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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Nannies not being furloughed.

132 replies

TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 12:49

We live in an area where a high percentage of families who have nannies, and many of them are expecting their nannies to travel to and from work each day. Many nannies are saying the families are not front line / key workers and are WFH; the majority of nannies are from abroad.

AIBU to think that if you are expecting your nanny to travel to and from work, you need to take on the responsibility of paying them in full if they become ill, offer their families death in service pay, and cover the costs of their funeral expenses and repatriation in the event that they die?

These are pretty much the conditions that will be in the parents employment contracts anyway (given the main types of employment in the wealthiest part of London) so surely they should give the same terms to their nannies?

YES YANBU

NO Fuck off you stupid trollop everyone needs a nanny when working from home.

OP posts:
bridgetreilly · 23/04/2020 14:50

Well, either the nanny can work from home, if the parents take the children to the nanny's home, though I imagine most parents won't want to do this, and many nannies won't live in homes that would be suitable. Or they can do their job as normal because they can't work from home. That is how things are supposed to work.

Furlough is only for people who would otherwise be made redundant because there is no work that they can currently do, e.g. retail workers in shops that aren't allowed to be open. But nannies can definitely do their jobs, at their normal place of work.

bridgetreilly · 23/04/2020 14:55

I also think there seems to be this weird misconception that most people are not working at the moment, other than keyworkers.

MOST PEOPLE ARE WORKING.

Some are now working from home, when previously they would have gone out to work. But plenty are still going out to work, because their jobs require it. This is true whether you work in an office, out on a site, or in someone else's home. Leaving your home to go to work is permitted and normal.

It makes no difference whether parents who were previously going out to work are now working from home, or even if the parents don't work. The job of the nanny still exists and in almost every case, I imagine, can't reasonably done by the nanny in the nanny's home. So they go out to work. LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.

Justajot · 23/04/2020 14:57

Isn't the risk to the WFH parents going to end up being the risk that the nanny brings coronavirus with them into work - potentially from their own household or public transport. I would have a problem with letting someone into my home who was travelling on public transport or who could provide a chain of transmission into my otherwise isolated house. But I don't have a nanny, so not a problem for me.

LaurieMarlow · 23/04/2020 14:57

MOST PEOPLE ARE WORKING.

Well duh.

But most children are being looked after by their parents at the same time as all other childcare is closed.

LaurieMarlow · 23/04/2020 14:58

Isn't the risk to the WFH parents going to end up being the risk that the nanny brings coronavirus with them into work - potentially from their own household or public transport.

Absolutely, this too.

LightStars · 23/04/2020 14:59

AIBU to think that if you are expecting your nanny to travel to and from work, you need to take on the responsibility of paying them in full if they become ill, offer their families death in service pay, and cover the costs of their funeral expenses and repatriation in the event that they die?

How do you prove the nanny picked up the virus whilst commuting & not during their daily exercise / food shopping / from someone they live with?

ChainsawBear · 23/04/2020 15:06

If the nanny wants to work, and she and the family have discussed the risks and are all comfortable with them, that is up to them, surely?

Oh, and you can't take children to a nanny's house. You need to be a registered childminder to look after children in your own home. A nanny must work from the parents' house.

VenusOfWillendorf · 23/04/2020 15:07

Unless both parents are key workers, it wouldn’t feel right to me to compromise the nanny’s safety by requiring her in.

If both parents were key workers then they can send their child to school for childcare and they have less need of a nanny than parents who are not key workers but still need to work!

I understand the not wanting to have someone come into your house - but I don't see where being key workers comes into it. Lots of people can't give up their jobs - and they can't get state provided childcare.

A nanny is probably at far less risk than most people who are having to go to work (key workers or not), particularly if the family parents are wfh and only going out for their exercise/shopping.
The family is more at risk - but that is their decision to take - not their neighbors.

Original poster
TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 15:07

But most children are being looked after by their parents at the same time as all other childcare is closed.

Exactly.

I am not talking about people who are travelling to work - I am talking about two-parent families where both parents are working from home and still forcing their nanny to come to work rather than doing what most people who are WFH are doing and juggling work and family responsibilities.

OP posts:
LaurieMarlow · 23/04/2020 15:10

I am talking about two-parent families where both parents are working from home and still forcing their nanny to come to work rather than doing what most people who are WFH are doing and juggling work and family responsibilities.

Yeah.

To be perfectly frank, I wouldn’t be looking on that too positively.

If the nanny wants to work, and she and the family have discussed the risks and are all comfortable with them, that is up to them, surely?

But what’s the alternative? No pay? Hardly a free and fair choice for the nanny.

LuluBellaBlue · 23/04/2020 15:12

OP I don’t think you understand furlough.

It can ONLY be used if the person would otherwise be made redundant or laid off.

If both parents are still working, or WFH how do they prove that they would have made the Nanny redundant?

They can’t. And they’d have no justification and therefore wouldn’t receive the government support.

araiwa · 23/04/2020 15:13

They have a nanny for when theyre working

Theyre working still, they need the nanny

AriadnesFilament · 23/04/2020 15:19

I’m not sure I understand your point. If both parents are still working, but just from home instead of from the office, why would they have grounds to furlough their nanny?

Tipsylizard · 23/04/2020 15:20

We have a nanny who comes in everyday to look after the children whilst my husband and I work full time (mostly from home at the moment) Our children are 5 and 3 and need to be taken care of/supported. My husband and I both have senior jobs that require focus and conentration and are well paid (which allows us to pay for a nanny) - although we have both had to take a pay cut. We have a contract of employment with our nanny which covers sick pay etc. but we talked to her about how she felt about coming to work in the situation and she said she would much rather come to work than sit at home so she does _ we have reduced her hours as we no longer commute but still pay her the same. I think you are being unreasonable to assume that people should just stop doing their job and be paid for by the government via furlough if they work for someone who has a job that isn't key (as defined by the pandemic situation). Plenty of people rely on others making business viable so they will hopefully keep their jobs when the pandemic has passed.

RainbowGlittersandSparkles · 23/04/2020 15:20

I’m a nanny and I’m working. They need me and so I’m going in.

Original poster
TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 15:21

If both parents are at work (even if at home) then they have a need for childcare

So what are all the parents doing who can't afford nannies and are in this position? Because most didn't have nannies, and certainly cannot afford to hire one now.

OP posts:
RainbowGlittersandSparkles · 23/04/2020 15:22

Should add I’m happy to go in, gives me some human interaction 5 days a week and the girls and their parents are super lovely.

Original poster
TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 15:23

By the way - I am totally a Trollop on this one, only a thirty seven percent of you agree with me :-)

OP posts:
sociallydistained · 23/04/2020 15:25

I've been furloughed and my official letter says it is because of their safety and my own. It says nothing about not being needed. Both employers still working.

VenusOfWillendorf · 23/04/2020 15:26

Many of the people that I know who are WFH and juggling work and family are finding it very stressful and feel that they are not not doing a good job of either.
Most people don't have a choice. For people who DO have a choice, and have discussed that with the nanny - why is keeping the nanny rather than letting her go such an awful thing to do?

Are you a nanny/friends with a nanny who is being forced to go to work against their will? That is a completely different problem and not legal. If the nanny does not want to work, then she should be able to quit or negotiate leave (paid or unpaid) - just like anyone else who doesn't want to go out to work but their employers need them.

The nanny is not eligible for furlough - that's not one of the options.
If the parents have been furloughed themselves, they might have case for it - but that's not what you are describing - you say yourself I am talking about two-parent families where both parents are working from home.

ChainsawBear · 23/04/2020 15:27

So what are all the parents doing who can't afford nannies and are in this position? Because most didn't have nannies, and certainly cannot afford to hire one now.

Struggling. Or accepting furlough which often comes with a big salary cut. Or being forced to take unpaid leave. With which anyone would sympathise. But that doesn't mean everyone is obliged to struggle, particularly when nannies are specifically permitted to work and when the nanny in question actively wants to.

karmakameleon · 23/04/2020 15:28

We’re in the same position as Tipsylizard except we have an extra child and some with significant disabilities. We’ve reduced our nanny’s hours to reflect the commute time we save and paid for her parking so that she doesn’t need to use public transport.

If she wanted to be furloughed then we would be willing to do so but I would have to take unpaid leave from my job so could only pay her the government amount. That would be far less than half her normal salary so not an option she’d want to take.

karmakameleon · 23/04/2020 15:30

Not “some” just one with significant disabilities but that’s still hard enough!

Original poster
TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 15:33

@VenusOfWillendorf No, I am not.

OP posts:
Original poster
TwuckFwaps · 23/04/2020 15:34

Well we are friends with our nanny - but we paid for her and her partners flights home before lockdown started and we are paying her salary and overtime calculated on the last six months (for overtime).

OP posts: