To think positive birth movement is a cult?

[auslass]

Recently I went along to a positive birth movement talk (mostly because they had free cake - don't get between a pregnant lady and carbs), and honestly I found the whole thing a bit cultish.

The women they had talking were all " no pain relief, I wanted to feel everything" heroes. And they had a midwife up talking about why everyone should be considering homebirths, and why we should all think about not having any drugs at all.

Is it just me or does just seem like another way of layering pressure on women? I want my pain relief and am sure of that, but when I brought up pain relief's place in PBM the midwife instantly explained all that could go wrong with pain relief. I get there a risks; but there are risks with no intervention births too right?

AIBU? Is it just me who thinks these groups have a responsibility to educate on all the options? Especially if they have midwives present?

Oh YANBU at all.
I still laugh at the memory of my NCT classes.

@KangarooIsland

YANBU I’m sick of seeing this shit. It does so much harm, making women think they’ve somehow “failed” at giving birth if they’ve needed intervention. The women who push hypnobirthing are smug at best and dangerous at worst.

I completely agree with this, however the hypno breathing technique did really help me whilst I was in the early stages before they would take me down to delivery.

I don’t recognise this description at all really. I read the Positive Birth Book by Milli Hill and have done the digital pack antenatal course from the Positive Birth Company. Both talk about how it’s totally possible to have a positive experience at home, in a pool, in a labour ward, in a birth centre, with interventions, with induction, with a section etc.

I find some of the language a bit wanky, but overall I’ve found the focus to be on empowerment, making informed decisions and being confident to face whatever turns the birth takes. Lots of evidence based approaches for things like positions for labour. There’s a slight emphasis on home birth but then again there is evidence that women with low risk pregnancies do have better outcomes with home birth. Personally I’m being induced, will be on the labour ward and am quite happy to accept pain relief if I find it necessary at the time.

But I’ve gone from being utterly terrified of childbirth and wanting to beg them to knock me out and give me a section - this is because my own mother died in childbirth and only once I got pregnant did I realise how deep those scars were and how terrified I would be. With the book/ course I mentioned I’ve got to a place where I feel a normal level of anxiety about the birth, but overall calmer and well informed. I really don’t see anything terrible or cult like in that.

That said I don’t know if the ‘Positive Birth Movement’ is so,etching separate/ different again. There’s loads of books/ courses/ experts using the terms ‘positive birth’ and ‘hypnobirthing’ and some will inevitably be crap or more cult like or whatever. But the two things I’ve used that call themselves ‘positive birth’ have both really helped me. I did start another hypnobirthing book originally and that was too much for me, and the push was too much towards home birth and hiring a private midwife - neither of which were an option for me and did make me feel briefly upset and inadequate until I just looked to find other resources that suited me better.

I also commented on this thread at the time, saying I would decline a vaginal examination this time. I gave in in the end - it is SO hard to say no and stick to it when you're trying to concentrate on having a baby!

But I still think that hypnobirthing (or the Positive Birth Company specifically in my case), just encourage you to have the best birth for you. To know the options, and give you the tools to make an informed decision. If it all gets too much (especially if you've been induced) then take the pain relief! It doesn't mean you've failed at birthing! Hypnobirthing encourages you to think about all the options (including homebirth!) and what you want in each eventuality. I didn't see any pressure or judgement one way or the other.

I does hypno birthing. It went out the window big time whilst I tore front to back when delivery my (beautiful and so worth it!) baby!

It’s a bit of a fringe movement isn’t it - same as the heavily medicalisation of birth is at the fringes. Some women opt for scheduled sections without hesitation, because that suits them. Some women want home births with no interventions.

Most women fall somewhere in between. I don’t think it’s wrong for either side to represent their own agenda, it’s all a choice at the end of the day. Even for those who are consultant led, high risk - they are still only being guided in their options, they are not forced to take the medical advice.

I think the PBM allows women to have more ownership and autonomy over their body and their childbirth experience- even if it doesn’t pan out how you have it planned in your mind, just knowing you have options and you can say no to things, that’s a good thing. And the PBM and hypnobirthing and all those related movements ARE promoting autonomy and being empowered to understand your options and choose the best ones for you.

Like anything in life, there are extremes. In my experience from all the research I did, most of the guidance was very much “have the birth YOU want on YOUR terms” - it wasn’t “if you use drugs you’ve failed”

I've had 3 very positive births. One was a planned section. One was a forceps delivery with an epidural. One was a straightforward vaginal birth with no pain relief. They were all different, and right for the circumstances I was in at the time. None was "better" than the others.
The fundamental flaw in any of these kind of movements is to assume we are all the same, which is of course rubbish. Not all women can deliver all babies without intervention and selling the myth that they can does nobody any favours. I have a couple of friends who put themselves and their babies into potentially very dangerous situations by believing that all babies can be born without help. They then had the additional psychological burden of feeling that they had failed, given in or been weak when they did need pain relief or assisted deliveries, and I saw no sign of the new "friends" who had encouraged these beliefs afterwards. Of course it is equally daft to assume that every woman wants or needs pain relief etc and there probably are plenty of unnecessary interventions. The truth is almost always somewhere between extremes and what we need is balance.
A woman who is well informed, treated with respect and actively involved in all decisions is surely likely to view birth as positive, regardless of the actual mechanics? A birth doesn't have to be unmedicated and happening to whale song to be positive and that should be recognised more widely.

I was thoroughly convinced about the ‘natural’ birth.1st was ok, 2bd hurt a lot. My last baby was really big, i was on the drip to speed up contractions, exhausted after 36 hours of labour. Why didn’t i ask for an epidural? Because i had been so indoctrinated. I really wish I’d had an epidural because it was awful.

YANBU OP.

I find the whole no-pain-relief thing to be nuts.

I was induced at 36 weeks, I had zero pain relief as nobody brought me gas and air (and I didnt ask for it, no idea why if I'm honest). When I got to about 6cm I asked for an epidural, which failed so I could feel EVERYTHING. I then went from 6 to 10cm in about 20 minutes and had to push with no pain relief, there was no time for anything else. Hideous. Had a forceps delivery and that spinal was the best thing since sliced bread.

If there is a next time I will ask for the epidural to be put in at the same time as the drip (type 1 diabetic here so will always be induced by 38 weeks).

I do wonder how insecure these women are that they would go through all that just to show off to a room of strangers. There are no medals for not accepting pain relief. All your heroic efforts will be to others will be 'Cool story, bro' then forgotten about in 5 minutes.