What impact will the current health issue have on vaccine hesitant/refusing parents?

[HowFurloughCanYouGo]

You would hope that those who are vaccine hesitant or refuse vaccinations for their children will now understand what happens when a diseases is out of control and in desperate need for a preventative vaccination.

Do you think after this is over, it will improve vaccination uptake?

Or do you think those who refuse the MMR etc will also refuse the idea of covid19 vaccination and carry on as usual?

I'm currently writing a dissertation on vaccine uptake (or lack-thereof) so this really interests me. I really look forward to the literature that comes out over the next few years to show how things have (or have not!) changed.

BCG? Or TBC?

And if it's the TBC thing then why aren't all our children getting really unwell? Because they don't give the BCG anymore.

They do in London, so surely we would see quite a stark difference if the BCG was involved?

Sorry if it's the BCG not TBC.

Also, why is everyone assuming non-vaccinating people are thick?
I know very well educated people who have chosen not to vaccinate.

Academic intelligence or a good education is not always an indicator that someone has commonsense.

They're considered a bit thick because evidence shows that for the overwhelming majority of people, vaccines are safe and effective. Vaccines save lives. Vaccines mean that entire families no longer die out one after the other over the space of two or three weeks due to (what are now) preventable diseases. There has been no link found between vaccines and autism. Vaccine damage does exist as do severe reactions (e.g., allergies) but they are very rare.

Jane with her several hours of Googling, membership of a few anti-vaxx FB groups, and a copy of a junk-science book from Amazon does not compare to years and years of peer reviewed scientific research.

I have always vaccinated my children. Apart from the flu vaccine. However, it does concern me that the Covid19 vaccine will not have had time to be thoroughly tested and then how will they honestly, truly know how safe they are and the side effects of it? I don’t know what we will do when it comes to it. My husband will advocate getting it done I am sure.

Fuck 'em.

The only vocal antivaxxer I know has been having playdates, with her children's friends coming over during the lockdown, so I'm going to assume not!

decisions on vaccines need the ability to think critically and do risk assessment. Many are simply too stupid to do that, and that won't change.

They want a '100% safe' statement which they will never get, because nothing is 100% safe and we are all going to die. For most people it is simple, the risk of complications from the vaccine is much lower than the risk of complications or death from the diseases concerned. For a few people that isn't the case, which is why as many as possible of the rest of us need to vaccinate.

it isn't actually that difficult. I still await the anti-vaxxer with a sensible answer to the question 'why is there no smallpox?'.

You can't argue with stupid and anyone who doesn't vaccinate all their children (genuine health reasons not to excepted) is an idiot.

it isn't actually that difficult. I still await the anti-vaxxer with a sensible answer to the question 'why is there no smallpox?'.

Clean water and improved nutrition, wasn't it? Nothing at all to do with numbers suddenly dropping at the same time as the vaccine did. It was all down to people in the 1940s discovering handwashing and vegetables.

*BCG? Or TBC?

And if it's the TBC thing then why aren't all our children getting really unwell? Because they don't give the BCG anymore.*

I used TBC as a short for tuberculosis, not the name of the vaccine because I am not sure the name is same in all the countries (many medicines have a different name).

Is there a strong link with the BCG thing though? And why don,t they give it any more?

They’re stupid enough not to protect their DC from something as deathly as measles or meningitis so they’re probably not going to get the covid vaccination because covid doesn’t kill many children.

I've got antivaxers that pop up on my friends comments and because I used to play the FB games. This hasn't changed their minds. But people are assuming that the vaccine will be for everyone.
Sarah Gilbert has said that it's effectiveness will drop for the over 65's and go down on a sliding scale, as the flu vaccine does. But then i don't think that they'd accept that it was probably their teens that killed off Granny.

The Bill Gates conspiracy is too strong across the US to convince people otherwise.

I'm pro vaccine (I've had them, my baby will have them). I am not keen on having any CV19 vaccine that comes out this year, or even early next year, just because I don't see how they can have time to properly test for long term side effects. I don't think they'll have one available this year, but that's a different discussion.

BBC Wales was reporting a drop this morning in take up of the MMR vaccine. That's not people against vaccines, just too scared to go to the surgery (or can't get an appointment, or having to self-isolate). However, there's a risk that not everyone will catch up with them after things calm down. So overall I'd say the evidence so far is pointing in the direction of less vaccine uptake rather than more.

I've noticed that the tinfoil hat brigade has shifted its narrative somewhat so very few people present as out and out antivaxxers nowadays. Probably because they now realise how idiotic they sound at the moment.

The new narrative goes like this:

• I'm non an antivaxxer but I don't want a "rushed" vaccine (you won't have one -- its impossible to circumvent the highly rigorous clinical trials process)

• I'm not an antivaxxer but I think "questions should be asked" about the role played by 5G (they have, and they've been comprehensively answered).

• I'm not an antivaxxer but I think "questions should be asked" about Bill Gates's "agenda" (Gates has been extremely clear that his broader agenda is preventing childhood disease, particularly in the developing world and more recently he and other billionaires have focused on coronavirus)

All of these narratives are desperate last gasp attempts by people who essentially know they sound ridiculous but are trying to hang on to a shred of credibility because it allows them to hold onto the belief that their views make them "free thinkers".

My guess is that the vast majority of them would take a coronavirus vaccine if push came to shove because like most reasonable people they don't want their families to dies of a horrible disease. But they will continue to wring their hands about "untested" vaccines on the internet because they think it makes them sound clever.

But by then the rest of us will have herd immunity so they can go away and jabber to themselves in their echo chambers.

I think by the time the vaccine comes out most people will have immunity to it tbh. A lot of studies are showing that a high percentage of cases are asymptomatic so there are probably far more cases that we don’t know about and won’t know about until testing ramps up.

Iirc this is the first DNA/RNA (depending on version) vaccine to come on the market so I’m not sure people who are generally cautious/suspicious of vaccines are going to be jumping up and down for it.

"its impossible to circumvent the highly rigorous clinical trials process"

So why were vaccine developers allowed to skip some of the animal trials for CV19 vaccines? That's the sort of thing that worries me. And you can believe what you like about me, but I'm generally pro-vaccine. For example, I'm concerned about the drop in the MMR vaccine I noted above, which (the drop, not the vaccine!) is probably more dangerous to children than CV19 is.

Also, why is everyone assuming non-vaccinating people are thick?
I know very well educated people who have chosen not to vaccinate.

You can be well educated and severely lacking in any common sense at the same time.

I cannot comprehend why anyone would NOT want their child protected by these potentially serious diseases. In fact, I’d go as far to say that if a parent CHOOSES not to vaccinate their child, and it contracts and dies from a preventable disease, that the parent is prosecuted. It’s akin to manslaughter in my opinion.

Bloody idiots.

@bumbleymummy

There’s a suggestion that asymptomatic cases don’t illicit a strong enough immune response to form lasting antibodies - ie having a mild case may not be enough to create immunity, so widespread vaccination will be required.

@thatone, well we’ll know more when antibody tests are more widespread. It’s also possible that a vaccine may not induce a strong enough immune response/long term immunity too.

Since children aren't particularly at risk from COVID there may well be selfish parents who refuse to have it done. (I don't count among those people who might be hesitent about an untested vaccine). If that happened in significant numbers they might need to insist on vaccination to admit children to school. When I lvied abroad I had to prove both kids vaccination history (or exemption) before they were admitted (fair enough as far sas I was concerned)

I only know one anti vaxxer and she doesn't believe in coronavirus either.

Also, why is everyone assuming non-vaccinating people are thick?
I know very well educated people who have chosen not to vaccinate.

Lots of conspiracy theorists aren't completely thick so that's true but they are allowing themselves to fall victim to anti science nonsense. They're also being incredibly selfish.

I think fear of covid is the key driver here. Where people perceive their risk from covid to be low, or they don't live in a hard hit area, it will be easy for people to say no.

See all the 'but it's rushed' comments above.

When we are on our 2nd, 3rd etc peak and lockdown, when they have to go out to work, when their area has been hard hit, when somebody they know has died, they may think differently.

Other people will be motivated if they want to travel or access a service that requires proof of covid status. Because some things will.

The animal trials are able to run at the same time as human ones I believe.

You see I'm thick as mince, have no good knowledge of science or maths. Which is why I trust scientists and medics etc to give me the information and write me letters to get me and mine vaccinated. Both my kids are vaccinated. So am I. Still think it's good they are even though dd has autism. 🤷🏻‍♀️