fly.

Every generation has some things easier and some things harder than previous generations.

Housing is now so expensive where I live that I'll never be able to afford the lifestyle my parents had. On the other other hand, I have the Internet and mobile phones.

My daughter will benefit from living in a society where mental illness is less stigmatised and better treated and SEN are better catered for.

We need to stop burning fossil fuels. Planes don't have to burn fossil fuels, they could burn fuel made from sunlight (solar power) and air (from which CO2 is extracted.)

We can fly as much as we like, as long as we pay more to use environmentally friend fuels.

The extra cost would not make a huge difference to how much flying most of us can afford to do.

There are problems with rail travel.
Firstly, the cost. It was cheaper for me to fly to France than get anywhere near Eurostar in London.

Secondly. Visa. If you are resident but 3rd country national you need visa. If you fly, you need visa for your destination only (maybe a transfer too), but by land? You may need much more. Lots of money and time there.

The only people I know who says we need to fly less only travel by train in Europe and only fly if they really need to. None of them own cars.

They say fly less, not don't fly at all. Drive your car less, not don't ever get into a car at all.

I've loved the Race Across The World program, where couples had to travel by land rather than fly. It's made me want to travel in a similar way.

Whoever says that we should use trains instead - please remember some destinations are not available via trains. I love in the UK, my parents live in Israel - how am I supposed to get there? There is no train connection, and no sea tours either.
Also - whoever bangs on about this subject - how about you quit buying cheap clothing produced in China / Vietnam / Bangladesh? The environmental impact of importing cheap shitty quality clothes from Far East is insane. Lets start buying things made in the UK only, how about that? I bet no one would agree to pay £30 for a t-shirt just to save the planet.
If someone is in their 40s or 50s and barely flown anywhere - most likely they can't afford it, so they have nothing to loose anyway.

Baaaahhhhh No just ungrateful step kids.

We need to stop polluting this planet so much IMO.

And one way to do that might be to reduce the discharge of huge quantities of contaminants into the atmosphere at 35,000 feet.

Do you realise that you don't suddenly hit your 40s or 50s and feel like you've done everything you've wanted to do? I'm sure there are plenty of people in their 40s and 50s who would still love to travel and are just as disappointed their prospects will be limited.

I am 56. I went on a plane for the first time aged 31. My DPs were 39 and 45 before they went on a plane. I have made 11 return plane trips in my entire life.

And quit with the whining about what previous generations got. You clearly don't realise how recent most women's rights are. In the early 1980s when I was a late teen you had to have your father's (or husband's) permission for a loan. Can you imagine that?

I left school at 16 yo, as did the vast majority of my year group. Out of 360 pupils in my year, 4 went to university. FOUR. All 4 of them came from the posh houses with professional parents. None of them from ordinary families.

Maternity leave when I had DC1 was 18 weeks (and that was more than most people got). 12 weeks before the baby and SIX WEEKS after. Guess how many of us went back to work? No nurseries, no free 30 hours childcare schemes, no tax credits. We had to pay heavily for 2 hours of pre-school playgroup.

Don't know what you studied at university but I think you need to educate yourself about what life was actually like for previous generations, stop whining and grow up.

@lockdowncockdown, I get you.

It is annoying when the people who are preaching to reduce flying etc... are the ones who created the problem in the first place!
And yes I am looking at those who:

• have had one or two holidays abroad every year, some of them far away (Florida anyone?) beause they wanted the sunshine.
• went away on a couple of weekend breaks in europe
• had a stag do/hen do abroad etc....

It is even worse when these are the same people who STILL travel and haven't actually reduced their flying but are 'carbon neutral' because they've bought whatever package to make themselves feel better.

Actually it's solar power, air and water that's needed.

www.solarpaces.org/how-desert-solar-can-fuel-centuries-of-air-travel/

I have been on a plane exactly 3 times in my life - once in the 70s, once in the 90s and again in 2010. I remember each time vividly.

I got the impression that the “fly less” people are really pointing the finger at business travellers, who see nothing wrong in hopping on a plane for meetings instead of connecting remotely.
That kind of resource waste most definitely needs to stop, especially when we’ve just spent the last few months proving it’s not necessary.

I think we should all fly less and I’m 30. Haven’t been on holiday for years either.

I didn’t go on an airplane till just before my 30th birthday.

If we went abroad we drove or took the train and boat.

You can go abroad without flying.

@zafferana... exactly what you say ...
I’m very well traveled personally and professionally.
I do sympathise with the OP as my life has greatly been enriched by travel and I have lived in many other countries.

However I agree 100 % re business travel .
Last year I was in at least 2 different countries per month ... in November I was in 4 different countries.. 1 week was in Asia ...
Ridiculous... I did more air miles than a friend who is cabin crew ..
I would say only 30 % if those trips required travel - the others could easily have been done via Teams online etc
My hope for the future is that my and many other companies will change their policies going forward and apply common sense .

OP I hope you do get to travel ( with a lesser carbon footprint! ) in due course

I don't fly regularly we usually take the car and travel across Europe ... I had my first long haul flight booked for August this year. and once all this corona stuff is over, I will be going on my holiday. I am not guilt tripped into anything...
In all honesty, everything should be in moderation, my once in a lifetime trip is doing very little to my carbon footprint over a 10 year period.

I can visit my friend
One hour on plane & less cost/ time than train or car
12 hour drive one way by car
Too expensive by train

What would you choose ?

My DD is in her 20s and would totally disagree with you due to the fact that she is more concerned about the environment.

OP I kind of agree. I was planning to take at least six months off work this year to go travelling, something I've put off for a while as I just started working and never stopped whereas a lot of my friends took a year out after or before uni. So I was a bit gutted when all this happened!

But you know what, I'm still going to go through with my plans, when i can (probably later end of 2021) just amended them slightly so instead of lots of short breaks , i will do longer trips with one flight to x country and another from y country home, and train travel to different places in between. The money I save on all the individual flights I can spend on upgrading to nicer hotels etc. And the places I can't get to easily on train I can save to look forward to in the next few years.

I'm also planning to do a lot of trips around places in the UK I haven't been to. I realised a few years ago that it was a bit mad I had been to the US, Croatia etc but never to Ireland or Scotland! There is so much to see.

So I've made my peace with it. The only thing that annoys me are all the celebrities preaching about climate change and flying less but then they "have" to pop over to LA for an award ceremony or premiere or even just an audition!

@Poorlyweasels, I am sorry but... and what???

Yes many people will not have had the opportunity to fly to that many places. I have been flying. To see my parents/family in my home country once a year. Apart from that, I have had 3 holiday flights in my life. I didn't even fly for my honeymoon. We stayed in the UK.

This doesnt stop the fact that IN AVERAGE people have been flying a lot. This is what the OP is talking about.
The fat that things were worse before also doesn't mean that new generations should be just grateful or should be put through the same too. The length of ML etc... has absolutely nothing to do with flying.