To feel vindicated by the D of H report, which confirms midwives are withholding epidurals?

[RevolutionofourTime]

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/mar/03/women-in-labour-being-refused-epidurals-official-inquiry-finds

I was denied pain relief during my first labour for no reason whatsoever. When I complained to the head of midwifery, she encouraged me to try a home birth next time. 🤨 I have also witnessed other women in maternity ward being denied pain relief.

Despite this, I have seen it argued here time and again that midwives are not acting as gatekeepers or withholding proper pain relief in labour.

This report confirms what many of us know.

I will be curious to see if this will lead to changes- more specifically, to adherence to the Nice guidelines that it’s never too early and never too late for an epidural in labour.

For anyone querying whether epidural slows down labour. Admittedly it's a small study sample.

For me having an epidural and being able to get a few hours sleep for the first time in about days definitely made for a more successful pushing stage, so even if it slowed the overall process (which noone suggested it did) it would have been worth it for that alone.

I’m an HDU nurse so I know quite a lot about analgesia amd treating pain and distress and my maternity experience was awful I was made to feel like annoyance , a drama queen it was like catholic guilt or something and I’ve never understood the culture that exists in midwifery towards pain relief .

I got refused all drugs with my 3rd baby, they did eventually give me 1 lot of paracetamol and liquid morphine, at 1st it was too early for anything, then it was too late for it all. Luckily I had a pretty quick labour but then the problems began, a small bit of my placenta broke off so I ended up bleeding out, I finally got my epidural 5/6 hours later as I had to go into theatre... but before the epidural I was never offered any more pain relief and I was in agony while midwives and doctors where trying to remove the bit of placenta from me

And all other pain relief options should be given first and foremost.

I chose an epidural before opioid drugs because I don’t like the feeling of being out of control and I wanted to feel mentally present. Getting an epidural meant I felt in control, and could remember and even enjoy the end stage of labour and the experience of meeting DD, which I wouldn’t have if I was off my nut on pethidine.
I’d have been pissed off to have been pushed through some sort of drug hierarchy to “qualify” for an epidural.

A "natural" (without pain relief) labour can be extremely rewarding I've heard of masochists, but never met one personally. Do you sleep on broken glass?

Added the to voices here. Got to 8cm and pool / g&a no longer doing the job, asked for. Epi and told “no too late” they also took away the g&a so I had two hours pushing with no pain relief at all. In end Dr came and said they’d have to intervene if it went on any longer. They gave my a local to help with crowning but it did nothing but act as a bit of a placebo to make me grit my teeth and push through the searing pain, as no forceps were coming near me if I could help it.

Now seeing this report, it makes me cross that we don’t get a lot of say on our treatment choices I don’t think we should go over medicalised but choice should always be given wherever possible.

I was offered an epidural with both of mine - now 22 & 11. I refused both times & just had gas & air & pethidine. It still hurt but it was bearable & there was no way I wanted an epidural. That’s my choice but surely to refuse someone who feels they need it, is barbaric.

I had pethadine & I can assure you i wasn’t off my nut. The drugs don’t work like that when they’re used for pain.

Apologies I've not read the full thread. I had an elective CS after EMCS first time round. My main reason for this was that I knew I wanted an epidural but I also knew I had a slim to none chance of getting one at the London hospital where I was booked to have DC2.

I had pethidine for my first and I was off my nut. It didn't help with the pain but it took away my ability to communicate, I was vomiting and was hallucinating. It was frightening. Never tried it again.

Crikey with my first child I don’t know how I would have coped without an epidural
My second child I could have had at home if pressed to as I coped without Epidural
I actually joke to people that i could have given
birth whilst shopping,as it was so much easier

I had pethadine & I can assure you i wasn’t off my nut. The drugs don’t work like that when they’re used for pain.

Except when they do. People react differently to different drugs and I know how I react to that type of pain relief. Luckily I did have midwives who (eventually) respected that. I don’t think it’s particularly unusual either - a friend of mine didn’t even realise she’d had an episiotomy until the next day because the pethidine meant she had no idea what was going on.

I had a really tough time first time around
Ended up being cut and had a forceps delivery I was also denied extra pain relief

My 2nd and 3rd I had at home because the thought of going to hospital traumatised me
I had much better experiences for those deliveries
The aftercare in hospital was terrible also

@PotteryLottery that is exactly how I felt.
I was so excited to meet my son before the labour. The labour was that horrendous I didn't even want to hold him by the time he was dumped on my chest. I seriously think the trauma has caused me to be unable to bond with him the way I would of if I had been listened to. I just felt like a nuisance and ignored. It is the biggest thing a woman can go through. We shouldn't be looking back on it with anxiety, dread and panic.

Woman have given birth since time began. Pain relief is quite a modern thing. I'm not that old but pethedine was all that was offered.

The NHS is in crisis, why choose to bump up costs when there really is little need. Childbirth is by no means the most painful thing a woman can go through, same as elective cesarean sections. 1000's of women give birth with zero pain relief every day.

Go ahead, shoot me.

@user1482956724 women have also died during childbirth since time began. When there is far, far more wastage in the NHS are women targeted?

I had a terrible second birth experience due to withholding of epidural and just not listening to what I was telling them during labour - the consequences where shoulder dystocia, 4th degree tear plus mother & baby nearly dying. The arrogance of the midwife I had almost cost me and my son our lives. NOT a consequence of lack of funding - pure negligence

When I was a student midwife I was told that pain is good in labour and women must feel the pain and I was constantly told no to epidurals when my women asked for them. When I said I didn’t like seeing women in pain that clearly couldn’t cope with it , I was told to go back to being a f***g nurse and hand out morphine willy nilly 🙄
Not all women (myself included) are absolute warriors and are able to just power through it on 2 paracetamol !

You're right women have been giving birth since time began. However, the world has moved on. Women routinely died from child birth and it was just one of those things. It is now 2020. Medicine and science have moved on. What's the point in medical research if we're all just going to say "women have been doing it for years".
We wouldn't allow people to get their head hacked off in front of an audience anymore like years ago so why would we allow women to be in agony when they don't need to be

With my first I was aggressively encouraged not to have an epidural. 36 hours later and excruciating pain my little girl was born. With my second my lovely midwife asked me if I’d thought about pain relief and I asked for epidural and she booked me in straight away and said she doesn’t understand why everyone doesn’t have one! 36 hours later and no pain whatsoever my second little girl was born!

I don't think YABU but I do think many are missing a valid point: no, it's not too late to have an epidural unless you hit 10cm but epidurals impact on your ability to give birth safely.

Epidurals impede the mother's ability to push increasing the need for medical intervention (forceps, venteuse, emergency C section) they have a negative effect on the baby, effectively knocking it out for hours on end and interferes with feeding.

It also makes mothers more prone to tearing, are known to cause the worst headache of your life and can give you long term back pain.

Have I had an epidural? Yes.
Am I glad I did? Hell yes! (1st baby, 12hr labour).
Do I understand WHY midwives are reticent about epidurals? Also yes.

If you want to feel "vindicated" I say knock yourself out but at least be clear on the very good reasons why midwives are not fans of epidurals because there is a lot of science behind it.

I'm not saying it's ok to withhold pain relief, especially for 1st births as they are known to be drawn out and complicated and I'm fully aware some women just can't "do" childbirth but let's keep the argument fair shall we because we are bloody lucky to have our healthcare system and they are doing the best they can in ever difficult circumstances.

I’m another one who was refused pain relief with my DD. DH had to go get a midwife, to ask her for gas & air. Her response was to look baffled and when she finally came to examine me, she found me rocking on all fours and exclaimed “oh, you are in labour!” No shit!!
It took an age, and several requests, to get an epidural.
Being disbelieved, and the general feeling that I was being over-dramatic, was unhelpful when I was already in pain and feeling very frightened & vulnerable.

@Shandied yes, women have and can die in childbirth, but that's nothing to do with pain relief. Our bodies are designed for birth. Is it painful? Yes, of course it is, but instantly forgotten as soon as baby is born and no after effects.

Oh and I've had 3 so yes, I do know.

I was given an epidural at 10cm

Instantly forgotten with no after affects? I don't think so!